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Did I Make a Big Mistake with the .223?

.223 mag FTF

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#1 deltaspecialforce

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 04:01 PM

Hey folks. Recently acquired a used saiga 223. Never had a gun of this size or power before so I know nearly nothing about these. I understand how to shoot it as it is a very simple design, which I love.

So the first day I took it to the range, I loaded about 5 bullets in the 10rnd factory magazine and it loaded no problem. Fired the first round and it shot awesome. Unfortunately, it jammed on the second round and couldn't ever get it to fire again. It was attempting to feed but would send the round in at a bad angle where it wouldn't go in the barrel.

Unfortunately, I didn't have any other mags with me to test to see if the mag was the issue. Is this a known problem? Should I try it with my non-factory mags before getting too concerned? I've heard only good things about these guns so I'm really hoping this was just a weird incident. Thanks!

#2 Thumbhole

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 04:42 PM

AKs are simple, if there is a real problem it should be easily remedied. I suggest modding it to take surplus 223 ak mags, like the Bulgarian or Polish mags, and go from there. I would not worry about the factory mag much.


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#3 termite

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 05:21 PM

How about some pictures of the insides, with the bolt open and what the trunnion looks like. Ain't nobody been Bubba rigging it have they?


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#4 Captain Hero

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 05:38 PM

Assuming this rifle doesnt have a bullet guide, Id like to see pics of the mag. Especially just in front of the feed lip portion to see if the built in bullet guide is damaged/worn, or there at all.

 

Has this rifle been converted? If so, whats been done to it?


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Captain hero u always have a slutty avatar, u don't get laid do u u fat fuckin retard. Serve ur fucking country and suck a dick.


#5 liberty -r- death

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 06:49 PM

Pics of the gun and loaded & unloaded will help determine possible issues. Some one here will likely have the answer.
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#6 RED333

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Posted 02 April 2013 - 06:59 PM

Pics of the gun and loaded & unloaded will help determine possible issues. Some one here will likely have the answer.

I will bet a dollar on it.


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#7 mancat

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 12:19 AM

I'm just gonna guess that the bullet guide broke off of the factory mag.

#8 deltaspecialforce

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 07:16 AM

Thanks for the info everyone. It was a major letdown having that issue straight out of the gate. The rifle is in Indiana (with my gun guy) and I'm in Nashville but I will upload pics of everything as soon as I get it back next week. I attached one pic of the gun itself that I had. Thanks!

Attached Files



#9 Sgt. Raven

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:53 AM

First of all, don't panic or jump to conclusions.

AK platform (which Saiga is delivered upon) is simple, reliable and extremely tolerable.

Your gun remains unconverted (despite the PG/stock attachment), so there is less things to concentrate on and distracted by.

 

Pictures will tell the story, unless you noticed and can describe FTF in details.

Do you have snap caps or dummy rounds to hand-load for troubleshooting, once rifle is back?

If not, buy/borrow and keep them around.

 

Hit me up if you're around my AO (NC) or shout to your neighboring Forum members.

In a mean time, check those out: http://www.amazon.co...k/dp/B002IEE7KU

 

Is your gun guy a Gunsmith or knowledgeable in troubleshooting and basic R&M?

 

Good luck and keep us posted!


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#10 deltaspecialforce

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 08:04 AM

I just purchased a few rounds of 223 snap caps from the link. Thank you for the help. I'm in the Nashville, TN area. Will send better pics ASAP. Thanks again everybody.

#11 Captain Hero

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Posted 06 April 2013 - 06:14 PM

I wish your gun was with you, as Im in TN, and would make the drive to help you out.


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Captain hero u always have a slutty avatar, u don't get laid do u u fat fuckin retard. Serve ur fucking country and suck a dick.


#12 RED333

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 09:34 AM

Well, Nashville is just up the road, any way to get it here, Hero is a good friend, we can help.


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I AM A REDNECK!!!
"If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government,our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." Samuel Adams, 1776

As a wise man once said, "If they keep cornering and harassing the rattlesnake, it will have no option but to strike back."


#13 deltaspecialforce

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 04:43 PM

Hey everyone. I finally got the Saiga 223 back from Indiana. My gun guy doesn't think there is anything wrong with it and thinks its the magazine. I have a couple of pics here. After you all chimed in, I did notice that this black plastic magazine is pretty worn out. I'm hoping the magazine is the problem because this gun is just begging me to shoot it.

Thoughts? I'm back in Nashville as well. Does anyone recommend another magazine I should buy that plays nicely with the Saiga 223?

Attached Files



#14 mancat

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 04:59 PM

That's the factory mag and it looks like it's been used A LOT.

 

Do you only have one mag? Get some more.

 

The cheapest hi-cap mag setup you can get for the Saiga .223, is to install a bullet guide and buy a ton of either Promag .223 AK mags, or Tapco Galil mags. Either one is the cheapest ticket to reliable operation with 30 rounds, but you need to do that little bit of work with installing the bullet guide.

 

Otherwise, buy SGM mags with the built-in bullet guide.


Edited by mancat, 21 April 2013 - 05:00 PM.

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#15 deltaspecialforce

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 05:22 PM

I don't have other mags on-hand. Left them up North like a dumbass so it will be another month before I get them. Are there any specific SGM mags or will the general AK-47 ones work?

#16 mancat

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 05:44 PM

You need the .223 mags for the Saiga. They have a built-in bullet guide. Otherwise, you need to install a bullet guide into the rifle to use other more common .223 AK mags.



#17 liberty -r- death

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 06:29 PM

^^^^^^^^ what he said. +1


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#18 Captain Hero

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 07:36 PM

Yeah that mag looks like it has seen better days.


Captain hero u always have a slutty avatar, u don't get laid do u u fat fuckin retard. Serve ur fucking country and suck a dick.


#19 Spacehog

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 09:52 PM

PM me your address. I have a spare S223 10 round mag that I am not using that I will send you free of charge.
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#20 deltaspecialforce

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 06:00 PM

This place is awesome!

#21 beefcakeb0

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 08:42 PM

it sure is! welcome to the club



#22 jerry52

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Posted 22 April 2013 - 09:56 PM

Mag could be dirty. Did you pull it apart and check the spring for rust or dirt? how old is the gun? Its not dimpled so who knows where it has been.


Edited by jerry52, 22 April 2013 - 10:00 PM.


#23 CSgunner

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 01:17 AM

From the pic, it look like someone try to pull out the follower. My factory mag doesn't look like that.



#24 jdub23

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 08:12 AM

The bullet guide looks worn a good 2 mm. Another mag  would probably do it.



#25 deltaspecialforce

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 09:22 PM

Well everyone... Spacehog saved the day. He sent me a factory mag free of charge and it definitely resolved the issue. Went through close to 40 loads/reloads with the snap caps with zero malfunctions. I will post some pics ASAP if anyone is interested in seeing the whole setup. Thanks everyone!
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#26 Spacehog

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 11:13 PM

Glad it worked, now when you are ready... convert that gun and install a bullet guide. I promise you will love it even more! The next time I am up in TN, we need to get together and shoot.

Edited by Spacehog, 25 April 2013 - 11:17 PM.

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#27 jerry52

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 05:33 PM

Do the conversion it is fun! good shooting!



#28 Sgt. Raven

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 06:14 PM

Do the conversion it is fun! good shooting!

Let us know if you need ANY help with that.

 

Are you interested in STANAG mag use conversion? In other words, how bad do you like PMAGs and USGIs?


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#29 uzitiger

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Posted 01 June 2013 - 06:53 PM

The magazine follower doens't look right.  I checked out the Pro Mag site and they make Saiga .223 magazines with the bullet guide molded in if you don't have one in your Saiga.


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#30 ShadowFire

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Posted 01 June 2013 - 10:51 PM

That mag looks all kinds of wrong.  :)

 

Yeeeaahhh, it's gotta be the mag.

 

The guys are right.  Either .223 mags or drop the bullet guide in.

 

I'd go for the bullet guide, that way you can use more or less, any mag readily available for it (Bulgarian, Polish, Yugo [yes they're making the switch to 5.56, I saw the Zastava website.] and Israeli [Galil] along with all 29 nations that use the Galil [plenty of eventual surplus there].)

 

Vs being stuck with .223 mags that might in the long run cost you more and are limited in terms of mass production to meet the demand out there vs all the potential surplus.

 

And welcome to the forum fellow Middle Tenneseean.  NashVegas isn't too far from me either.


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