Minkman 24 Posted January 31, 2013 Report Share Posted January 31, 2013 (edited) I got this circle 10 mag in a trade with a forum member ... I love how it looks and feels but I don't love the fact that after two nights of using a little dremel tool (no dremel)and filing my brains out -- still wont lock. At first it totally wouldn't fit -- I shaved the back and tonight I'm currently 98% in ... I suspect I'm doing somehing wrong/not enough with the front ... I'm pretty frusturated ... I've shaved a little here and there on all the lips and corners and still can't get this bastard in... I don't know why it won't lock ... The back is now not the problem (it has clearence) here's some pics. Did I ruin this mag ? Edited January 31, 2013 by Minkman Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sim_Player 1,939 Posted January 31, 2013 Report Share Posted January 31, 2013 (edited) If it reliably feeds once you get it working, then you HAVE NOT ruined it (no matter how ugly it may look. ). Try comparing the shape and angles with an existing mag that works. The pics are kind of hard to see. How about a side profile? Trial and error. It's all part of the hobby. Waffle mags look sweet, wish I owned some. Edited January 31, 2013 by Sim_Player Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marc 147 Posted January 31, 2013 Report Share Posted January 31, 2013 What other mags have you used in the rifle? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sean8642 77 Posted January 31, 2013 Report Share Posted January 31, 2013 (edited) Here is one thread on those mags, not sure if there is any extra help in there for you. http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/49591-circle-10-223-mags-wont-fit/ And http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/75711-we-need-a-tutorial-to-fit-bulgarian-circle-10/ Which has a link for: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_4_80/141765_Trunnion_ears_on__223_saiga_rifles___Modded_to_fit_Bulgy_circle_10_5_56_mags_.html Edited January 31, 2013 by sean8642 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted January 31, 2013 Report Share Posted January 31, 2013 Will you turn into a BLACK HOLE when you implode??? Or just vanish into nothingness??? That is MY question! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
physicsnerd 139 Posted January 31, 2013 Report Share Posted January 31, 2013 Into what kind of rifle are you trying to use these? Is it an unconverted Saiga, converted Saiga, etc? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TARE 47 Posted January 31, 2013 Report Share Posted January 31, 2013 Some rifles have less clearance between the mag release and the reciever, I have seen it especially with MAK-90s and Saiga sporters. Sometimes the top of the release needs to be leveled out or opened up. Of course you can overdo it and the best practice is to file the cheapest part first. On a MAK90 I have, the top of the catch was higher on one side than the other, some light fileing later and it was more accepting of various mags and without extra wiggle. A saiga or two I've sold would not accept any mag other than the factory five they shipped with. These had to be opened up to accept standard magazines, again the outcome didnt produce unwanted wiggle as a side effect. YMMV Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2013 My saiga .223 convert. I have the CSS guide and tapco galil's work perfectly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2013 (edited) Here's pics ... I'm thinking I need to flatten the back end above the lug more ? Another hour spent and it's now 99.9% in there but god this is a pita .. Thanks for all replys ! Hopefuly these can help you guys help me? Ughh Closeup So here's where it sits as of now .... Edited February 1, 2013 by Minkman Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 1, 2013 Report Share Posted February 1, 2013 (edited) Stop grinding on the rear latch. The front feed lips of your magazines are hitting the bottom of the front trunnion locking lugs. This prevents the rear of the mag from rocking in fully. Relieve some material from the top of the feed lips and the mags will snap in.This is Pyzik's image. Remove some material with a flat file where you see the exposed metal reinforcement here. Watch the mag as you insert it - you will see this area pressing up against the underside of the trunnion.The Saiga and Bulgarian .223 rifles have different trunnion lug heights. Otherwise they are virtually the same. You shoud rarely have to file either of the mag latches for the Saiga. I also suggest watching this video I made a while back that covers fitting Polish mags to the Saiga. The Polish and Bulgarian mags are virtually the same as far as this is concerned. Edited February 1, 2013 by mancat Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chunga 31 Posted February 1, 2013 Report Share Posted February 1, 2013 (edited) Mancat gives good advice there. Try to fit the mag in and use a dental pick or something similar to see what it's hitting that prevents it from locking. Edited February 1, 2013 by chunga Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 1, 2013 Report Share Posted February 1, 2013 (edited) Another problem with messing with the rear latch... You may end up with the incorrect feed geometry and have problems with the bolt stripping rounds from the mag. As you have your mag currently seated in your photos, the small casting line at the very top of the magazine, just below the receiver, should sit flush and parallel with the lower edge of the receiver when the mag is seated. Looking at your photos, your mag is not anywhere near the correct feed angle. Currently, your feeding angle is too steep, and the leading cartridge rim will sit too low with the magazine seated at such an angle. This can allow the bolt to pass over the rim, and fail to strip the leading round. Note the alignment of the top casting line in this SLR-106 pistol - flush with and parallel to the bottom edge of the receiver: Edited February 1, 2013 by mancat Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 So i fucked it up ? Damn Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 (edited) I saw your video thanks man but I still can't get this son of a bitch in. If I fucked it up I'll take the loss .. Here's better pics Edited February 2, 2013 by Minkman Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I dunno, hard to tell from the pics. What you are looking for is the mag contacting the underside of this part. As you rotate the mag upwards, you'll notice that the front feed lips of the mag are touching the bottom of these. These are the trunnion locking lugs. They are larger on the Saiga .223 then they are on the Bulgarian .223 rifles. As I said, this stops the mags from rotating further upward in the front, and therefore stops the rear latch from engaging. Did you try to modify the front of the mag here in any way? If not, you're probably not going to get the mag to snap in properly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Yeah I was girding the front feed lips ... Im going to try and finish it tomorrow. So I need to make sure the lips aren't contacting the circled area correct ? Thanks for the help by the way man . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 No, you want the feed lips to have light contact on the underside, because they assist in keeping the mag secure and preventing wobble, but if you pay close attention you'll notice that they are probably contacting the trunnion lugs too early. That's why the rear latch won't rotate fully upward into the receiver.The feed lips should only contact the underside of the lugs once the rear latch is secure. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Ok well after reading your post I feel better ! I just spent another hour on it and right where you told me ... I was still having no luck so right when I was about to throw in the towel I did one more run and got her to lock in !!! It wasn't a firm lock in like my other mags , it's very tight and the lock in isn't very pronounced but that sucker is in there tight as hell here's my pics what do you think ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 you may need to take a hair more off... you want it TIGHT but not "holy fuck, that's too fucking tight" tight... If you re satisfied with HOW it locks and feels... go with it like it is!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Other side Locked in Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I'm just worried if I shaved too much off the back or screwed it up ... Don't wanna have a 5.56 green tip KB lol How do I take the baseplate off the mag and get all the shit out of it ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 (edited) Yeah if the mag is too tight, what will happen is that those front feed lip reinforcements can get bent when you lock the mag in hard. If they bend outwards, the rounds may feed loosely and you can get double feeds. You actually want the mag to have a slight amount of side to side play when fully inserted. Not wobbly, but enough that you can wiggle it a tiny bit. I suggest just taking a little bit of material off of that feed lip area at a time with a flat file until the lock-in is gentle and stops sounding like snapping a branch in two. edit: I can see by your image that the mag release is not fully engaging yet. You probably need to take a little bit more material off of the feed lipsany way. The release will engage fully as the mag continues to "loosen up" at the front end. You take the baseplate off by pressing in the small tab, then sliding the plate off. Edited February 2, 2013 by mancat Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 3, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Thanks mancat once again Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 3, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Thanks man I think I need to get a better thing to file those metal parts on the lip down ... Can sandpaper do it ? Like 60 grit ? I think my problem is my grinding wheel(some big wheel thing it's not as coarse as the dremel tips) isn't strong enough to get that metal down so should I get sandpaper ? I see exactly what your talking about and you've helped me a lot and once again I appreciate it !! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TacSat 90 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Had a similar problem. you are hitting on the cross bar right above the mag. that needs alittle grinding. it drove me nuts. on of my 223s needed that the other did not . Other sideLocked in 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Grinding wheel? No, just use a regular flat file across both front feed lips - one that's about 5/8" wide or so. You will get a uniform, clean surface that way. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TacSat 90 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) .. Edited February 3, 2013 by TacSat Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 4, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2013 Okay now after more grinding it clicks in ... It's tight but I can move it (wobble) if I try (it's not a holy shit this is tight) ... It's more secure then my favorite tapcos . But after all the grinding I did everywhere (I filed down the rear above the lug on back of mag to where it's flat per dinzags instructions) I'm paranoid that I couldn't have done this properly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Minkman 24 Posted February 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Guys if tapco galil's fit with no issues .. should 35rd steel galil's be ok ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 they will fit, but feeding is hit or miss with the steel galils. they sit slightly lower than tapco galils and tend to either stovepipe or allow the bolt to pass over the rounds. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.