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Now that the Vepr-12 Folder is here.. lets talk 922r


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Ok here is a list I got from the AK Files on 922r Parts.

 

Here is my question: What parts are out there and what are you guys

planning on swaping out to make it 922r legal.


+1 Although it seems backwards, you should never go by a count of the US parts. Based on 922r the BATF will not count US parts, only the number of imported parts. Look at the list of 922r countable parts and count how many foreign parts from the list are on your rifle. If 10 or less you are good to go no matter how many US parts are on on it.

(a) No person shall assemble a semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun using more than 10 of the imported parts listed in paragraph © of this section if the assembled firearm is prohibited from importation under section 925(d)(3) as not being particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes.

Paragraph © defines the following parts as "countable" under the law:
(1) Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings *
(2) Barrels *
(3) Barrel extensions
(4) Mounting blocks (trunions) *
(5) Muzzle attachments *
(6) Bolts *
(7) Bolt carriers *
(8) Operating rods
(9) Gas pistons *
(10) Trigger housings
(11) Triggers *
(12) Hammers *
(13) Sears
(14) Disconnectors *
(15) Buttstocks *
(16) Pistol grips *
(17) Forearms, handguards *
(18) Magazine bodies *
(19) Followers *
(20) Floorplates *

 

Sharky

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The question for me regarding this is since last years court ruling against the ATF on importation of firearms in "sporting configuration", i wonder how valid 922® comiance is. In the law is clearly states "firearms prohibited from inportation as not particuralary fitting sportin purposes", but the court ruled that is crap so it seems that it would essentially nullify this section of the USC as well. We have had pistol grip configured semi auto imported shotguns coming in that are in direct violation of this section as i see it.

 

Would be interestsd to hear from any legal council we have around here on this matter.

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You just swap one US made part for another to keep the count.

 

Like on my S12 the foregrip is OEM, modified with vents and a picatinny rail. So I swapped the foregrip for another US made part (I actually have more US made parts for 922r than I need, seems to be a common thing for me. What can I say, we make good stuff in this country.).

 

So if you went pistol grip you could add a US made pistol grip, which is one thing I did, a US made stock, Hammer, discon, and trigger.

 

This puts me at 10 imported not counting the usual US made puck I run for better gas efficiency and the commonly ran US mags plus the US made thread protector "muzzle attachment".

 

If I wanna run the OEM imported puck for 3in shells with the imported factory 5 round mag I still can, no big deal.

 

So you just swap one part as US made for another to keep the imported count in the green light area. It's no big deal.

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I ordered

 

ATI Saiga Scorpion Pistol Grip from amazon.com carolinashooterssupply.com was out of stock

 

and from carolinashooterssupply.com

 

2 VEPR 12 SGM 12 RD MAGAZINE

1 GAS PISTON VEPR 12 PUC made in usa

1 TRIGGER GROUP- MODIFIED SAIGA/VEPR FIRE CONTROL GROUP made in usa

 

They should get here Wednesday and my Vepr should get here Thursday smile.png from Royal Tiger imports. So Friday morning I will be at my metal fab shop cutting the flipping weld smile.png I sure hope my weld looks like the posted pics.

I would think even with a russian mag I am still compliant with the above parts.

 

Woot my first AK platform weapon I can't wait!!!!! Like a kid the day before Christmas

 

Wow my avatar from a salt water aquarium form seems to have followed me how did that happen LOL

 

 

fixed the AR to AK

Edited by ShadyVepr
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You mean AK right? lol :D

 

That's why my statement above my pic says "You CAN do it yourself." You just gotta think. Way to go. Make sure you choose the right welder. Stick will burn right through 1mm to 1.5mm sheet metal. Try a TIG welder. It won't produce as much heat and would be better suited for both a more cosmetic looking weld and not burning through the sheet metal.

 

I just got done learning to stick weld myself last week. Gotta have the hours put in for my Machinist diploma.

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  • 10 months later...

Bump!

 

I am also extremely confused on this as the Veprs are now being sold in basically complete mil spec right from arsenal, atlantic, etc... In order for these to be sold with folding stocks and pistol grips, they should be good to go, right? Or is it just mag count now? Can I just go out and buy an 8 round mag for this factory configuration? Very confusing from when I started building Saigas 5 years ago

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A clarification?  The items without an asterisk are NOT on a Vepr-12? 

 

(1) Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings *
(2) Barrels *
(3) Barrel extensions
(4) Mounting blocks (trunions) *
(5) Muzzle attachments *
(6) Bolts *
(7) Bolt carriers *
(8) Operating rods
(9) Gas pistons *
(10) Trigger housings
(11) Triggers *
(12) Hammers *
(13) Sears
(14) Disconnectors *
(15) Buttstocks *
(16) Pistol grips *
(17) Forearms, handguards *
(18) Magazine bodies *
(19) Followers *
(20) Floorplates *

 

So here's the pieces for our Vepr-12:

(1) Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings *
(2) Barrels *
(3) Mounting blocks (trunions) *
(4) Muzzle attachments *
(5) Bolts *
(6) Bolt carriers *
(7) Gas pistons *
(8) Triggers *
(8) Hammers *
(9) Disconnectors *
(10) Buttstocks *
(11) Pistol grips *
(12) Forearms, handguards *
(13) Magazine bodies *
(14) Followers *
(15) Floorplates *

 

I've replaced the Mags, Forearms, Pistol grip, Buttstock, Triggers, Muzzle attachment, and gas pistons.  Giving me 7 domestic and 8 foreign parts.  I think I'm compliant.

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So I have a question when do you need us parts legally. When you want to fold the stock or when you want more than 5 rounds? Also I thought when you put a pistol grip on a saiga12 You had to abide by 922r if thats the case then the vepr12 is in violation as imported since it has a pistol grip.

 

Has any one been arrested for a 922r violation?

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The quick and dirty answer is if you change something then the gun needs to be 922r compliant. That includes just swaping the factory mag with a non factory size mag.

and cutting the weld on the folding stock is a definate candidate so before you cut it you need to make it 922r compliant. The chances of ever being nailed for falling to meet 922r is slim but if you use the weapon in a defencive manner you can bet that it will be looked at with a microscope and you had better hope it is compliant.

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So I have a question when do you need us parts legally. When you want to fold the stock or when you want more than 5 rounds? Also I thought when you put a pistol grip on a saiga12 You had to abide by 922r if thats the case then the vepr12 is in violation as imported since it has a pistol grip.

 

Has any one been arrested for a 922r violation?

Never even been one charge.

 

Stupid law that was designed to give American manufactures a piece of the import business that the ATF and people who obsess over an unenforceable law spend far too much time worrying about. That and retailers are taking advantage of it by labeling things as "922r compliant" as if it makes a difference.

 

I dare anyone to look at their parts and tell me their country of origin. Couldn't even do it without a significant metallurgy test and even then there's little likelihood you could tell even then.

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Still doesnt explain why 922r was always stated to apply if you converted a saiga12 but the vepr12 is a pistol grip.

congress said in that farm bill add on that killed atfs fun a couple years back that atf couldnt say dick about importing shotguns. and atf had said that pistol grips WERE infact sporting. so amidst all that hullaboloo we got to a better place with imported shotguns vs worse... very strange tho, govt doesnt typically swing that way (favor of the gun folks)

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Still doesnt explain why 922r was always stated to apply if you converted a saiga12 but the vepr12 is a pistol grip.

congress said in that farm bill add on that killed atfs fun a couple years back that atf couldnt say dick about importing shotguns. and atf had said that pistol grips WERE infact sporting. so amidst all that hullaboloo we got to a better place with imported shotguns vs worse... very strange tho, govt doesnt typically swing that way (favor of the gun folks)

Good to know. And it seems like 922r shouldnt apply to shotguns at all then huh?

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Only way I could order a Vepr 12 was to have it come with a BB installed and fixed folder. My FFL said they'd reject the shipment if it didn't come with those. Now with the addition to the stock 5rd mag, if I slap a 10rd mag on will I still be compliant? Yes I'm in Ca.

Only way I could order a Vepr 12 was to have it come with a BB installed and fixed folder. My FFL said they'd reject the shipment if it didn't come with those. Now with the addition to the stock 5rd mag, if I slap a 10rd mag on will I still be compliant? Yes I'm in Ca..

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Only way I could order a Vepr 12 was to have it come with a BB installed and fixed folder. My FFL said they'd reject the shipment if it didn't come with those. Now with the addition to the stock 5rd mag, if I slap a 10rd mag on will I still be compliant? Yes I'm in Ca.

Only way I could order a Vepr 12 was to have it come with a BB installed and fixed folder. My FFL said they'd reject the shipment if it didn't come with those. Now with the addition to the stock 5rd mag, if I slap a 10rd mag on will I still be compliant? Yes I'm in Ca..

I'm sorry for your loss........... of freedom

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Vgnope, If you put any magazine in the VEPR with a higher capacity than the original sporting configuration (5rd), then you no longer have a 922r compliant gun. So if you want to put any 8 or 10 rounders in, you need to make sure you swap out enough parts to keep compliance. I'm picking up mine later today and have all my 922r parts ready to go. Also in ca.

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New to the forum. I'm just looking over the worthless 922r rules for my new Vepr 12 arriving at the FFL on Tuesday. It seems to me that if I shoot it as it comes with the weld on the folding stock I'm fine. As soon as I cut the weld or start dressing it up the parts guys wanted to make sure my order was big enough. Is that about right?

Edited by want2skydive
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  • 7 months later...
 

Hey 

 

I was looking for a buttstock for my Vepr 12 Molot. Wanted to  obtain a collapsible

and if possible side folding stock, but most of available options required a special adaptor.

Chinese products were not taken into account as in the past already had some issues with them.

After a detailed search i've found this option from Israeli company Fab-Defence:

 


 

I am familiar with their products for a quite a long time, but now they got a buttstock with adaptor

for Vepr built-in. In the buttstock there is shock-absorbing system and T6 hard anodized aluminum buffer tube.

Everything has passed very smoothly and after the order has been made in 2 days the parcel was sent out.

 

In case you look for improvement and tuning of your rifle i warmly suggest to consider this option.

post-50074-0-93989500-1418763999_thumb.jpg

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