Fitty% 808 Posted February 22, 2013 Report Share Posted February 22, 2013 Here is the recoil comparison of the Tromix Monster & Mini-Monster brakes, Bonesteel Arms Firestorm brake, JTE Competition brake and the CSS aluminum copy of the Russian Molot GK-01 brake. I labeled it "Part 1" because I believe that human error was too much and messed with the results. We will try to take the fatigue out for the next one or take the human error factor out completely if we can find a way to do it safely. Also I will do a review for all the muzzle brakes that were in the test. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Odd Man Out 1,283 Posted February 22, 2013 Report Share Posted February 22, 2013 (edited) Good stuff but if I may make a few suggestions. 1. Eliminate the human = introduces too much variation that is near impossible to negate. OOPS --wrote this prior to the end of the vid!!! 2. In some cases it seems like after the initial recoil there is almost an added small recoil to add to the initial part to make it bigger... this could be refuted by having a small window showing the entire shooter/saiga. 3. Personal pref only -- horizontal lines and smaller/thinner marking lines would be good. Edited February 22, 2013 by Odd Man Out 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fitty% 808 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2013 Good stuff but if I may make a few suggestions.1. Eliminate the human = introduces too much variation that is near impossible to negate. OOPS --wrote this prior to the end of the vid!!! 2. In some cases it seems like after the initial recoil there is almost an added small recoil to add to the initial part to make it bigger... this could be refuted by having a small window showing the entire shooter/saiga. 3. Personal pref only -- horizontal lines would be good Yeah we are going to do one more with a human shooter and one without. I saw the "extra" recoil as well but he was not doing that on purpose. We will get a sheet of ply wood paint it white and add 2"x2" squares to it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
obiwanbonjovi 337 Posted February 22, 2013 Report Share Posted February 22, 2013 a screen at the end showing all the results overlayed would be nice. Overall I like it. If you have a way of measuring a chart showing the mean rearward and upward motion of each would also be sweet. And of course more and more rounds fired. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fitty% 808 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2013 a screen at the end showing all the results overlayed would be nice. Overall I like it.If you have a way of measuring a chart showing the mean rearward and upward motion of each would also be sweet. And of course more and more rounds fired. Did you see all the "shit" the Firestorm was throwing out? A friend and I were behind the shooter on each side and we got hit. I got hit every single time and my friend got hit in the neck....all of mine were in the back and arm. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HighPlainsDrifter 466 Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 (edited) I commend your effort! It's threads like this that make the forum an invaluable reference tool. Aside from measuring the distance the muzzle traveled the next step would be to measure the force of recoil. Not sure what type of sensor system could be set up to do that. As you have already acknowledged, no data will be indisputable unless the human factor is eliminated. Good work though. I feel like I'm sitting in on a science project in progress... Edited February 23, 2013 by HighPlainsDrifter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lbsrdi 1,078 Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Another variable to consider, the distance of the barrel from the camera. If the barrel is held closer to the camera even slightly it changes perceived barrel rise when comparing the videos. Thanks for doing this review, we all appreciate it, I hereby nominate you as member of the month. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fitty% 808 Posted February 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Yeah we kept the camera to barrel distance the same. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
obiwanbonjovi 337 Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 a screen at the end showing all the results overlayed would be nice. Overall I like it.If you have a way of measuring a chart showing the mean rearward and upward motion of each would also be sweet. And of course more and more rounds fired. Did you see all the "shit" the Firestorm was throwing out? A friend and I were behind the shooter on each side and we got hit. I got hit every single time and my friend got hit in the neck....all of mine were in the back and arm. I see a bit of it coming out in the video, bits of wadding and powder, the large ports allow more of the debris to exit sideways, I have never noticed any of it hitting anything, you must've found the sweet spot to stand. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pedal2alloy 206 Posted February 23, 2013 Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Hypnotic! Looks like a lot of work, thanks for putting that together. People really appreciate that kind of thing. Interesting that there is an initial jolt, then some secondary recoil. It illustrates how the AK stock is not as good of a design as an AR because of it being below the barrel axis. I'm sure that barrel rise could be eliminated by a stock in line with the barrel. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fitty% 808 Posted February 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2013 Hypnotic! Looks like a lot of work, thanks for putting that together. People really appreciate that kind of thing. Interesting that there is an initial jolt, then some secondary recoil. It illustrates how the AK stock is not as good of a design as an AR because of it being below the barrel axis. I'm sure that barrel rise could be eliminated by a stock in line with the barrel. Actually I think the stock is pretty much in line with the bore..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LoudBoomBoom 26 Posted February 24, 2013 Report Share Posted February 24, 2013 Very good job! I have the JTE and I like it... and it did rather well on your test too. When I evaluated mine using Lightfield 3-inch slugs, my test rig was a Caldwell Lead Sled DFT with two 20 lbs. bags of lead shot in the bottom, me solidly holding it, and it still moved itself and me backwards quite a bit (I had to reposition after every shot). I weigh just over 200 lbs and it still 'rocked' me (12 lb. Saiga+20 lb. sled+40 lbs. shot+205 lb. tester+a few heavy loads=sore shoulder anyway) You may want to consider a heavier test rig and trucker's bungee-type hold down restraint on the front and rear supports, and a trigger release without direct finger/trigger contact (even a string will do if you pull on it evenly). Enjoyed it. Thanks. Look forward to more when you recover... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pedal2alloy 206 Posted February 24, 2013 Report Share Posted February 24, 2013 Hypnotic! Looks like a lot of work, thanks for putting that together. People really appreciate that kind of thing. Interesting that there is an initial jolt, then some secondary recoil. It illustrates how the AK stock is not as good of a design as an AR because of it being below the barrel axis. I'm sure that barrel rise could be eliminated by a stock in line with the barrel. Actually I think the stock is pretty much in line with the bore..... If you draw a line thru the bore to the butt stock you will see that the stock is lower than the bore. This picture from FirearmsHistory.blogspot.com shows the recoil force "A" and the support force "B" causing the rotational torque "C" This is what creates the upward rise of the barrel upon firing. If you look at an AR15, HK93 or some other rifles where they have designed a more "straight thru" design, those have less muzzle climb. That was one of the positive features on that crazy Origin 12 shotgun where they raised the stock access as high as the top cover. That support point and the grip point balance out the barrel recoil force Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TBK 0 Posted February 26, 2013 Report Share Posted February 26, 2013 (edited) Thanks for the comparison. I was originally going to be getting the Chaos Warthog but then I moved to the monster full size. This makes me seriously think and wonder which would be best for my application (Breacher/Brake comb). Do you have a 'seat of the pants' feel for it you can add? There is always the subjective view of a product, I'm certainly interested in hearing this as well. Fatigue would matter a lot with this as one might feel 'best' under fatigue. Edited February 26, 2013 by TBK Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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