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Starting a fresh precision build. Need all help I can get.


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Thanks guys. Ill see how classes go and decide If this is worth the investment. Think I was getting ahead of myself But i like to cover all areas and know what I'm getting into and what to expect ahead of time.

 

Ill be using my buddys rifle only to learn up to 500 yards then Im going to rent one of Sniper Co's rifles that is more set up for longer ranges.

Edited by Rayne
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Just to clarify. The 700 is a type of action not specific to Remington. It's the most common and popular action. I'm talking about buying an action based on the model 700, not buying some wannabe sako piece of shit tikka and modifying it. I like the Jense and Surgeon actions. Start with a good foundation, a good receiver.

 

Uhhh you know Sako and Tikka are the same company. That's like saying "ONE OF THOSE WANNABE SAVAGE PIECE OF SHIT STEVENS".... it's the same company the same gun.

 

This gun here will do everything you could ever want:

 

http://www.tikka.fi/t3models.php?supervarmint

 

IF you look on the website, they have Tikka and Sako listed at the top. As well as beretta and Suomi.

 

Also,

 

I know the 700 is a type of action. It is a shitty action that you spend thousands of dollars on to make as good as a stock Savage action.

 

 

http://www.sako.fi/sakotrgmodels.php?trg22

Edited by SN13
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Just to clarify. The 700 is a type of action not specific to Remington. It's the most common and popular action. I'm talking about buying an action based on the model 700, not buying some wannabe sako piece of shit tikka and modifying it. I like the Jense and Surgeon actions. Start with a good foundation, a good receiver.

 

Uhhh you know Sako and Tikka are the same company. That's like saying "ONE OF THOSE WANNABE SAVAGE PIECE OF SHIT STEVENS".... it's the same company the same gun.

 

This gun here will do everything you could ever want:

 

http://www.tikka.fi/t3models.php?supervarmint

 

IF you look on the website, they have Tikka and Sako listed at the top. As well as beretta and Suomi.

 

Also,

 

I know the 700 is a type of action. It is a shitty action that you spend thousands of dollars on to make as good as a stock Savage action.

 

 

http://www.sako.fi/sakotrgmodels.php?trg22

 

Thank-you Captain Obvious. Tikka is the cheap line of Sako. If the 700 action is shitty, why was my m24, surgeon, H&S and Jense all based off of it? Savage makes pretty good stuff but fucking seriously guy, we are talking precision rifles, not average hunting rifles. Thanks for the info on Sako, I shot the TRG-22 in Poland near the Slovak boarder. It's a great rifle. Miles away from the very best Tikka. The Tikka is a bargain rifle that cut corners on every piece of production. The rifle you listed sure as fuck will not do everything I ever wanted.

 

Here, since we are throwing around links... Here is a working rifle. http://www.surgeonrifles.com/rifles

Edited by Stryker0946
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Rayne, the exceptions to barrel wear would be in new tricks like melonite coatings, polygonal rifling etc. Additionally, moly bullets (not a fan personally) and just shooting lower velocity rounds will help save wear on your barrel. If you are pushing over 3,000 fps, then your max accuracy likely won't last as long as a rifle pushing out 2,600 fps. There are barrels that last closer to 5,000 and you may still keep sub MOA for even longer. However, the maximum accuracy potential is typically best between 200 rounds and 2,500 rounds on most barrels. The new stuff hasn't really been extensively used and tested enough to really take over the industry standards of Chrome Moly and Stainless barrels.

 

I will state that most people will never outshoot their rifles' accuracy capabilities on a good build.

 

If you walk away with anything, re-read what I just stated. There are numerous factors that play into it and the big two are the shooter's ability and the quality of ammo. A good rifle with its perfect load may be capable of sub quarter MOA, but most decent shooters can't do better than .5 to .75 MOA. At 3,000 rounds the rifle may then be only capable of .5-.75 MOA and the shooter wouldn't ever know that the capabilities of their rifle loosened that much.

 

The reason why I mentioned the Savage complete rifle is that you can actually work on it yourself and put in an aftermarket barrel if you want for less than $150 in parts/tools (wrench and match headspace gauges). This allows your investment to continue working for you, rather than having to sell it off and start over. I will say however that Savage typically has really good consistent barrels and the accu-trigger is awesome out of the box so you are getting a capable rifle up front to learn on. The action is not considered the best by the high-end builders, but it is very capable for the more budget minded shooter that wants to upgrade it later.

 

Remington puts out barrels that are very erratic, even on their 700P line (the tactical one with the bull barrel), so you might luck into a half MOA or you might get a 1.25-1.5 MOA shooter with match factory ammo (I've shot both and you are more likely going to run right around 1 MOA which is the best your rifle gets without barrel upgrades even with an HS Precision or McMillan stock). That is why I didn't recommend a factory 700 rifle to start with, plus the X trigger is not as nice as the Accu-Trigger out of the box, but it is adjustable if you know what you are doing.

 

Tikka's are guaranteed 3-Shot MOA at the factory and Sako's are guaranteed 5-Shot MOA at the factory. Cooper is another company that guarantees accuracy and they ship with a 30 yard 3 shot target of that rifle with the actual load used written on it. These rifles in the $550-$1800 range are more oriented towards hunting than long range tactical (with the exception of the TRG series from Sako), but if you are learning - the shooting skills are the same regardless of the ergonomics/stock/contour/interface differences.

 

700 and Surgeon Actions are probably the most widely used for precision rifle builds and will run from about $400-600+ for the actions themselves with no triggers/barrels/stocks or other components. So for about a few bucks more, you can get a complete rifle that you can upgrade later (namely the barrel and stock) that will get you through the basics of long range precision shooting. I have seen builders buy shitty used rifles for cheap to strip for the action alone. (ETA - decent triggers that are comparable to the AccuTrigger will run about $150-$200)

 

Lastly for every extra $1000 you spend on your rifle, you are not getting huge gains in accuracy potential. Consistent 5 shot groups at .6 MOA vs .45 MOA may cost you an additional $3,000 to get. You might get a more consistent cheekweld or trigger angle approach, but a good shooter will overcome the ergonomics of a rifle and still get the best out of a rifle whether it has a monte carlo hunting stock or an Accuracy International chassis.

 

.45 MOA and 1 MOA are both in the 10 inch circle at 1,000 yards if you do your part and read your environment correctly, which is a skill that your rifle's accuracy can't help with (unless you learn on a completely shitty rifle of course). A rifle is considered capable as a sniper rifle if it holds 1 MOA and many inexpensive factory rifles are completely capable of this and better.

Edited by BuffetDestroyer
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Just to clarify. The 700 is a type of action not specific to Remington. It's the most common and popular action. I'm talking about buying an action based on the model 700, not buying some wannabe sako piece of shit tikka and modifying it. I like the Jense and Surgeon actions. Start with a good foundation, a good receiver.

 

Uhhh you know Sako and Tikka are the same company. That's like saying "ONE OF THOSE WANNABE SAVAGE PIECE OF SHIT STEVENS".... it's the same company the same gun.

 

This gun here will do everything you could ever want:

 

http://www.tikka.fi/t3models.php?supervarmint

 

IF you look on the website, they have Tikka and Sako listed at the top. As well as beretta and Suomi.

 

Also,

 

I know the 700 is a type of action. It is a shitty action that you spend thousands of dollars on to make as good as a stock Savage action.

 

 

http://www.sako.fi/sakotrgmodels.php?trg22

 

Thank-you Captain Obvious. Tikka is the cheap line of Sako. If the 700 action is shitty, why was my m24, surgeon, H&S and Jense all based off of it? Savage makes pretty good stuff but fucking seriously guy, we are talking precision rifles, not average hunting rifles. Thanks for the info on Sako, I shot the TRG-22 in Poland near the Slovak boarder. It's a great rifle. Miles away from the very best Tikka. The Tikka is a bargain rifle that cut corners on every piece of production. The rifle you listed sure as fuck will not do everything I ever wanted.

 

Here, since we are throwing around links... Here is a working rifle. http://www.surgeonrifles.com/rifles

 

 

 

Just because aftermarket manufacturers of an action can MAKE awesome 700 actions, does not mean the 700 action is Awesome.

 

 

 

 

Yep a working rifle. All $5000 dollars of it.

 

Seriously? The dude's making his first Long Range gun and you're suggesting he drop $5000 on a Surgeon?

 

Buy a Stock rifle for $500-$1000. Put some decent glass on it $500-$1000 and practice. That will serve him better than buying a $5000 Surgeon.

 

 

 

 

 

Stryker has been drinking the Rem700 Koolaid.

 

My Saiga .308 outshot a dude's Rem700 at 200 yards. It was HILARIOUS.

 

 

 

Here are the steps to accuracy:

 

$600 - Buy a Savage, Shoot it. 1/2MOA

$800 - Buy a Tikka/Sako, Shoot it. 1/2MOA

 

$800 - Buy a Remington. Shoot it. 2MOA

$200 - Replace the stock. Shoot it. 1.5MOA

$100 - Bed the Action. Shoot it. 1MOA

$200 - True the bolt. Shoot it. 1/2 MOA

 

 

But by all means, get the shitty Remington. You'll feel great that you shoot the same action as (insert some stupid organization), until the dude with the stock Savage comes out and hands your ass to you for half the cost.

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I've had more then one Long Range comp shooter tell me that if they didn't have so much into their Rem700 or Win70 actions that they would start over with a Savage Model 12.

 

If I can ever get my pennies saved up for it, I'm going to take their advice and get Savage 12 LRP in 260 Rem.

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I've had more then one Long Range comp shooter tell me that if they didn't have so much into their Rem700 or Win70 actions that they would start over with a Savage Model 12.

 

If I can ever get my pennies saved up for it, I'm going to take their advice and get Savage 12 LRP in 260 Rem.

 

Excellent advice!

 

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/71098

 

smile.png

 

I'd settle for the 260 in this:

 

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/70995

 

But that's just me.

Edited by SN13
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Just to clarify. The 700 is a type of action not specific to Remington. It's the most common and popular action. I'm talking about buying an action based on the model 700, not buying some wannabe sako piece of shit tikka and modifying it. I like the Jense and Surgeon actions. Start with a good foundation, a good receiver.

 

Uhhh you know Sako and Tikka are the same company. That's like saying "ONE OF THOSE WANNABE SAVAGE PIECE OF SHIT STEVENS".... it's the same company the same gun.

 

This gun here will do everything you could ever want:

 

http://www.tikka.fi/t3models.php?supervarmint

 

IF you look on the website, they have Tikka and Sako listed at the top. As well as beretta and Suomi.

 

Also,

 

I know the 700 is a type of action. It is a shitty action that you spend thousands of dollars on to make as good as a stock Savage action.

 

 

http://www.sako.fi/sakotrgmodels.php?trg22

 

Thank-you Captain Obvious. Tikka is the cheap line of Sako. If the 700 action is shitty, why was my m24, surgeon, H&S and Jense all based off of it? Savage makes pretty good stuff but fucking seriously guy, we are talking precision rifles, not average hunting rifles. Thanks for the info on Sako, I shot the TRG-22 in Poland near the Slovak boarder. It's a great rifle. Miles away from the very best Tikka. The Tikka is a bargain rifle that cut corners on every piece of production. The rifle you listed sure as fuck will not do everything I ever wanted.

 

Here, since we are throwing around links... Here is a working rifle. http://www.surgeonrifles.com/rifles

 

 

 

Just because aftermarket manufacturers of an action can MAKE awesome 700 actions, does not mean the 700 action is Awesome.

 

 

 

 

Yep a working rifle. All $5000 dollars of it.

 

Seriously? The dude's making his first Long Range gun and you're suggesting he drop $5000 on a Surgeon?

 

Buy a Stock rifle for $500-$1000. Put some decent glass on it $500-$1000 and practice. That will serve him better than buying a $5000 Surgeon.

 

 

 

 

 

Stryker has been drinking the Rem700 Koolaid.

 

My Saiga .308 outshot a dude's Rem700 at 200 yards. It was HILARIOUS.

 

 

 

Here are the steps to accuracy:

 

$600 - Buy a Savage, Shoot it. 1/2MOA

$800 - Buy a Tikka/Sako, Shoot it. 1/2MOA

 

$800 - Buy a Remington. Shoot it. 2MOA

$200 - Replace the stock. Shoot it. 1.5MOA

$100 - Bed the Action. Shoot it. 1MOA

$200 - True the bolt. Shoot it. 1/2 MOA

 

 

But by all means, get the shitty Remington. You'll feel great that you shoot the same action as (insert some stupid organization), until the dude with the stock Savage comes out and hands your ass to you for half the cost.

 

Damn dude, you're dumb. I was showing an example of a rifle that will do what I need. Surgeon makes actions as well. I told the OP to start with a good 700 action. Many people out there make one. This guy is building a precision rifle, not buying a hunting rifle like a tikka or a savage.

 

You get your dope from a slide rule and wing it. It's a waste even conversing with you. I'm talking precision rifles and you suggest he just buys a fucking savage.

 

I'd outshoot you high as a kite with open sights. Silly.

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LOL!

 

I love how you try to discount Savage and Tikka by saying Walmart and Gander mtn.

 

WOO! Buy that $1300 Action and build away!

 

Don't complain when the $900 Savage 12LRP outshoots it!

 

haha.gifhaha.gifhaha.gifhaha.gifhaha.gifhaha.gifhaha.gifhaha.gif

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