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Dorner Gun battle video - watch it before they remove it


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Good thing Dorner didn't have any accomplices. Those police put themselves in a position to be ambushed and rolled up. My platoon Sergeant would have ripped me a new asshole if my platoon acted like they did. It's the same in most police videos I've seen.The cops are so focused on their objective that they fail to pull security on their rear and flanks, they bunch up and cluster. I think it has to do with their belief that no one would attack them other than the one they are looking for. Perhaps that is true so long as they deal with lone wolves but sooner or later someone is going to organize and then they are going to lose a lot of cops. If you are going to dress like a soldier and carry a soldier's weapons you had better learn how to fight like a soldier too because some day someone is going to take you up on your offer. Just my opinion.

 

Funny you should say this. It's exactly what I was thinking. The media reported at one point during the confrontation that police had basically stopped checking/stopping any cars, as they were too involved in the firefight. All it would've taken would be one accomplice to pull up at their rear and catch a large number of them offguard. What of Dorner had placed a hostage inside the cabin in anticipation of a standoff, to use as a decoy - e.g. "stay in this cabin, I'll be watching you, and if the cops don't shoot you I will." - while he got into a position that would be at the rear of where the police were most likely to set up?

 

It could've gone really bad for the cops, especially with the amount of people that seemingly supported Dorner. They were saying that people were out with signs on the way to the cabin showing support for this guy.

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I notice at 0.12 into the tape you will see an officer on the right side hugging a building on his right then toss a smoke/gas/incendiary device at the cabin resulting in the huge cloud of white smoke and starting the fire . Judging by the amount of white smoke in only a few seconds says WP is what was thrown and it will burn about anything ,and WP is military issue only .

HC white smoke, NOT WP!!! The burst radius of a WP grenade is 45 meters and must be used with a rifle grenade adapter. You ain't going to throw a WP grenade outside it's burst radius! The only way to throw a WP grenade is drop it from a helicopter.

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When Waco started I remember seeing the video of the assault and being so mad at those people for shooting cops.

 

But the more I learned about it the more mad I got at the government. Anybody who thinks they were "asking for it" needs a history lesson.

 

Dorner wanted to go out in a blaze of glory, and he got his blaze. Even some glory from some seriously stupid people. But in the end, asshole removed from society.

 

Which is not to say the LAPD isn't also a bunch of assholes.

Edited by Darth Saigus
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While there's no way to justify his actions, Dorner pulled off a 4 for 1 which should give some people a few things to think about if they ever intend to go door to door taking guns. MT Pred, Wako was a clusterfuck from the beginning. My Bro is retired LEO/SWAT and we've got a friend that's Secret Service-both hate ATF. Koresh could have been singled out and picked up numerous times outside the compound. I'd like to know the whole story on what pissed Dorner off, to have a list of 40+ to go after and be prepped to do it...this guy was pissed, really pissed. The fact that he didn't kill the two in the first hide seems to indicate that his anger was focussed, not just bat shit crazy at the world. The other LEO kia were sadly killed trying to protect others. As for the video, it really shows nothing but a snippet of what was occuring in one small area and a gratuitis volume fire. Kind of reminds me of the stupidity when LEO were actually shooting at each other in a cross fire pulling a hostage from a truck in Denver years ago. Seems like everyone wanted to get in on the party.

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My Bro is retired LEO/SWAT and we've got a friend that's Secret Service-both hate ATF.

 

 

When I found a AR-15 carrier in one of my M-16's, I told my commander that I didn't want the ATF anywhere near us as they like to play dirty tricks on people. And that was back in 92. We brought the FBI in on the investigation, but kept the ATF out. We found that someone at the Mississippi arsenal was playing games. USPFO/Support maint armorers didn't even have a clue that there was a difference in the carriers.

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While there's no way to justify his actions, Dorner pulled off a 4 for 1 which should give some people a few things to think about if they ever intend to go door to door taking guns. MT Pred, Wako was a clusterfuck from the beginning. My Bro is retired LEO/SWAT and we've got a friend that's Secret Service-both hate ATF. Koresh could have been singled out and picked up numerous times outside the compound. I'd like to know the whole story on what pissed Dorner off, to have a list of 40+ to go after and be prepped to do it...this guy was pissed, really pissed. The fact that he didn't kill the two in the first hide seems to indicate that his anger was focussed, not just bat shit crazy at the world. The other LEO kia were sadly killed trying to protect others. As for the video, it really shows nothing but a snippet of what was occuring in one small area and a gratuitis volume fire. Kind of reminds me of the stupidity when LEO were actually shooting at each other in a cross fire pulling a hostage from a truck in Denver years ago. Seems like everyone wanted to get in on the party.

I dont think he was batshit crazy either. I think he might have gotten into a really shitty situation and his only other option other than to just take it is do what he did. I dont believe he wanted to kill any of those officers but if its his life or theirs, well.... Whatever it was might have been life/career ruining deal. I imagine if it would have gone "their" way he would be in the news being charged with something else or dead or just not in the news at all and just another person turned a blind eye to.....speculation, speculation. tinfoil is a lil tight today, but who knows. I dont think the cause of his actions should go un investigated. I imagine he was a good person before this all happened. Not trying to build a case for the guy, just saying, put yourself in his shoes, imagine what fuct up things could go wrong in that line of work. You spend time in the service, build a fam, get a house, all to be fuct over by who knows, possibly the people you work with and basically are going to the slammer and your lifes over. Kids, dont plan on seeing them again, wife, gone. Lifes over, getting a cell with Bubba. No other way out, what do you do?

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Good riddance to the trash.

 

People get fired, divorced, abused and treated like shit every minute of the day. 99.9% deal with it and move on.

 

As far as taking him out goes. What is the difference if they shot him 30 times with auto fire or sniped him or ran him over the damn tank? Dead is dead.

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I think Dorner went the suicide route:

 

A SWAT team surrounded the cabin and used an armored vehicle to break out the cabin windows, said a law enforcement official who requested anonymity because the investigation was ongoing. The officers then lobbed tear gas canisters into the cabin and blasted a message over a loudspeaker: "Surrender or come out."

 

The armored vehicle then tore down each of the cabin's four walls.

 

A single shot was heard inside before the cabin was engulfed in flames, the law enforcement official told The Associated Press.

 

I saw that! Then after he fired, the officer behind him seemed to be saying, "WTH are you shooting at?!" wink.png

 

One of the articles last night clearly stated that an armored vehicle was brought in and started pulling the walls down. Today... not one word about that? huh.png

 

There are lots still mentioning that actually....

I voted suicide in the other thread, as I didn't think he'd have what it takes to go out in hail while charging them...blaze obviously...hail NO.

 

Can we have a flaming Dorner smiley please 000.gif

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I thought suicide from the start.

I think he suck started a pistol when the gas canister came into the window. suicide1.gif

Then the canister started a fire. flamed.gif

I don't believe they killed him with fire although dead is dead if they did. boohoo.gif

BTW, there are a couple of different types of gas canisters used by Military and LEO. The one that flushes them out the best has a side effect, it gets really hot and starts fires. Nobody likes to use the other one because it is not as effective.

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Good riddance to the trash.

 

People get fired, divorced, abused and treated like shit every minute of the day. 99.9% deal with it and move on.

 

As far as taking him out goes. What is the difference if they shot him 30 times with auto fire or sniped him or ran him over the damn tank? Dead is dead.

So (hypothetically speaking and not saying that this was Doner's situation but referring to my statement) if you're framed for something you didnt do, its gonna get you jail for life. not gonna see your kids ever again, gonna lose your house, possibly your life depending on the situation, and you would just take it and move on with life? Im not talking about normal everyday problems that 99.9% of people just deal with and move on. Im saying if you were caught up in something way fuct up and out of your control and you're pretty unjustly screwed over in the worst way. Fight or die in jail are your choices.

 

And in no way am I trying to justify his actions, he got what was coming.

 

Im sure if it was that simple he would have talked to a therapist or someshit rolleyes.gif

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I thought suicide from the start.

I think he suck started a pistol when the gas canister came into the window. suicide1.gif

Then the canister started a fire. flamed.gif

I don't believe they killed him with fire although dead is dead if they did. boohoo.gif

BTW, there are a couple of different types of gas canisters used by Military and LEO. The one that flushes them out the best has a side effect, it gets really hot and starts fires. Nobody likes to use the other one because it is not as effective.

I like them all..rolleyes.gif

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Good riddance to the trash.

 

People get fired, divorced, abused and treated like shit every minute of the day. 99.9% deal with it and move on.

 

As far as taking him out goes. What is the difference if they shot him 30 times with auto fire or sniped him or ran him over the damn tank? Dead is dead.

So (hypothetically speaking and not saying that this was Doner's situation but referring to my statement) if you're framed for something you didnt do, its gonna get you jail for life. not gonna see your kids ever again, gonna lose your house, possibly your life depending on the situation, and you would just take it and move on with life? Im not talking about normal everyday problems that 99.9% of people just deal with and move on. Im saying if you were caught up in something way fuct up and out of your control and you're pretty unjustly screwed over in the worst way. Fight or die in jail are your choices.

 

And in no way am I trying to justify his actions, he got what was coming.

 

Im sure if it was that simple he would have talked to a therapist or someshit rolleyes.gif

So hypothetically speaking, if you are fired from a job because you cannot meet the standard, that gives you every right to proclaim on the internet to the world you are about to exact revenge on your previous employer and their employees by killing them and then start actually doing it? 015.gif

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Found his manifesto on line, although lengthy it's interesting. From the read it seems like he was probably a decent man that just snapped and lost the filter that most of us have that keeps us in check.

 

Probably posted elsewhere, but here's a link. As time passes I wonder how much of what he's written will be fact or just his views...

 

http://ktla.com/2013/02/12/read-christopher-dorners-so-called-manifesto/#axzz2KpP4ALNi

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Hes starting to gain sympathy, at least on the net. Everyone who knew him said he was a kind nice guy. Served his country proudly and was a good cop who tried to do the right thing. Then he got fucked and got mad. Too bad about the one guys daughter and boyfriend but the cops got a dose of their own medicine. They interviewed the guy whos truck he stole and he said that Dornor was calm courteous and "professional" and he didnt feel Dornor would hurt him. They burned him down circ Waco 1993 and were "kinda" sure he was alone. They didnt want him talking I guess. I was 50/50 he would have come out shooting or been taken so he could tell his story.

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So hypothetically speaking, if you are fired from a job because you cannot meet the standard, that gives you every right to proclaim on the internet to the world you are about to exact revenge on your previous employer and their employees by killing them and then start actually doing it? :eek:

fuk no! U can't do the job, that's your fault. And falls in with the 99.9% people just deal with and move on. A new job is easy to get. Not so much worth taking lives over. Makes no sense. Doner claimed," from what I heard on the news which could be bs to begin with anyway, that there was police brutality and he was being blamed for it?? I Might not have got the whole story.
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Found his manifesto on line, although lengthy it's interesting. From the read it seems like he was probably a decent man that just snapped and lost the filter that most of us have that keeps us in check.

 

Probably posted elsewhere, but here's a link. As time passes I wonder how much of what he's written will be fact or just his views...

 

http://ktla.com/2013/02/12/read-christopher-dorners-so-called-manifesto/#axzz2KpP4ALNi

 

Reading the bits of his manifesto that I have, he seemed like a total piece of shit... pro-gun control, pro big government, "whoa is me" personality...

 

I do think he probably knew some things he shouldn't and was likely a dead man walking, but I don't hold much respect for him as a person.

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Good riddance to the trash.

 

People get fired, divorced, abused and treated like shit every minute of the day. 99.9% deal with it and move on.

 

As far as taking him out goes. What is the difference if they shot him 30 times with auto fire or sniped him or ran him over the damn tank? Dead is dead.

So (hypothetically speaking and not saying that this was Doner's situation but referring to my statement) if you're framed for something you didnt do, its gonna get you jail for life. not gonna see your kids ever again, gonna lose your house, possibly your life depending on the situation, and you would just take it and move on with life? Im not talking about normal everyday problems that 99.9% of people just deal with and move on. Im saying if you were caught up in something way fuct up and out of your control and you're pretty unjustly screwed over in the worst way. Fight or die in jail are your choices.

 

And in no way am I trying to justify his actions, he got what was coming.

 

Im sure if it was that simple he would have talked to a therapist or someshit rolleyes.gif

 

You know there are probably quite a few people who should be talking with a therapist and don't. That is one of the major problems no one wants to talk about or addresses.

 

I highly doubt he was framed for anything. However that does not mean he may have thought that way. Once he killed the first person, he definitely had to feel that way.

 

To me he just snapped, could not take the BS anymore and he took it out on those he held responsible. And then he was held responsible for his actions.

 

I hear people talk about all of the violence nowadays what could be causing it? Hmmm information overload, food and beverage additives, the media turning everything into either an emergency or the world will end, hormones and steroids in meat etc. Probably only going to be more of this not less.

 

The really fucking sad part is every time this happens, the gun grabbers get a little more leverage.

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Good riddance to the trash.

 

People get fired, divorced, abused and treated like shit every minute of the day. 99.9% deal with it and move on.

 

As far as taking him out goes. What is the difference if they shot him 30 times with auto fire or sniped him or ran him over the damn tank? Dead is dead.

So (hypothetically speaking and not saying that this was Doner's situation but referring to my statement) if you're framed for something you didnt do, its gonna get you jail for life. not gonna see your kids ever again, gonna lose your house, possibly your life depending on the situation, and you would just take it and move on with life? Im not talking about normal everyday problems that 99.9% of people just deal with and move on. Im saying if you were caught up in something way fuct up and out of your control and you're pretty unjustly screwed over in the worst way. Fight or die in jail are your choices.

 

And in no way am I trying to justify his actions, he got what was coming.

 

Im sure if it was that simple he would have talked to a therapist or someshit rolleyes.gif

 

You know there are probably quite a few people who should be talking with a therapist and don't. That is one of the major problems no one wants to talk about or addresses.

 

I highly doubt he was framed for anything. However that does not mean he may have thought that way. Once he killed the first person, he definitely had to feel that way.

 

To me he just snapped, could not take the BS anymore and he took it out on those he held responsible. And then he was held responsible for his actions.

 

I hear people talk about all of the violence nowadays what could be causing it? Hmmm information overload, food and beverage additives, the media turning everything into either an emergency or the world will end, hormones and steroids in meat etc. Probably only going to be more of this not less.

 

The really fucking sad part is every time this happens, the gun grabbers get a little more leverage.

 

Whether you subscribe to it or not, I think most people can appreciate the fact that religion has a way of keeping social order. Once this fades to the back ground and there is no absolute right or wrong being pushed in unison, you get chaos on a mass scale.

 

No higher moral authority = chaos or put another way removing God from society = removing civility from society.

 

Just my opinion based upon my own personal beliefs and observations that we have indeed become a short tempered, angry, violent, greedy & morally bankrupt society in which the unthinkable can occur at any moment to anyone of us.

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too many of his supporters apparently think that life is like a bad revenge movie, when realistically he could've made some real difference as a cop willing to speak out openly against others. the policmans union is hugely powerful, and members rarely will speak out against it, or remaining active officers, even after being wronged or fired, for risk of losing their pension and benefits that in many cases they still receive after termination.

 

Hell, the police union might even throw a party for you if you get fired for punching a woman.

http://articles.philly.com/2012-10-12/news/34413737_1_fop-last-year-police-union-josey

 

Not trying to bash cops, but just pointing out how much sway the police union has in keeping "good cops" silent when they witness a real injustice.

 

Any way, it's all irrelevant now. He went to the extreme, now everyone knows his name. Did he actually try to accomplish anything constructive before snapping? I don't know, but it doesn't seem like it.

Edited by mancat
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