Latest test

[Capt Nemo 882]

Still not wanting to cycle 3 dram target loads. I went back to the factory plug from the auto plug. The Kicklite stock makes NO difference, as I still had the same jams when I fully compressed the stock spring before firing. I did get 1 to stovepipe, but that was the only time a round hit the ejector. The rest just mash like the one pictured.

 

 

There are a few other things I want to polish yet after looking at the action and how it works. The bolt is going to get a new facet above the small facet where the number is stamped. This should smooth out the hammer overtravel point there. The next is the trigger where the hammer rubs during reset. The back of the hammer where it rubs on both the trigger and disconnector. And the top of the disconnector.

 

Boring out the ports will be the last thing I do. But I'll probably have to do it.

 

I think the slugs through the polychoke straightened the alignment problem there. The choke is now aligned to the barrel, and the choke adjusts easier. The choke collet might have been misaligned when assembled. I'll have to recheck patterning.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Capt Nemo

[Capt Nemo 882]

This test fire did better than last time out. Last time the hulls were only half way out of the chamber and the carrier was rubbing hard on the ejector.

[Sdustin 578]

Cool. Did you get that awesome poly choke that looks like a flash hider. And I would polish everything and i think I've seen where people will polish and or mod the barrel hood. I don't know what is needed or done to that but I'm sure you can look it up.

[dubya 198]

Cool. Did you get that awesome poly choke that looks like a flash hider. And I would polish everything and i think I've seen where people will polish and or mod the barrel hood. I don't know what is needed or done to that but I'm sure you can look it up.

 

What you're talking about the barrel hood that's to help feeding the short low brass shells. I think sometime in 2011 Izhmash started extending the barrel hood a little bit to keep the shorter shells under it and feeding well, mines a 2012 and it had the extension from the factory. Here's a picture of another members from 2009 that did the extension himself, just posting to clarify that's what the "barrel hood mod" is for.

[Capt Nemo 882]

This is the Polychoke I put on mine.

 

[travistp 63]

Quit wasteing your time and bore out the ports. I couldnt get target loads to even pull out of the chamber. I did notice after profiling and polishing the internals I would atlwast get the occasional stovepipe. Open the ports and havent looked back since. Eats everything. Just so it. All u need are hand tools.

[dubya 198]

Quit wasteing your time and bore out the ports. I couldnt get target loads to even pull out of the chamber. I did notice after profiling and polishing the internals I would atlwast get the occasional stovepipe. Open the ports and havent looked back since. Eats everything. Just so it. All u need are hand tools.

This is one thing I'll actually agree with travistp on, open the ports and be done with it. The whole process can be done in an hour with a hammer, mallet, taps, drill & bit. Do it and shoot it.

[HighPlainsDrifter 466]

 

Quit wasteing your time and bore out the ports. I couldnt get target loads to even pull out of the chamber. I did notice after profiling and polishing the internals I would atlwast get the occasional stovepipe. Open the ports and havent looked back since. Eats everything. Just so it. All u need are hand tools.

This is one thing I'll actually agree with travistp on, open the ports and be done with it. The whole process can be done in an hour with a hammer, mallet, taps, drill & bit. Do it and shoot it.

 

 

Time to turn this into a WTF thread...

 

WTF, you haven't drilled the ports? Polish all you want, the only things spinning is your dremel and your mind. Go ahead and do your bolt profile but also take a look at those ports.

[Spacehog 2,218]

I have to agree. I waited along time before removing the GB and drilling out the ports on mine. Somehow it was just too intimidating. It took all of 30-45 minutes to do, and was one of the easiest mods I have done. I wasted alot of time, expense, and effort trying everything else to get it to cycle. Haven't had a single FTE with any ammunition since drilling them out.

[travistp 63]

.073 4 port

.093 3 port

Edited May 18, 2013 by travistp

[Capt Nemo 882]

I'm still going to save porting for last!

 

I've learned more about the action and the effects of how things work that way.

[travistp 63]

You will accomplish nothing but a smoother action. ITS EASY to do the ports man... and you can let the gun smooth the action for you when it starts running right. COME ON NEMO! DO IT DO IT DO IT!

[Castalia 19]

You mentioned that the carrier is still dragging on the ejector. Take the recoil spring and bolt out of the carrier. Then put the carrier back into the weapon. Slide the carrier back and forth on the rails and see if it hangs up on the ejector. It should slide smoothly into battery and out without dragging on anything but the hammer. You might have to hold down the hammer to see if the ejector is cleared. If the carrier is dragging on the ejector that might be what is taking alot of the firing inertia and could be causing your problem. If so you might want a qualified gunsmith take a look at your weapon.

Edited May 19, 2013 by Castalia

[Capt Nemo 882]

I already milled out the carrier channel and removed the ejector rubbing problem. Slides with no effort now.

 

After working on it last night, I found that the extractor notch is cut a little too narrow, and causes part of the hangup there. I might be able to needle file it wider. With the ramp already polished, it's down to that and spring tension. I'm not going to touch the spring.

 

One other thought is, that I did carve out a channel in the tri-rail to vent to one of the holes. It may be dumping too much gas from the relief port.

 

I'm going to try to test again tomorrow, with both forearms. If it still hangs, it will be time to get out the carbide number drills.

[dubya 198]

You will accomplish nothing but a smoother action. ITS EASY to do the ports man... and you can let the gun smooth the action for you when it starts running right. COME ON NEMO! DO IT DO IT DO IT!

Yes, do it! And Memo. If you need help getting the gas block off just see if one of the more well known members here will come over and help you. Lolololololol.

[travistp 63]

 

You will accomplish nothing but a smoother action. ITS EASY to do the ports man... and you can let the gun smooth the action for you when it starts running right. COME ON NEMO! DO IT DO IT DO IT!

Yes, do it! And Memo. If you need help getting the gas block off just see if one of the more well known members here will come over and help you. Lolololololol.

Hes exactly right. I never messed with a saiga let alone or a ak platform and I was worried about hand drilling the holes and not doing it on a mill. I took mine to jet but he couldnt get gas block off so I went home and after 3 punchs and a run to lowes for a small sledge. Dowel pins finally came out. Gas block was a few taps off and boom. 5 minutes of drilling and re wacking everything back on and she runs like a champ. But Jet gave me the drills as my shop doing have cobalt drills that small and my shop only has highspeed steel bits. But he did give me a look at how polish/profile job from tac-47 looks and I think I got mine pretty damn close to how they do theres with pictures from here. On top of doing this with my 1 yr old daughter crawling all over me haha.

 

Dubya.. go "troll" somewhere else?

Edited May 20, 2013 by travistp

[dubya 198]

No trolling going on here, just don't want Nemo to wreck his gas block if he didn't know what to do.

[travistp 63]

Lol its really hard to wreck one when its just dowels pins holding in place. Wreck a dowel pin... maaybbbee but as long as the diameter of the punch is smaller than the dowel pin and you dont miss the punch on your swings. He should be fine.

[Sdustin 578]

The answer to all your feeding problems!

[Capt Nemo 882]

All you "PORT IT!" guys can SUCK IT!!!!!!

 

Just got in from test firing, and the results are.....

 

Mag 1 3 rounds mashed like before, 7 stovepipes.

Mag 2 1 mash, 1 ejected and FTF, 3 stovepipes, 5 cycled.

Mag 3 Changed back to tri rail, 2 FTF, 8 cycled.

Mag 4 Full cycle!!!!!!!!!

Mag 5 2 FTF, 8 cycled.

 

SHE'S CYCLING AND I'M STILL ON THE FACTORY PORTS!!!

 

There's still a few areas I want to touch up yet, but at least she's starting to eat Federal bulk. If I do decide to port, I may only need to open 1 port to .078 and keep the rest factory. Good lesson on how far smoothing out the action can take you.

Edited May 20, 2013 by Capt Nemo

[HighPlainsDrifter 466]

Damn you are stubborn. You're having failures left and right and you tell us to suck it. Tsk, tsk...

Edited May 20, 2013 by HighPlainsDrifter

[Spacehog 2,218]

Capt, personally I dont care whether you open up the ports on your gun or not. It's your gun, you can do with it what you like. Since you started the thread looking for advice, I simply shared what took care of the problem on mine. I had a three port gun and all of those ports were smaller than the factory spec of .093. I wouldn't be excited about 1 mag out of five running flawlessly, but if you are happy with it and continue to enjoy polishing and tinkering with it, then by all means go ahead.

[Capt Nemo 882]

But things went from NOT CYCLING AT ALL to CYCLING!

[Spacehog 2,218]

No doubt the polishing helps smooth out the action and provides less resistance. For some people, it takes care of the cycling issue. For me it did not. It got it close. I could shoot Remy bulk packs all day, federal was about 90%. When I went to a Chaos Titan XL, the cycling issues started all over again. That's when I opened the ports to what they were supposed to be out of the factory. In short, if your ports are undersized and your gun is undergassed, polishing and reducing cycling resistance is only going to do so much. At some point you may have to address the problem of being undergassed to get it to run 100%.

[travistp 63]

Polishing and profiling got me shooting estate dove load with 1 fte after being about 5-6 fte out of a 10rd stick. Drum wouldnt work at all with it. Federal would fte winchester would fte. I opened mine to .073.. all 4 ports. Now I can cycle 1 oz. Or 7/8 oz federal/winchester universal. You name it it spits it out. It will even cycle my drum now with the shittiest of ammo. .078 is easier because 5/64 is easy to pick up.. .073 gets everything running on mine. Reason I wantes to stay .073 instead of .078 is when im shooting 3" magnums. Not being the piss out of me or my trunnion. But as mentioned above. Whatever makes you happy. I know I got tired of pulling shells out when trying to have a lil fun .

[dubya 198]

I had a factory 4 port, opened them up and also added a 5th smaller port. I can fire Winchester low brass from my hip, Auto plug and MD20 but when I shoot high brass or install the factory puck and shoot 3" loads I have no damage to the trunnion and it is very manageable recoil wise

[Nephilim7 107]

Leave the guy alone. Some of you have more than shared your opinion. Time to back off a bit.

 

I have never had my gas block off my gun, and unsupported, it chews thru Winchester Universal from an MD20.

 

Some prefer a careful, finesse approach to tuning (myself included). You guys hammering and forcing him to take your way or the highway reminds me of the way you treat your guns. If you don't get the result you want, you (sometimes savagely) drill and hammer until you get your way... There are other ways to skin a cat.

 

By the way, since when is .093" a "factory spec" for three ports? I have not heard that if it is. My understanding is that it is a consensus agreed upon by some on the forum... Man-Caused Global Warming is also a consensus; doesn't mean it's right. Science, when subject to consensus is Tyranny.

 

Also, understand that polishing has very little to do with cycling of the gun. Polishing can smooth a trigger pull and can help with ease of cleaning and aesthetics. However, PROFILE (geometry) of interfacing surfaces makes a world of difference in the cycling of the action. Leave the metal of the internals rough if you want (retains oil better). Just be sure to correct the angles in the right places.

 

Keep up the great work, Capt Nemo! I like your style. Sounds like you are doing very well. Don't worry if you wind up drilling a little. Sometimes, it is necessary. Although, it's certainly not as necessary as some would have you believe. Keep us updated.

[Capt Nemo 882]

Thanks Nephilim! I want to take cleaning up the action as far as possible first. Then I'll add gas if needed! That way I have less chance of overgassing when I use heavy rounds. With it starting to cycle bulk, I may be able to get slug/magnum 2 3/4" rounds to cycle on #1, as they didn't before.

 

During cleaning tonight, I touched up the carrier at the front where it recontacts the hammer, as there was a little peening, and also chamfered/deburred the hammer where it would contact. I also did a little more work on the new facet I made on the bolt. This facet helps the bolt override the hammer easier. This is similar to the reprofiling done by others. I did note that the locking lugs are hanging up at times, and did stone them lightly. May have to work on the trunnion a little to make the lock smoother. Didn't touch the feed ramp yet, but it has been needle filed down a bit. It could use a stoning to give it a shine.

 

I love having all the Arkansas stones that I had in my military armorer's tool box. They make things much easier, and the fine white stones give a milky mirror finish. Best of all, while they cut fast, they don't go too fast like a Dremel, and allow finess.

 

Anyhow, loading all the mags tonight, for another run tomorrow if I get good weather!

[HighPlainsDrifter 466]

\With it starting to cycle bulk, I may be able to get slug/magnum 2 3/4" rounds to cycle on #1, as they didn't before.

Did I read this correctly? Your build doesn't cycle high brass on setting one? Is it correct to say it doesn't cycle at all on setting one? My friend, I'm afraid you are going to give us "Port It" guys the last laugh.

 

I hear what Nephilem7 is saying. I just don't appreciate being told to "suck it" when we're only trying to help. That's kinda probing a stick in the bee's nest. Natural consequences will tell you that your only going to get stung.

Edited May 21, 2013 by HighPlainsDrifter

[gunfun 3,931]

.073 4 port

.093 3 port

 

.073 4 port

 

.078 4 port

 

Bigger if needed to a max of .093" for any port.

 

30* angle or flatter. (20* would be better as long as they won't be running into each other.)