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Let me start by saying I really don't know anything about sights and optics (other than how to look through them) so any answers need to be un-technical, or at least have a good explanation of the technical details. Telling me that scope A has .06 better thingamajigs won't help me unless you tell me what thingamajigs do... :)

 

My first question would be, is there really any reason to put anything other than iron sights on a Saiga 12?

 

I see a lot of people putting red dot sights on theirs, but what does that really accomplish other than looking cool? And is there really much of a difference between one red dot to another that would be relevant in this application. I mean, it is a shotgun after all. I guess durability could be an issue...

 

My gun has a quad rail, so the existing iron sights are covered, although you can see them if you look under the top rail. This isn't the best setup though, so I'd like to either put new iron sights or something fancier on top. I'd prefer not to have to weld anything, but I have a Tromix monster break on the front so just clamping a front sight on wont' work. Would it work to mount a front sight on the top as far forward as possible? Do they make iron sights that clamp on to rails? I have the side mount rail with both side and top rails, that I'm not currently using but could use to mount stuff to.

 

Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.

 

 

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My first question would be, is there really any reason to put anything other than iron sights on a Saiga 12?

 

For practicality purposes irons on an S-12 is the way to go.

 

Would it work to mount a front sight on the top as far forward as possible? Do they make iron sights that clamp on to rails?

 

In your situation I would consider doing a number of things.

 

1. Changing your quad rail to a tri-rail and having someone weld HK front and rear sights. IMHO HK sights are the best setup for the S-12. I have two builds, one with the AK traditional sights and another with the HK setup. Hands down I love the HK sights. It's the only way to go for irons. Here's a link to what you would need. Get a smith to do the welding unless you have the required skills.

 

2. Change out your rail but this time for an extended quad rail and then put Chaos's HK sights on. Wait, he sells the setup as a kit.

 

3. Change out your rail for Chaos's Titan Quad Rail and attach the the Chaos HK sights. Couldn't find this option in stock at his website but look around. PM me if you are interested in this option as my buddy has the titan for sale. It's new as he ordered the wrong item. He needed the Vepr titan but bought the one for the S-12.

 

I am curious to what others will have to say. No way in hell would I put anything on my S-12 that requires batteries.

 

post-35052-0-69086600-1367178016_thumb.jpg

Edited by HighPlainsDrifter
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Hi

 

As HPD said, irons are very practical on a shotgun. Red dots are perhaps a bit faster, but usually require batteries, can be bulky, heavy and sometimes less durable than we'd like. The better ones typically cost more. Primary Arms is probably a good comprimise between price and durability. I have one on an RS Quick Detach side mount and enjoy it (more on my rifle than shotgun, but still). RS mounts are quite nice, IMO.

 

HK sights rock. I've got some waiting to go on my current S12 conversion (just have to get the front welded). Krebs sights are nice too, but you mentioned having a monster brake, so unless you take that off for a minute, the front Krebs won't slide on.

I've not tried the Chaos rail, but I know Cameron makes good stuff. I had one of his warthog brakes. Very solid piece of steel.

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Let me start by saying I really don't know anything about sights and optics (other than how to look through them) so any answers need to be un-technical, or at least have a good explanation of the technical details. Telling me that scope A has .06 better thingamajigs won't help me unless you tell me what thingamajigs do... smile.png

 

My first question would be, is there really any reason to put anything other than iron sights on a Saiga 12?

 

I see a lot of people putting red dot sights on theirs, but what does that really accomplish other than looking cool? And is there really much of a difference between one red dot to another that would be relevant in this application. I mean, it is a shotgun after all. I guess durability could be an issue...

 

My gun has a quad rail, so the existing iron sights are covered, although you can see them if you look under the top rail. This isn't the best setup though, so I'd like to either put new iron sights or something fancier on top. I'd prefer not to have to weld anything, but I have a Tromix monster break on the front so just clamping a front sight on wont' work. Would it work to mount a front sight on the top as far forward as possible? Do they make iron sights that clamp on to rails? I have the side mount rail with both side and top rails, that I'm not currently using but could use to mount stuff to.

 

Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.

 

I have the chaos titan quad rail with HK sights but the HK sights are low profile, so if you have a large break you might want to go with a different design. The advantage to having a red dot and iron sights is for quick target acquisition. Couple it with iron sights in case your battery dies, quick detach red dots are cool like that, where if youre using your saiga and batteries die, you can quickly remove the your optic and fall back on iron sights. if you have a large break you might want to look at flip up style irons.

 

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I have the chaos titan quad rail with HK sights but the HK sights are low profile, so if you have a large break you might want to go with a different design.

 

No worries, the sight picture on Chao's low profile HK sights will clear your monster break. I shamelessly got this pic off of one of Lone Star Arms thread to prove the point. What you do need to consider is what Corbin was mentioning about using the Krebs FSB and removing the brake before installing it. See 2nd picture for visual.

 

post-35052-0-57932900-1367196581_thumb.jpg

 

post-35052-0-44587700-1367196864_thumb.jpg

 

Here's the thread the pictures came from. I suggest lurking around and checking out possibly the S-12 picture thread to get some good ideas as well.

Edited by HighPlainsDrifter
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In the picture of the one with the holographic optic, is the front sight even necessary? If it is, wouldn't you still be able to use the HK sight?

 

That sight looks to be attached by the side mount rail. If the batteries were to run dry you could take the site off and use the irons. You could say it's a necessary level of redundancy.

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I suggest you use some of the sights you are considering. If you aren't sure you need it, you probably don't.

 

For red dots and holo sights, depending on design, they correct for visual misalignment and are more forgiving. Some let your eyes work together while open. If you practice with this, you can become faster. They are not best suited for longer range work, but neither is a shotty. You will notice that almost every competitor will run some kind of optic if his division lets him. There is a reason.

 

I personally love dinzag's FSB and wand a krebs style peep in the back. I like the HK front sight, but think the back sight is so-so. It is a matter of preference.

 

If I am slug shooting, I use the side rail and a conventional scope made for shotguns. Some people think this is absurd, but I can say with confidence that I absolutely shoot better at distance with it, and faster too. It is easier to shoot well when you can clearly see what you are shooting at. Irons block a lot of the field of view and take me more time to be sure of my shot at longer distances. The pistol sights on an IZ-109 are fairly unhelpful but I like them better than a bead alone. I love the combination of the IZ108 rail and a dinzag front sight, although I have added a line on the back surface to help with more precise aiming. I may add a peep some time too.

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I just have the Krebs sights on my S-12 and I am mostly happy with them. I don't care for the pinch bolt attachement of the front, because I find it unsightly, but it is effective in use.

 

I wouldn't get too hung up on the fact that you need batteries for a red dot, unless you are looking at buying a cheap one. I have an Aimpoint on one of my AKs, and its battery life is measured in years, if left on continuously. It mounts low enough that I get a co-witness of the irons through the red dot if it is off for some reason. If you are really worried about it, just change the battery early, once a year as a precaution.

 

OTOH, if I couldn't afford a good quality red dot, I would rather stick with irons than buy a cheapie.

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