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armedpacifist

Need some help-FTF- bolt riding over top of rounds

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Hey All,

Quick question. My bolt is riding over the top of the round every so often causing a FTF. I polished my bolt and some other parts, but i really don't think I took any material off. It seems to me that it has to be one of three things:

1) I really did take some material off the bolt, and now the bolt doesn't hang down low enough to push the next round into place every time. Could anyone with calipers give me a reading from their own 7.62 bolt, bottom to top?

 

2) I did take a very very slight bit too much off my mag catch. On my metal mags, they don't move up and down. I have some plastic 30 rounders that can move a little bit up and down, maybe 1/32".

 

3) I bought 4 plastic 30 round mags, a 20 rnd steel and a 10 rnd steel mag off somebody on Craigslist for $40. Maybe he was selling them cheap because they weren't good mags?

 

I ground the underside of the feed lips on the plastic mags so that the top round on each side would sit a little bit higher. That seems to take care of those. I really wanted to check the bolt dimensions before I started dremeling my metal mags too though.

 

Thanks in advance for any help!

post-42805-0-47598100-1354684041_thumb.jpg

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Did you file the mag catch?

 

I'm betting that you took too much off of it.

 

Do this: push the mag in as far as it will go, effectively taking away any slack or play. Then, cycle rounds. The gun should feed properly. Then, pull at the mag, increasing the distance between bullets and bolt. Rounds should now jam.

 

If it is indeed the mag catch, then replace it. RAM tactical sells little kits with easy to form rivets that you can squish using a little c-clamp when you use their provided ball bearing. They also include a screw version of the rivet in each kit, and each kit costs a couple bucks. Use a regular AKM mag latch when you replace it. It will be the perfect length right off the bat.

 

Tell us how the magazine push/pull test works out so we know a little better.

 

Also try some actual mags. Go buy a couple steel 30 rounders and see if those also fail. There is always a chance that he fitted his mags to an out of spec rifle.

 

P.S. Why would you EVER polish the bolt on a Saiga RIFLE? Let me guess, you used a piece of shit Tapco G2, and it was binding the carrier, making it feel gritty, and even halting the carrier when you eased it forward? It was the hammer face which should have been reprofiled if anything. Tapco G2 hammers are out of spec.

 

PPS the bolt measured 22.97mm. It was probably 30mm though, as that would make more sense. This is on the most worn bolt that I have.

Edited by Agent Lemon

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Oh and do a better job of explaining the malfunction please.

 

You say that the bolt rides over the round causing a FTF.

 

Do you mean that the bolt goes OVER the cartridge entirely, and goes home on an empty chamber?

 

Or, do you mean that you just get some kind of FTF and the round only gets half chambered? Because this one can happen if you use the BHO with the trigger moved forward and you accidentally press on it and it catches the bolt after the bolt chambers half a round.

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Thanks for the replies!

It's a 7.62 I converted with the G2. It was totally reliable before conversion. And yes , It was incredibly gritty going over the bolt carrier so I polished all the parts that contacted eachother. Exactly the problem you described with the G2.

 

When it FTF, the bolt gets just barely over the round before it starts pushing it forward. The round starts to seat but can't pop up once it gets past the lips of the mag, so the bolt jams the bullet in place at and angle.

 

Our bolts measure exactly the same (22.987mm on mine), so I'm hoping it's pointing in the direction of the mag catch. I was doing the magazine push pull test you prescribed- it made the difference between jamming and not jamming with the plastic mags that don't fit in there very tight. On the (2) steel mags I have it makes less of a difference, and they are more prone to the FTF. But on all of them, when it is sending the bullet home, it is just barely catching it and it seems like an extra 1/16" of contact would be really nice.

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Okay, if the magazine test made a difference between jamming and not, then the issue is very likely to be the mag catch. This is relatively easy to fix if you just replace the mag catch.

 

Acquire an AKM mag catch lever. Just the lever. Then acquire a few of these- http://ramsfs.mybigcommerce.com/catch-hardware/

 

I say to get a few because you never know if you mess em up or not, and the cost is small enough to justify getting a few just in case.

 

Once you have both mag catch and rivet set on hand, make note of which way the spring in the mag catch assembly is oriented. Take a few pictures maybe so that you don't forget. Drill out the rivet holding the current mag catch, and let it out slowly so that you can look at how the spring is oriented. After all that is removed, put the spring in there the correct way, and put the AKM latch in there. Use a small C-clamp and the provided ball bearing to form the new rivet. It will be a pain in the dick to get this new rivet in through all the holes, so have some appropriate sized punches, and possibly a second pair of hands available.

 

If you still have issues after the mag catch is replaced, then the next suspect part is magazine, or possibly bullet guide. Get a few various steel magazines first to test out, as those would be easier to verify.

 

If you want to continue using the G2 without it being gritty, compare its hammer face to that of the original. Match the hammer profile of the G2 to the original, and it should stop snagging as much. Reprofiling can be a pain also, and is relatively easy to mess up, so be careful if you do this.

 

In the future, modify the cheap, easily replaceable 20 dollar part, not the bolt, which would require the pain in the ass of possibly re-headspacing the barrel if you were to change it. And it doesn't cost 20 bucks either. This should be a no brainer.

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I installed a Ram tactical catch and was a little more careful when filing it. Now 5 of my six mags work right and I could probably file it a little bit more but i will wait till I have some new eastern bloc mags to test fit. The one mag that still doesn't work was a cheaper plastic 30, so I think it may be out of spec. I used the nut and bolt supplied with the catch instead of the rivet, at least until I can get to the range to test this out. I'm looking forward to having this thing done and reliable like an ak ought to be. I can't tell you how many times I've thought might sell this and just get an AR in 7.62.

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Chances are you screwed something up in the conversion. Umm do you have a bullet guide installed?? Is it the right one and installed correctly? Most people on this forum, me included use the g2 trigger without any issues for thousands upon thousands of rounds. if you try all those mags and your rifle still has issues post some pics of your conversion and we should be able to get the issue rectified.

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I installed a Ram tactical catch and was a little more careful when filing it. Now 5 of my six mags work right and I could probably file it a little bit more but i will wait till I have some new eastern bloc mags to test fit. The one mag that still doesn't work was a cheaper plastic 30, so I think it may be out of spec.

 

When you say that the mag doesn't work, do you mean that it doesn't fit, or doesn't cycle? I have a Tapco mag, and it was out of spec and needed to be filed down before it could be locked in the gun.

 

Also you don't absolutely have to use a tactical mag release, as regular AK ones work in it just right. RAM tactical has these little kits with just rivets/screws if you ever need some.

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That magazine still allows the bolt to go over the rounds. Now that magazines are getting hard to find, it may be a while before I get my hands on a new metal 30 rounder. i think I like the tactical catch, but I'll have to play with it a bit before I know for sure.

 

i made my own bullet guide from gas pipe. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the problem- the guy that handles transfers for me has a krebs ak and I took measurements on his BG. His and mine had the same specs, miraculously.

 

Thanks for the help. I just need to get out there and shoot it to see how it does. Snow is starting to build up in the nat'l forest where I go, 15 minutes from my house. Luckily, membership at the local gun range is one thing that Santa is bringing me.

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