elvis christ 451 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 So, if the pope resigns, is he still infallible? Discuss. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mostholycerebus 415 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 Only if hes Polish. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
frz1197 128 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 The Vatican got hit by a bolt of lightning the other day. But if the guy feels he can't do any more good he should call it a career. What good is it to watch a pope slowly weaken and die? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RED333 1,025 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 The Vatican got hit by a bolt of lightning the other day. But if the guy feels he can't do any more good he should call it a career. What good is it to watch a pope slowly weaken and die? I feel the same, He is a smart man, I pray for Him in His time of need. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jojo200517 68 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poolingmyignorance 2,191 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 I'd have to have some proof he was infalible in the first place, more proof than his peers saying "oh yea, he's tottaly infalible!" "Yea Steve's right, the Pope aint ever wrong bout nottin'!" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Matthew Hopkins 1,065 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) I believe this needs to be said again. Edited February 14, 2013 by Matthew Hopkins 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
macbeau 902 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 Since I am NOT a Papist, it matters not to me, one way or the other. But! I do think it's refreshing to see that someone who has a lifetime appointment to yield so much power to an "unknown" successor and legacy, finds the fortitude to step down. I admire that he yields power, time and indecision rather than grasping to it until the bitter end.... In that regard, Much PROPS and respect! Otherwise, I wish CPL Ratzinger a wonderful sunset! He has surely earned it. Macbeau sends... 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
elvis christ 451 Posted February 14, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 macbeau, i'm glad you started posting again. But really, was infallibility and the power to sway millions of people's opinion just a job perk? Does he get a retirement package? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
macbeau 902 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 So, if the pope resigns, is he still infallible? Discuss. Only to practicing ROMAN Catholics, world-wide.... And the Vatican's Swiss Bankers..... I am sure they are "chaking-in-their-chit!" Macbeau sends... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
macbeau 902 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) tenniomacbeau, i'm glad you started posting again. But really, was infallibility and the power to sway millions of people's opinion just a job perk? Does he get a retirement package? He gets a "Golden Parachute"; Catholically speaking.... Going to a "Nunnary" near Rome to live out his days... (Read: Not a Monistary or Monastic-Order - filled with monks and Abbots... IE: Dudes) In Italy... (Not Germany or some lesser-economic country)... He is going to be considered "Emeritus Faculty" with tenure... He'll be just fine and well taken care of... Macbeau sends... I'd say he'll do just fine.... Edited February 14, 2013 by macbeau Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Voltia 375 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 I agree on the tenure, he'll be well taken care of. One thing I think worth mentioning is the responsibility of being Pope. Yes, he is considered to be infallible, but I bet he has to work at it. What I mean is, when you're the Pope, you're considered the arm of Christ. You just can't say just anything, everything you do is guidance to a billion people. What if you fuck up? I know there's plenty of Catholic haters out there, but even the most jaded can acknowledge the tremendous strain and self doubt that puts upon you. What if you heard God wrong? I know, that when God speaks to me, it's very, very subtle, and can be rationalized and written off as something else, though I am trying to listen harder. The only inkling I have of how it must be is when you publish something, you aren't speaking as yourself, rather, as an authority on a matter, and your words will be cited, so everything you do must be researched ahead of time. I can barely imagine having every word that comes out of your mouth being considered practically Gospel. To answer the question, when he assumed the title of Pope and took the name Benedict, he became the arm of God. When you step down from the title, you are only yourself again, so he has not the authority to speak as the infallible Pope. I think it's going to be weird, and we probably won't hear from him until he passes to his reward. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dad2142Dad 6,559 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 and we probably won't hear from him until he passes to his reward. You will not hear from him again after he leaves, part of the deal in stepping down. I would imagine that just being himself again will be quite a relief......... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Juggernaut 11,054 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 the pope is infallible... people who are NOT pope are fallible.. when he is no longer pope, he will be fallible again.. (It's the magic hat! ) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Remek 771 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) I think he tried to live up to the position while he occupies it, and thats a LOT more than many could say. I hope the Next occupant of the position will be even better! Edited February 14, 2013 by Remek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
macbeau 902 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) The Pope influences much of Europe (albeit, fading influence), some of Asia, a lot of Africa and much of latin America. He has "significant" influence in North America (mostly in Canada and Mexico), but in many areas that are also wanting "liberalization" or "reformation" in church doctrine... In countries that wield real economic, miliitary or fiscal power..... The Catholic church is stuck in the 3rd world (to save souls) and the 19th centuary *as far as propriety) - insofar as church policy. I am not saying they (the Catholic Church) should sacrifice their principals....., It's just that the world has passed those principals by.... And the Catholic church failed to recognize or do anything about it.... BUT - To answer your fallibility question.... If it takes a regular dump or breathes air.... It's fallible... Edited February 14, 2013 by macbeau 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
aka_mythos 35 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) The "infalibility" of the Pope, as defined by the church, only extends to his ability interpret Church teachings. People misunderstand what it means to be infalible within that context; it is analogous to how the Supreme Court has the final say in the interpretation of US law. Its merely a supremacy of interpretation. Papal infalibility also is confined to that hierarichal position in the church and there are procedural aspects to it. The Pope can't just say something and it becomes the will of the Church. A statement made within the infalibility of Papal authority must be written and declared from the Papal seat in the Vatican. It must be read allowed and follow a specific structure. Only after that is what the Pope says regarded as infalible and only in those specific instances. When he steps down he will no longer be in that position of authority, he will not be able to sit on the Papal throne, and read statements stating he is Pope and making an infalible statement. Thus he will not be infalible. Edited February 14, 2013 by Mythos 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ronin38 2,117 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 But if the guy feels he can't do any more good he should call it a career. What good is it to watch a pope slowly weaken and die? I wish some of our Supreme Court Justices would admit to the same limitations. Unfortunately, I don't want our current Liar-In-Chief anointing any new ones, either... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 Not a Catholic, but much of my family is. The more serious ones will continue to worship any living former pope and believe that everything he says is direct word from God. Such people won't have any problem in their mind of there being "two" popes - the official one, and the one living in the Vatican's retirement home. I will say this.. The Catholic church needs a young pope. It's a poor practice to choose a pope who is already nearing death upon his acceptance. They are hinting at this, but also it seems to be an obsession of the Vatican to now choose a Latino or African pope, since the Catholic church has nearly zero growth in Europe or North America other than in the Latin population. All of the growth is in Africa, Asia, and Central/South America. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poolingmyignorance 2,191 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 I was thinking more along these lines: 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted February 14, 2013 Report Share Posted February 14, 2013 (edited) Edited February 14, 2013 by mancat 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
horatio 515 Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 The "infalibility" of the Pope, as defined by the church, only extends to his ability interpret Church teachings. People misunderstand what it means to be infalible within that context; it is analogous to how the Supreme Court has the final say in the interpretation of US law. Its merely a supremacy of interpretation. Papal infalibility also is confined to that hierarichal position in the church and there are procedural aspects to it. The Pope can't just say something and it becomes the will of the Church. A statement made within the infalibility of Papal authority must be written and declared from the Papal seat in the Vatican. It must be read allowed and follow a specific structure. Only after that is what the Pope says regarded as infalible and only in those specific instances. When he steps down he will no longer be in that position of authority, he will not be able to sit on the Papal throne, and read statements stating he is Pope and making an infalible statement. Thus he will not be infalible. well said as a staunch catholic and believer in gun rights, people who speak of the pope as though he were infallible in all he says are as well educated on the subject as those who keep trying to ban those high capacity clips that being said. i don't agree with everything the church has done. i am also disappointed in peoples treating objects like deities and general poor interpretation of their own faith- not to say i'm all that great either. i'm not emabarrased to stand up on gun rights just because i don't agree with what some gunowners do, or something wayne lapierre said. And im not embarrassed to be a catholic either 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saltydecimator 482 Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 lolz to the emperor pics, he sure looks evil. we woulda never elected him to the POTUS based upon his looks, much less a hi religious position... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Voltia 375 Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 He would have done a damn sight better than the current one. I'm calling Oduit or however he spells his name from Canada as next pope. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MultiSlacking 102 Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 Only one Man walked this earth that was infallible in every sense of the word. And He went home a long time ago. At least, that's what I read. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Remek 771 Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 I think the texts that were precluded from the Roman's gathering o form the bible would disagree that even Jesus was infallable. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jpanzer 1,265 Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 Until you have walked in his shoes don't judge the man. I imagine carrying that title and the responsibilities that go with it are more of a burden than most human beings can begin to understand. I'm not a Catholic, but the Pope stands for something, and in todays world thats a rare thing... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ronin38 2,117 Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 You should never criticize a man until you have walked a mile in his shoes. That way, when you do criticize him, you're a mile away and have his shoes! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
true.believer 10 Posted February 15, 2013 Report Share Posted February 15, 2013 There is only ever two--master and apprentice. And now that the master is gone, it is time for the apprentice to take the throne 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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