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I recently purchased one of their stocks. It installed just fine and fits well. Problem is when I clamp everything down it causes cycling issues. The gun ran fine before and runs fine when I put it back into the original configuration. I suspect is has something to do with the rear clam shell but I cannot figure out the problem. I have fitted brand new magazines in hopes that would resolve the issue but it does not.

Without the Kushnapup stock installed it will function fine with low brass Federal. With the stock it is 50/50 with high brass ammo and I might get two rounds to fire consecutively out of 5.

I have a RAA Saiga 12. It has the 19” barrel and the 3 ports have been drilled to .093. The bolt had been glassed.

Any ideas?

Dolomite

Edited by Makc
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I used my Kpup on a 762x39 rifle. I had a problem with the weapon cycling properly when all screws were tightened. What I found was that the bolt and metal tab that work the trigger mechanism were being placed into a bind when the last cover was placed on. I had to grind some off of the screw head from the back side and also remove some of the material of the stock where the trigger activator moves. Give that a try and see what happens.

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I have already ground the screw head down because after tightening the rear section the trigger bound up. The trigger is great now.

 

I will say that as you tighten the rear clamshells the action seems to move down inside the stock.

 

I cannot close the clamshell completely by hand. They do when I screw it down but it binds on something other than the trigger screw. I did notice there is a place on the scope mount where the trigger linkage is rubbing slightly but not enough to affect the trigger.

 

Tomorrow I am going to see if they will fit together by hand if I remove the top cover. I will not fire it that way but it should tell me whether it is the top cover or something else.

 

Anyone know if I remove the scope mount if I can still use the stock? I have no intensional of using it.

 

Thanks.

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I started this morning by shooting a TON of ammo in the factory configuration. Not a single FTE with any of my magazines. After that I knew it was not the gun.

 

The small rear clamshell would rock on something. I tried to figure it out but couldn't without marking it. So I marked likely areas on the action and dropped it into the rear clamshell. The "nipple" on the safety lever was the cause of some of the rocking. I clearanced the stock to give the safety lever a little more room and it felt a million times better. But it still rocked some so I began looking again and noticed the front, right side of the trigger guard was also hitting theclamshell. I could not clearance the stock for this one so I ground out a rounded section of the trigger guard about an inch long and a 1/4" deep. Then the clamshell fell into place. Between those two the clamshells fit together nicely and no long bound the action up. The gun even sounded differently.

 

I took it out and so far I have put 50 rounds through it with only 2 malfunctions. Those are probably related to the magazine as they were the last round in the mag.

 

It is hard to believe that the plastic can move metal but apparently it did.

 

Now it is time to tear it all back down for coating.

 

Dolomite

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I am going to install a aftermarket gas regulalator though. I drilled the 3 ports at .093" and angled them. I am worried about overgassing and causing premature wear. My last Saiga has smaller ports and ran fine.

 

I will be shooting low brass, bulk pack ammo 99% of the time.

 

Dolomite

 

Over Gassing with bulk packs would take A LOT of work. You should only worry on the rare occasion you fire high brass.

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Ok, so I thought I had it beat but still had a bunch of FTE's over the past few days. I went through and marked the stock looking for areas that might need clearancing. The only part that had witness marks repeatedly was the side rail and because I will never use it I removed it. And now I have 50 rounds without a single FTE. So the side rail was causing some sort of an interference issue. It is very comfortable and I really like the stock.

 

Now the problems.

 

I have sent K-Pup several emails. Not just since buying the stock but long before. And as long as I was stroking their ego they responded. But the second I had an issue or questioned what they were saying all I heard was crickets. Two years ago when I first heard about the stock I contacted them. They said it was the greatest stock for the Saiga and it should be in any day. I contacted them again about the stock but when I asked if they had them yet I got crickets again.

 

When I got the stock and had the cycling issues I contacted them. I didn't berate them or anything. I asked if there was anything I should look for that might be causing the issue. Again crickets.

 

I think as long as the sun shines and someone is blowing them they will respond. But if you are not there to "gobble" all things Kushnapup then they will not respond.

 

I really like the stock but I have learned something. This company will not be in business long. They reason? Customer service is what keeps people coming back regardless of how great the product might be. This is why Leupold is well renowned, not because their scopes are great or that they are a great value but because their customer service is one of the best in the industry. Kushnapup has proven several times over the past two years that their customer service, in one word, sucks. They make a decent product but for the money I do not believe it is a value at $300 but untimately it will be their customer service that drives them from the market and not the value of their product.

 

Dolomite

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The KPup stock doesn't apply any force to the gas tube.

 

It believe what was happening is when the rear clamshell was clamped down on the side rail it shifted the clamshell enough to move the top cover. Before clamping the action rocked in the clamshell half before removing the side rail, now it just lays in their flat. And when you were tightening down the screws before, the rear of the action would be pulled down vertically by the clamshell. This angled the rest of the gun up and kind of tweaked everything. There were several spots on the side rail that were making contact with the stock as well as the trigger bar. The gun even sounded different when racking it after removing the side rail.

 

I am going to get a few hundred more rounds through it this week to make sure but so far it looks like it is a million times more reliable than before. I got one hangup yesterday when ejecting the last round when using ProMag magazines. When using SGM mags the issue goes away. I have a few more SGM mags coming so I will probably put my NIB Pro Mag magazines on Gunbroker or Ebay.

 

Again, I really like the stock but hate the company's customer service.

 

And honestly I wouldn't have posted anything negative had they responded with "I can't help you with the problem". I can sort of understand because of the years of being told they were scammers but now is the time to shine. I paid a lot of money for a stock and they least they could have done is respond to an email like they did when I was spending the money. But after they had my money it was crickets. Funny thing was is this was going to be the first in what was probably going to be quite a few. I have two friends that each own a shop and both were really interested in how this thing turned out. I am going to tell him to look elsewhere. Not because of the stock but because of the company.

 

Dolomite

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Ok, some more shooting today and getting one stove pipe per mag on average. I cannot figure this out. It kicks the casings out about 5-6 feet at about a 2 pm angle forward when it doesn't stovepipe.

 

It does it when inside the K-Pup stock but not when it is in original configuration. It does it with ProMag, SGM and Keepshooting mags.

 

I have a DPH gas block and it does it in settings 5 or 6. The 3 ports are drilled .093" and angled. CSS puck factory recoil springs. Glassed bolt.

 

Here is a video of the malfunction:

 

Any ideas?

 

Dolomite

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Hard to be helpful from a distance, but 2 things occur.

 

1. not likely to make a big difference but the exhaust hole on the gas block left side could be obstructed.

 

2. more a way of checking than what to check. You can coat spectfic parts with something that will get rubbed off easily with contact. I am thinking one of those construction crayons might work well for this purpose. i.e. scribble all over the bolt carrier in an even coat, and see if it is rubbing against the cover, binding in a rail...

Perhaps someone could chime in with a better substance. If It were not already painted, I would suggest sharpie or machinist's ink.

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It is not painted.

 

I may coat the bolt with some gold high temp paint and run it.

 

I have a horrible memory since my helicopter accident. With that being said I remember getting the same issue without the top cover or that secondary cover in place. I have not tried it since removing the side rail though.

 

It doesn't make sense that the clamshell could move metal enough to cause it to bind. It feels smooth when hand cycling with no obvious bind points. I may go ahead and do a traditional conversion. I would rather have a reliable gun than a cool looking gun.

 

Not sure it matters but it is an early 3 port gun.

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The gun runs 100% without being inside the K-Pup stock. Outside of the stock I can "limp wrist" the gun and it runs great. I originally traded a converted gun for a stock gun to use with the stock. Now I am going back to a more traditional setup.

 

I have found a buyer for the stock that already has quite a few. He likes them and is happy to get another one. I am happy to get enough to convert this gun.

 

I wish it would have worked out but it didn't. Lesson learned.

 

Dolomite

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I pup the stock up in a moment of frustration and went to bed. I was going to pull the ad back down and keep it but someone offered me a fair price for it.

 

I will not order another. Not because the stock isn't great, because it is a very comfortable stock, but because of the company's unwillingness to even acknowledge me. I guarantee if I sent an email saying the stock was great they would respond instantly like they have before but if I replied with advice on any problems I would not hear another peep.

 

My "new" setup will have welded HK sights, Molot grip and CSS billet trigger guard. I have yet to figure out which forend I will be using. I will also be getting the barrel chopped and a flash hider welded in place at 18". As soon as I find a folding mechanism in stock I will buy one for the ACE stock I ordered. And even though I traded a 100% reliable gun for this gun and cash in the end I will come out ahead.

 

Dolomite

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