And so the Layoffs begin

[Lone Eagle 839]

Since you brought it up, I received 2 notices from my boss today.

 

1. My BC/BS insurance just DOUBLED. Instead of $275 per payday, I now pay $550 per payday, and there "may be future increases to cover costs". Thought that was going down? That's HALF my fucking paycheck just for HC insurance. Oh....and that's the cheaper high deductable plan. Low deductable on a family of 4 is over $1400 per month now.

 

2. BC/BS of MT just sold out to Health Care Services Corp in Chicago.....who has bought 18 other large insurers so far. Say hello to your "insurance exchange".

 

I also found out I won't be getting a raise this year, and next year doesn't look promising, either.

[VR762Shooter 838]

Don't let them fool you. The same BS healthcare crap being passed in MA made us the most expensive place for healthcare. insurance rates went up, prescription rates went up, availability of doctors went down. When they passed the bill in MA I was paying $30 per prescription for insulin, no insurance. I now without insurance would pay $500, pay $70 with. They have no way to fix this but to "socialize" the healthcare programs. This is what the next step in Obamacare will be. Force prices to skyrocket until people say "well we need a national health insurance like Canada because these rates are out of control"

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

This is the start

 

 

Lets see how it ends

[csspecs 1,987]

Hmm seems the market wanted change rather then hope and change.

 

Your not going to see mass layoffs until parts of the law go into effect, which correct me if I'm wrong, is after the 2014 elections (odd how that was planned). Currently your seeing the ripples of the air in front of the stone, the splash and waves come later.

[BuffetDestroyer 969]

..... But to play fiscal conservative advocate, medicare reimbursement is an entitlement, a form of subsidy, that, some would say, has allowed healthcare costs to artificially inflate. Cutting it and shifting the difference to the company or patient and letting the market bear it out is more of a conservative move.

 

I'm a conservative too, but I get really tired of Medicare and Social Security being called "entitlements".

We have all paid into those programs all of our lives through payroll deductions.

 

The only true "entitlements" are Welfare and Medicare benefits paid to recipients who did not pay into it .

When benefit recipients pay nothing into a program and then reap the rewards, then fine that's an "entitlement" if you like to call it that.

 

Why the hell would I not expect to get a benefit for all of the money I paid into it though?

 

Govt. can do away with all of the "entitlements", just give me all of my money back I paid into those programs with interest.

 

Anything less is theft.

 

The problem is Social Security and Medicare are a Ponzi Scheme run by the government. The people that pay into them today fund the people receiving benefits today - there is no money for those that haven't retired.

 

As more Americans reach that age and are living longer to receive more and more benefits, the money being paid isn't even coming from payroll deductions, but borrowing from foreign countries.

 

This is a big chunk of our deficit since the pay-outs far exceed the pay-ins.

 

The IRS could confiscate 100% of every single American's income for a year and not be able to pay off what we owe in the overall deficit. But even if we balance the budget tomorrow (which won't happen for at least 4 more years now), we would still have a growing deficit due to the interest on our current debt.

Edited November 9, 2012 by BuffetDestroyer

[Spartacus 1,619]

>>The problem is Social Security and Medicare are a Ponzi Scheme run by the government.

 

Yep, I know. I'm not really expecting to get my money back.

As I said, theft.

 

I just get pissed every time those programs we paid into are referred to as "entitlements" as

though we are some how at fault for expecting anything for the money taken from us.

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

The IRS could confiscate 100% of every single American's income for a year and not be able to pay off what we owe in the overall deficit. But even if we balance the budget tomorrow (which won't happen for at least 4 more years now), we would still have a growing deficit due to the interest on our current debt.

 

And why are we borrowing it ?

[BuffetDestroyer 969]

The IRS could confiscate 100% of every single American's income for a year and not be able to pay off what we owe in the overall deficit. But even if we balance the budget tomorrow (which won't happen for at least 4 more years now), we would still have a growing deficit due to the interest on our current debt.

 

And why are we borrowing it ?

 

Socialism. The re-distribution of wealth along with the dissolution of the family to create total dependence on the government - this is what Marx and Engels sought to "fundamentally transform" a country into their utopia. So far, it hasn't worked out for any other countries that have tried it.

 

"We do not have to destroy America with missiles; America will destroy itself from within." - Nikita Khrushchev

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

The IRS could confiscate 100% of every single American's income for a year and not be able to pay off what we owe in the overall deficit. But even if we balance the budget tomorrow (which won't happen for at least 4 more years now), we would still have a growing deficit due to the interest on our current debt.

 

And why are we borrowing it ?

 

Socialism. The re-distribution of wealth along with the dissolution of the family to create total dependence on the government - this is what Marx and Engels sought to "fundamentally transform" a country into their utopia. So far, it hasn't worked out for any other countries that have tried it.

 

"We do not have to destroy America with missiles; America will destroy itself from within." - Nikita Khrushchev

 

The government should be printing the money, not borrowing from the federal reserve.

[BuffetDestroyer 969]

Since I have one of his quotes from the 1950's and 1960's, here is another that is very applicable:

 

"We can't expect the American People to jump from Capitalism to Communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of Socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have Communism."

 

- Nikita Krushchev

Edited November 10, 2012 by BuffetDestroyer

[Zombiehunter762 376]

I'm glad I put all my 401K in a Money Market.

This happened last time this pos was elected. People just don't get it. Criminal world here I come.

Look at the stock market tank.

Here is a list of companies laying off.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/how-many-businesses-have-announced-closings-or-lay-offs-since-obama-won-a-second-term/

Edited November 10, 2012 by MfWiC

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

I'm glad I put all my 401K in a Money Market.

This happened last time this pos was elected. People just don't get it. Criminal world here I come.

Look at the stock market tank.

Here is a list of companies laying off.

http://www.theblaze....-a-second-term/

 

Got to be careful with the internet info. The one about coal plants has been know for a few years now. It' is not the election, it is EPA laws coming into effect Jan 2013. Another story on CNN http://money.cnn.com/2012/11/09/news/companies/coal-layoffs-obama/index.html?iid=HP_Highlight is BS as well. That company has been run into the ground by bad leadership that knew about the 2013 rule and never adjusted.

[TO THE FLOOR IN A 63 121]

With all the money you rich fuckers have, because obviously you do as GOP supporters, what is a little unemployment, healthcare or a little confication of your guns and money for the common good. Put up some money for those who don't have any. That will go a lot further then your pissing and moaning for the next 4 years. And if you decide to do the latter don't forget that people are tired of hearing it and will probably vote against the republican party next time too. I have been a die hard republican for the last 30 years but what did I ever get??? Nothing but lip service. But I and others are getting tired of hearing the fucking moaning. So you're looking at 8 more years of democratic rule. STFU already and let it pass quietly.

Edited November 10, 2012 by TO THE FLOOR

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

With all the money you rich fuckers have, because obviously you do as GOP supporters, what is a little unemployment, healthcare or a little confication of your guns and money for the common good. Put up some money for those who don't have any. That will go a lot further then your pissing and moaning for the next 4 years. And if you decide to do the latter don't forget that people are tired of hearing it and will probably vote against the republican party next time too. I have been a die hard republican for the last 30 years but what did I ever get??? Nothing but lip service. But I and others are getting tired of hearing the fucking moaning. So you're looking at 8 more years of democratic rule. STFU already and let it pass quietly.

 

 

Just make sure you lock your door dipshit

[Voltia 375]

Why should I put up money for those that don't have any?

 

Capitalism says it's their fault. Socialism says it's my duty, and nobody's fault.

 

The USA is capitalist, thus, get a job.

[thebuns1 4,323]

With all the money you rich fuckers have, because obviously you do as GOP supporters, what is a little unemployment, healthcare or a little confication of your guns and money for the common good. Put up some money for those who don't have any. That will go a lot further then your pissing and moaning for the next 4 years. And if you decide to do the latter don't forget that people are tired of hearing it and will probably vote against the republican party next time too. I have been a die hard republican for the last 30 years but what did I ever get??? Nothing but lip service. But I and others are getting tired of hearing the fucking moaning. So you're looking at 8 more years of democratic rule. STFU already and let it pass quietly.

 

Your suggesting I give up shit I've earned, to some fuck thats too lazy to go out and earn it himself? Not hardly. Its this type of logic that has gotten us in this shitmess we're currently in with all these leech fucks and entitlement assholes. And I'll bitch as much as I feel I have to. I could give a shit less about how you, or others feel about it.

 

P.S. And its your vote, feel free to waste it if you like.

 

ETA: Im all for helping others, so long as they are willing to help themselves first.

Edited November 10, 2012 by Captain Hero

[Zombiehunter762 376]

Here's some more:

In the past 48 hours, these companies reported layoffs

 

Westinghouse - 200

...

Research in Motion Ltd - 3,000

Lightyear Network Solutions - 15

Providence Journal - 23

Hawker Beechcraft - 410

Boeing 61,000

CVPH Medical Center - 17

US Cellular - 980

Commerzbank - 6,000

Iberia - 7,000

Momentive Performance Materials - 150

Brake Parts - 75

Gameforge Berlin - 20

Vestas Wind Systems 1,700

Husqvarna - 390

Ericsson - 14,000

SRA International - 222

PerkinElmer - 75

Majestic Star Casino and Hotel - 80

Center for Hospice NY - 80

Bristol-Myers - 500

Lower Bucks Hospital - 500

Oce North America - 9

Corning United Blood Services Gulf - 150 Atlantic Lottery Corporation - 16

Welch Allyn - 10% of manufacturing work force Dana Holding - 12% of work force

Stryker - approx 5%

Boston Scientific - Unspecific amount

Medtronic - 1,000

Smith & Nephew - 80

Abbott Labs - 550

Covidien - 600

Kinetic Concepts - 300

St. Jude - 300

Hill Rom - 200

Darden Restaurants - 3%

JANCOA - 350

Kroger - 30

ING - 2,350

Caterpillar - 4,000 (Decatur plant)

Alcatel-Lucent - 5,000

Umatilla Chemical 34

Rocketdyne...100

Pepsi - 8,700

Bank of America 30,000

Lockheed Martin... 123,000

 

All announced layoffs over the past 48 hours.

 

This is just the BEGINNING

 

BY THE WAY WHY DON'T YOU STFU. You must like redistribution, welfare, sit on your ass and live off of others.

When it comes down to it.

People like me will survive and take your shit. Remember that dipshit.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

With all the money you rich fuckers have, because obviously you do as GOP supporters, what is a little unemployment, healthcare or a little confication of your guns and money for the common good. Put up some money for those who don't have any. That will go a lot further then your pissing and moaning for the next 4 years. And if you decide to do the latter don't forget that people are tired of hearing it and will probably vote against the republican party next time too. I have been a die hard republican for the last 30 years but what did I ever get??? Nothing but lip service. But I and others are getting tired of hearing the fucking moaning. So you're looking at 8 more years of democratic rule. STFU already and let it pass quietly.

[BK201 8]

you guys thoroughly frighten me with this.

 

 

PREPARE FOR THE SHIT TO HIT.

[nlacy 692]

Oh shit, it's even hitting pro sports!

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/8610888/los-angeles-lakers-fire-coach-mike-brown

[Lone Eagle 839]

you guys thoroughly frighten me with this.

 

 

PREPARE FOR THE SHIT TO HIT.

 

It's already hit the fan. You're getting the back-splatter.

 

With all the money you rich fuckers have, because obviously you do as GOP supporters, what is a little unemployment, healthcare or a little confication of your guns and money for the common good. Put up some money for those who don't have any. That will go a lot further then your pissing and moaning for the next 4 years. And if you decide to do the latter don't forget that people are tired of hearing it and will probably vote against the republican party next time too. I have been a die hard republican for the last 30 years but what did I ever get??? Nothing but lip service. But I and others are getting tired of hearing the fucking moaning. So you're looking at 8 more years of democratic rule. STFU already and let it pass quietly.

 

I did...it was called "charitable donation", not forced Socialism. And if you want us to shut the fuck up, come make us. If you want our guns, MOLON LABE!!!!

[Koljec 37]

OK, in the short amount of time I have I will cite one good example. The new lead paint regulation, our company and many others quit offering external house painting as a service. The hoops you have to jump through to paint a house are unbelievable, not to mention the punishments and fines that would completely put us out of business if one of their rules was found to be broken even by accident. It is no longer worth the risk. And yes, fear of what is to come is a huge factor when considering to expand or hire new employees. I could certainly understand a business scaling back(read firing) due to the 'fear' of what may come in this term. It is pretty easy to understand how this president is not friendly to business, for most. If you did not vote for Obama then there must have been an even more progressive candidate on the ballot in your state, based solely on your comments in this thread.

 

Understood. Is this the Renovation, Repair, and Painting Program?

 

I'm in Delaware. The only election that matters here is the primary, and you basically have to register democrat to participate. I had no one to vote for in the general/Presidential election. Obama and Romney were both bad but for very different reasons.

 

..... But to play fiscal conservative advocate, medicare reimbursement is an entitlement, a form of subsidy, that, some would say, has allowed healthcare costs to artificially inflate. Cutting it and shifting the difference to the company or patient and letting the market bear it out is more of a conservative move.

 

I'm a conservative too, but I get really tired of Medicare and Social Security being called "entitlements".

We have all paid into those programs all of our lives through payroll deductions.

 

The only true "entitlements" are Welfare and Medicare benefits paid to recipients who did not pay into it .

When benefit recipients pay nothing into a program and then reap the rewards, then fine that's an "entitlement" if you like to call it that.

 

Why the hell would I not expect to get a benefit for all of the money I paid into it though?

 

Govt. can do away with all of the "entitlements", just give me all of my money back I paid into those programs with interest.

 

Anything less is theft.

 

Fair point. The only thing I'll say is that I take the same payroll deduction hits as the guy who smokes and drinks and will need $2,000,000 worth of liver and cancer care. Meanwhile, I take generally good care of myself and shouldn't run up the same bill. So even those contributing can take a disproportionate share.

 

I'd like that money back, too. Too much runs on it, though.

[VR762Shooter 838]

Oh shit, it's even hitting pro sports!

http://espn.go.com/l...oach-mike-brown

HA!

[Spartacus 1,619]

With all the money you rich fuckers have, because obviously you do as GOP supporters, what is a little unemployment, healthcare or a little confication of your guns and money for the common good. Put up some money for those who don't have any. That will go a lot further then your pissing and moaning for the next 4 years. And if you decide to do the latter don't forget that people are tired of hearing it and will probably vote against the republican party next time too. I have been a die hard republican for the last 30 years but what did I ever get??? Nothing but lip service. But I and others are getting tired of hearing the fucking moaning. So you're looking at 8 more years of democratic rule. STFU already and let it pass quietly.

 

I don't have much money and I don't want anybody else's money.

And I voted Republican because socialism is wrong and it doesn't work.

 

It's no secret we're getting screwed by both parties, so I certainly feel your frustration on that.

 

You seem to be advocating that we all just bend over and take it with no complaints.

That I don't understand at all.

[Zombiehunter762 376]

Just set back and watch the Liberal Commie's destroy each other. Mean while hurting the rest of us.

 

[TO THE FLOOR IN A 63 121]

You seem to be advocating that we all just bend over and take it with no complaints.

That I don't understand at all

 

That is one way to look at it. Again the country is split almost 50-50 between the lesser of two evils. Always seems to happen that way but if you think about it every other person you look at voted different then you/me. Now I am not advocating giving someone who doesn't work something I'm not getting but there are plenty of people out there who don't make $250,000 a year. I was a city fireman in Denver for 20 years...I made 40k a year...so don't tell me I didn't earn that...But the GOP doesn't speak for those in that income bracket. (or for women who want a choice over their bodies..abortion for that matter) . But now I am a small business owner and attorney. I bill $250 an hour so feel free to do the math. Obama has already stated he plans to tax people in my income bracket to help pay for others so I am just going to work less. But I don't believe he is going to trample my 2nd amemdment rights and I think Romeny would have blundered that one to placate the media. That is what is important to me. And I have been hearing about the New World Order for 25 years. As for taxes...every ;year the national debt goes up....we will never get out from under that. so yes maybe I am advocating just bending over and taking it...all these politicans are crooks so getting behind the guy the majority of people voted for and make good on what this country can be and people can do instead of pissing and moaning again. It didn't bring us anywhere over the last 4 years and frankly it hurt us with the debt rating which Bush had raised something like 11 times but obama could not do it once.... Or is it just something about a black man being president???.

[Syndicate 812]

I need to make my "Will Hook for Ammo" sign soon

[slippingaway 89]

This is the start

 

 

Lets see how it ends

I was shocked when I looked at that graph, until I realized it didn't have a broken line to indicate that it didn't start at zero. That's pretty skewed, considering we are talking about 400-500 points of change when the scale is in the thousands

At the risk of sounding ignorant:

I am an employee, not a business owner. I had insurance, until 2 months ago when my boss approached all the staff saying, "Well, the taxes are getting too high, we are bleeding out money. The more we make the more they take and it's hard to keep going. I can let one of you (four) go, or I can drop the insurance until Obamacare kicks in and they force me to carry it. Or, we can fold up. We still might have to later, but for now, are you guys okay with dropping insurance."

We all agreed. A week later the secretary was in a bike wreck and had to have a lot of medical work done.

 

Sure, Health Insurance is expensive as hell, but the problem is because Healthcare is expensive as hell. Cotton balls that cost 2 dollars each, 2 Tylenol, that will be $6. Sighning in to an ER will set you back, what, at least $300?

[Redhunter2486 22]

If you think the healthcare system is inefficient now just wait until the gov takes it over- theres nothing the gov does efficientley cept spend money and vote in pay raises for themselves and laws that they are exempt of(obama care)

[ctd 20]

I don't live in the USA so I probably don't full understand the issue.

 

I live in a country were in most cases you don't pay for the hospital and most people only pay a token amount for normal doctors visits and proscriptions.

NZ does this by the government acting as the insurance company. They also own the hospitals.

From what I understand(please correct me if I'm wrong) they way that is being talked about for the USA is that you will be forced to use a privet insurance company to insure against paying bills at a privet hospital.

I personally be think that it is a basic human right for a person to have access to the best healthcare that is available in there society.

 

With that background out of the way

 

From what I can tell all around the world when people are forced to buy insurance from private providers the cost goes up and up and up. If the medical insurers could possibly have a financial interest in the hospitals as well I would think it would go up even faster.

As to cost-already some of the % of total income that have been talked about in this thread to cover medical insurance are 3/4 what I pay in total tax(income+sales+excise) and I'm in the top tax bracket.

This makes me think that the system being proposed in the USA is far from the best for the people of the USA.

 

 

I'm just trying to understand what's going on please don't be to harsh on me

[lbsrdi 1,078]

"...it is a basic human right for a person to have access to the best healthcare that is available in there society."

 

The key word there is 'access.' Everyone has the same access. Pay for your own healthcare,I will pay for mine. I do not believe that free healthcare is a right. Apparently I am in the minority, that does not mean that I am wrong.