So... Do you let them in?

[Ronin38 2,117]

So if you live near Boston, and the place is locked-down while Police, Swat, Nat'l Guard, etc. are searching for an armed terrorist, and they're going house-to-house looking for him. If several of them knock on your door and say they need to check your house... Do you let them in?

 

What are the legal and/or moral implications of this? When is it okay to allow a search of your home without a search warrant? Kind of a tricky situation, eh?

 

Yeah, I'd let them in most likely. I would also inform them that I'm armed, not sure how that would go over either...

[Big John! 2,062]

Since I would probably know there is no terrorist in my home. I would probably tell them that I'm 100% confident that said person is not in my home and to kindly eat a dick.

[liberty -r- death 1,445]

Not without a warrant. They are looking for him, but will they stop there? Doubt it.

[Remek 771]

I would simply ask to see the warrant, and tell them that I am sure no terrorist is in the house.

[DLT 1,646]

I would ask them where they got their ammo because I can't find any for my own M4.

[Odd Man Out 1,283]

From what I heard on the news the PoPos were going door to door and asking if all doors were secured and if everyone inside was okay, then asked permission to search the yard. I would have no problem with that but I am sure that there are some that will decry the heinous illegal invasion committed... Tinfoil is cheap!

[thebuns1 4,323]

From what I heard on the news the PoPos were going door to door and asking if all doors were secured and if everyone inside was okay, then asked permission to search the yard. I would have no problem with that but I am sure that there are some that will decry the heinous illegal invasion committed... Tinfoil is cheap!

Yeah it is cheap, but you know the drill....give them an inch and they tend to like to go a mile. But they could search the yard all they want so long as they could avoid the numerous piles of dogshit.

[DLT 1,646]

I'm surprised noboby has said they would tell the cops yes, but only if they removed their weapons because my house is a gun free zone. They would also have to remove their shoes because the wife hates cleaning the floor.

[Lone Eagle 839]

Sure, officer, check the yard. Just be careful. I haven't fed the dog since Monday. If the suspect was back there, he's probably kibble by now.

[MultiSlacking 102]

Never let anyone in the house. The front porch is just fine for doing business. No need to let them in and for them to start questioning why I have "this" or "that" and maybe having to get a lawyer to get my goodies back a year later...if I'm lucky.

[Sim_Player 1,939]

No. They can get a warrant first.

[sccritterkiller 473]

If I was told shelter in place and there was s knock at my door...you can be damn sure I will be armed when I answer the door. I would tell them ain't nobody here but if yall run out of ammo just holler...

 

 

It will be interesting to hear what those folks say once every thing is lifted.

[yakdung 2,926]

 

[Syndicate 812]

Put this sign up and have a table with a bunch outside before they get to your house.

[Odd Man Out 1,283]

Even when door to door salespeople come around, the first thing I do is come out the front door to back them away from it and shut it behind me before I listen to what they have to say. No need for anyone you don't know to come in your castle.

[gunman1 1,753]

Marshal law was my first thought this morning when I heard they were shutting doun the place. Let them in???........now I just wonder how much of a real choice people there might have right now, kinda like another disaster that happened alittle further south. Be interesting to hear these stories in a week or so.

 

This is where the well regulated Militia comes in........not fuken gun free zone.

[liberty -r- death 1,445]

Even when door to door salespeople come around, the first thing I do is come out the front door to back them away from it and shut it behind me before I listen to what they have to say. No need for anyone you don't know to come in your castle.

 

I do same thing. Unseen dogs barking in the house makes them think I do it for their safety. Pretty effective.

[menace667 194]

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="Ronin38" data-cid="892443" data-time="1366400286"><p>

So if you live near Boston, and the place is locked-down while Police, Swat, Nat'l Guard, etc. are searching for an armed terrorist, and they're going house-to-house looking for him. If several of them knock on your door and say they need to check your house... Do you let them in?<br />

<br />

What are the legal and/or moral implications of this? When is it okay to allow a search of your home without a search warrant? Kind of a tricky situation, eh?<br />

<br />

Yeah, I'd let them in most likely. I would also inform them that I'm armed, not sure how that would go over either...</p></blockquote>

 

I want to address something in your post. The portion that says "when is ot ok to allow a warrantless search of your house?" Specifically.

 

Understanding what a search is, the types of searches, and your actual rights and responsibilities is hugely important. I would like to break it down a little and then give my opinion as a previous police officer who has served more than his share of warrant and warrantless searches.

 

Types of searches-

Consentual- meaning there is no "probable cause" (PC) or "articulable reasonable suspicion" (ARS) and you allow it without coercion. Just as you allow it, you also can resind consent at any time as long as PC or ARS has not been established.

 

ARS search- ARS is the most sketch of searches. The officer has to be able to articulat (explain) what gave him cause to believe a crime has been or is about to be committed and he can only try to confirm or dispel that alarm. (Example: a neighborhood has several auto burglaries lately. Officer stops a vehicle for another reason and when he approaches he sees 9 car radios in the van. The officer can detain the person withthe radios long enough to figure out where they came from if the person can not provide verifiable proof) this does not justify a full on search of the vehicle or person but a "pat down" will most likely be performed for officers safety.

 

PC search- the officer has "facts and or circumstances that would make a reasonable or pruden person believe a crime has been or is being committed" (supreme court accepted definition). (Example: officer comes into a house for domestic violence and arrests male or female as primary aggressor. At that point an intrusive search can be performed. These are also shaky because unless there is a threat of damage or deatruction to evidence then most judges prefer you to secure a signed warrant)

 

Caveat to warrants- there are also ways to avoid needig a warrant.

 

Plain sight doctrine- meaning is it could reasonably be seen by anyone who was not trying hard to see it then a warrant is not necessary. (A joint in the ash tray during a traffic stop) this also applies to you allowing them into your home for a totally different reason. Once inside if they see something that arrouses suspicion you just became involved.

 

Now my opinion- the forefathers wrote the constitution to protect our inalienable rights from the government. Do not give them up easily. I would never allow a search of anything freely. While few and far between, there are deeply dirty cops out there who may resort to planting evidence and such for whatever reason. I never want to make it easy to be a victim of that guy and you shouldnt either. They will wait for easier targets and not draw attention to their actions to argue with you. Some cops get buthurt and will give you the ticket if you say no, or comment "if you dont have anything to hide, why not?". Do not fall into their trap. The only benefit to that is if it is recorded it could and should be considered coercion by the court and thrown out. "Fruit of the illgotten tree" which is basically tainted evidence.

[Zombiehunter762 376]

Once they lock down a city my guess is a warrant is useless as tits on a boar hog.

I would have to say no. Since my pitbull hates Islamic extremist as much as I do.

Plus I would really like to know where they found ammo and what time the delivery is.

[Remek 771]

^^^exercise every right and do so publically if possible. Its when it is not so-exercised that we lose them. Plus, you have them for a reason. Cops can lie to you legally, and use it against you, so dont give up anything, ever.

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

All this from a couple of half assed trained poorly equipped kids... imagine for a second what that means.

 

As for the search, not without a proper warrant.

[Beretty 37]

Here's a better question. Would you allow yourself to be imprisoned in your own home? During a flood a couple years ago, I was at a bar because the other half the town was underwater. 2 cops came in around 9:30PM and said there was a 9 PM curfew and if we didn't go home immediately we would be arrested. I heard at least 5 people were cited for being out after curfew. I understand that they are trying to protect local businesses from being looted. But at the cost of our freedom? Not worth it.

[RED333 1,025]

Did a fast search and found this

http://en.wikipedia....ited_States_law

 

An exigent circumstance, in the American law of criminal procedure, allows law enforcement to enter a structure without a search warrant, or if they have a "knock and announce" warrant, without knocking and waiting for refusal under certain circumstances. It must be a situation where people are in imminent danger, evidence faces imminent destruction, or a suspect will escape.

In the criminal procedure context, exigent circumstance means:

An emergency situation requiring swift action to prevent imminent danger to life or serious damage to property, or to forestall the imminent escape of a suspect, or destruction of evidence. There is no ready

litmus test

for determining whether such circumstances exist, and in each case the extraordinary situation must be measured by the facts known by officials.

[1]

Those circumstances that would cause a reasonable person to believe that entry (or other relevant prompt action) was necessary to prevent physical harm to the officers or other persons, the destruction of relevant evidence, the escape of a suspect, or some other consequence improperly frustrating legitimate law enforcement efforts.

[2]

Exigent circumstances may make a warrantless search constitutional if probable cause exists. The existence of exigent circumstances is a mixed question of law and fact.^[3] There is no absolute test for determining if exigent circumstances exist, but general factors have been identified. These include: clear evidence of probable cause; the seriousness of the offense and likelihood of destruction of evidence; limitations on the search to minimize the intrusion only to preventing destruction of evidence; and clear indications of exigency.

Exigency may be determined by: degree of urgency involved; amount of time needed to get a search warrant; whether evidence is about to be removed or destroyed; danger at the site; knowledge of the suspect that police are on his or her trail; and/or ready destructibility of the evidence.^[4] In determining the time necessary to obtain a warrant, a telephonic warrant should be considered. As electronic data may be altered or eradicated in seconds, in a factually compelling case the doctrine of exigent circumstances will support a warrantless seizure.

Even in exigent circumstances, while a warrantless seizure may be permitted, a subsequent warrant to search may still be necessary.[5

[nlacy 692]

If the cops pull me over and ask to search my car, the answer is no thank you.

 

But if there's a terrorist loose in my neighborhood, sure I'll let the cops in. In this case I'd voluntarily invite them in and offer water, coffee, gatoraid and something to eat. Those guys are risking their lives out there.

[Remek 771]

Red, the avatar is just heinous!

If the cops pull me over and ask to search my car, the answer is no thank you.

 

But if there's a terrorist loose in my neighborhood, sure I'll let the cops in. In this case I'd voluntarily invite them in and offer water, coffee, gatoraid and something to eat. Those guys are risking their lives out there.

Then they see an empty shell, or one of your guns, and suddenly there is reason to tear apart everything, confiscate everything, and let it get sorted after. After all, with that arsenal, you are likely supply haji.

 

I understand your sentiment, but no, thank you.

[devildogdakota 804]

If I was there and they were coming door to door, I would be on top of my roof with a cooler full of donuts, and when they begun to approach my driveway, I would launch donuts with my clay pigeon disk launcher towards the asshole neighbor who lives behind me, in order to create a diversion which would most likely have a "wall" of cops heading for his home, which I'd hope by that time they have forgot to check my place.

[RED333 1,025]

If I was there and they were coming door to door, I would be on top of my roof with a cooler full of donuts, and when they begun to approach my driveway, I would launch donuts with my clay pigeon disk launcher towards the asshole neighbor who lives behind me, in order to create a diversion which would most likely have a "wall" of cops heading for his home, which I'd hope by that time they have forgot to check my place.

Best post today!!!

[MT Predator 2,294]

All this from a couple of half assed trained poorly equipped kids... imagine for a second what that means.

 

As for the search, not without a proper warrant.

How do you know they were half assed trained and poorly equipped? If they actually traveled back overseas and were training with Chechan rebels...

LEO involved in the firefights say both brothers stood their ground and actually advanced on them while returning fire. That is discipline right there. That either comes from insanity or good hard training. Chances are, both of them were not crazy by medical definition.

[thebuns1 4,323]

All this from a couple of half assed trained poorly equipped kids... imagine for a second what that means.

 

As for the search, not without a proper warrant.

How do you know they were half assed trained and poorly equipped? If they actually traveled back overseas and were training with Chechan rebels...

LEO involved in the firefights say both brothers stood their ground and actually advanced on them while returning fire. That is discipline right there. That either comes from insanity or good hard training. Chances are, both of them were not crazy by medical definition.

I agree with this., which is another reason why we need universal background checks on ALL immigrants to our land. Its too hard to say who trained with who, and what now days, and its not worth the price IMO.

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

You think these guys did what trained operators would have?

Do well made bombs not go off?

I will bet a box of 308 90% of the rounds expended were the Leos.

 

NOT well equipped, not well trained, results speak for themselves.

Evil but in the end incompetent boys.

 

Heh

Man people spook easy.