Sdustin 578 Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 That's a total miss conception about giving up your rights under the 4TH. The ATF can ask you to produce the weapon at whatever time, they will call and make an appointment to meet you and they CAN NOT enter your house with no warrant. Lots of people they don't really know have spread that around and it's flatly false. 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Remek 771 Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 I believe its in the UK, where if you have ANY gun, they can come in unannounced and inspect your safe and its contents. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DLT 1,646 Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 Ask Mayor Bloomberg. He probably owns a few of the weapons and items you are seeking and is well versed in the laws. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Remek 771 Posted May 30, 2013 Report Share Posted May 30, 2013 ^^^^^ Sadly, I bet it true. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MAAnew 162 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 Where in Mississippi are you located? I'm from Mississippi and I'm wanting to go about getting my license to get a fully auto gun and silencers any one know the rules?How much does it cost?Is it a one time payment or do you renew it?Is it very hard to get? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 The quicken trust is a terrible idea for gun stuff. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 That's a total miss conception about giving up your rights under the 4TH. The ATF can ask you to produce the weapon at whatever time, they will call and make an appointment to meet you and they CAN NOT enter your house with no warrant. Lots of people they don't really know have spread that around and it's flatly false. Well, you said something right finally. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sdustin 578 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 Give me a break GunFun. WgG was I wrong about? Quiken? I know lawers that use a template. In fact for most things they use a template you think they compose 12 pages of bullshit everytime they write a trust or will? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RedChallenger 149 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I did my SBR and suppressor the individual route with no problems. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sdustin 578 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I would do individual as well. I thought the only reason to go with a trust is if your PD would g sign off on it. And they are supposed to do away with it, again I'll believe it when I see it but the silencer shooting association fought fit that and got it. I would do individual as well. I thought the only reason to go with a trust is if your PD would g sign off on it. And they are supposed to do away with it, again I'll believe it when I see it but the silencer shooting association fought fit that and got it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Taive 0 Posted May 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I went to a local gun smith/ dealer and got the news. I can get my class 3 license but it's 500 dollars and as mentioned the Feds can come into your gun store home or anything you own with no warrant and search it. But if you are just wanting one silencer a 200$ tax stamp can be given to get it but its about a 1.5 year waiting period on getting it Where in Mississippi are you located? I'm from Mississippi and I'm wanting to go about getting my license to get a fully auto gun and silencers any one know the rules? How much does it cost? Is it a one time payment or do you renew it? Is it very hard to get? Brookhaven about a hour south of jackson Quote Link to post Share on other sites
filthygovemploye 64 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 (edited) listen to dave ramsey? i will ask some questions... 1 how much debt do you have? 2 how much do you make? 3 is retirement funded like others have asked? as you have heard, and see on the frnt page of sgn, everyone wants to buy MG's, dealers are counting on registry never being opened again, and more and more folks are realizing that it is legal, with the tax stamp... i say go for it, if ya can afford it. as folks have said in the past, their $40k f250 was a bad investment, in 1985 the mac, sturmghewer and mp40 were GREAT investments... yes, the license for dealers is $500. you are not dealing, you are collecting, so its a 1 time tax stamp of 200 on mgs and silencers, and 5 on aows.... the thing ya gotta watch out for is all the extra paperwork prep fees. i got lucky and have a trust made up by major malfunction in okc....go slow, google "NFA paperwork" etc adn you will get there Edited May 31, 2013 by filthygovemploye Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shandlanos 1,470 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 I went to a local gun smith/ dealer and got the news. I can get my class 3 license but it's 500 dollars and as mentioned the Feds can come into your gun store home or anything you own with no warrant and search it. But if you are just wanting one silencer a 200$ tax stamp can be given to get it but its about a 1.5 year waiting period on getting it Where in Mississippi are you located? I'm from Mississippi and I'm wanting to go about getting my license to get a fully auto gun and silencers any one know the rules? How much does it cost? Is it a one time payment or do you renew it? Is it very hard to get? Brookhaven about a hour south of jackson The FFL/SOT is only legit if you are actually going into business. If you get an FFL/SOT solely to be a collector/hobbyist, without actually doing business, you are violating federal law and you will lose your license. The only FFL for collectors is the C&R license, and it does allow you to receive C&R items, including Title II items (silencers, machine guns etc.) across state lines - it does not allow you to receive non-C&R items in interstate transit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted May 31, 2013 Report Share Posted May 31, 2013 Give me a break GunFun. WgG was I wrong about? Quiken? I know lawers that use a template. In fact for most things they use a template you think they compose 12 pages of bullshit everytime they write a trust or will? Yes lawyers use forms, but knowing which template and keeping it updated and tailoring sections is the difference. (Think of the old story about Henry ford and the hammer.) Quicken and similar have lots of clauses that don't help and are missing lots of very important things that can prevent an "instant felon" situation for your heirs, or allow flexibility to transfer slowly when there are problems with ATF process, etc. Quicken templates and similar are designed for a specific purpose, namely handing off houses and normal property. They are not designed to make sure that you can avoid doing transfers, or transfer within ATF rules. They are not designed to protect the privacy of your assets. There are a lot of issues i.e what about 'grandfathered firearms' what about items that are not transferrable?... I've seen some self executed trusts on some NFA specific forums that did OK for what the law was at the time, but the average person does not have the resources to check if a form like that catches all the important areas and still complies with all the rules. There are NFA trust lawyers who charge flat fees for a few hundred dollars. There are NFA trust specialists who charge more. I'd take either of those over a generic form, or a lawyer who does not normally deal with this kind of thing. To the Floor on this forum has this as part of his practice. He is affiliated with the big name in the field, so when you use him, his forms that he starts from (a laywer does more than just fill in the blanks) will be some of the best and most up to date info on the topic. I don't have any business interest in this field, but I hope to someday make it a side gig. I am not a fan of big or unnecessary legal fees. You don't need a lawyer for everything, but this is an area that makes a lot of sense to have one. It is bizzare to me how many people spend a lifetime of work amassing an estate and then risk losing a substantial portion of it to taxes by trying to save a few hundred dollars. Odds are if you actually have a use for a can, you will spend more money on ammo per year than getting a decent trust set up. And once it is set up, you can keep using it, often without ever needing more professional help to change it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RedChallenger 149 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) "But if you are just wanting one silencer a 200$ tax stamp can be given to get it but its about a 1.5 year waiting period on getting it " No, It takes 6-7 months. Edited June 1, 2013 by RedChallenger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Remek 771 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Question: What happens in the case of your death, if your local sheriff signed off? Can it legally go to your other family member(s)? I know with the trust, you have certain protections, but with the sheriff, could it be that they suddenly possess an illegal weapon/silencer/whatever. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sdustin 578 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 If you die it can be legally be left to your heir just like any other property. It will still have to be transferred within the NFA but it will be a tax free transfer. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sdustin 578 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 The really fucked up thing about the NFA is there was written into the law allotment for amnesty periods so that if say your grand pappy died and there was an mg42 and a collection of Tommy guns and mp40s you never knew about a d didn't know if they were legal. Chances are he's got paper work and they are legal, currently in this situation you have three options destroy them, sell them on the black market, give them away. If you show up at the police station and ask hey Is my machine-gun legal? You go to jail. The registey is so jacked up the ATF doesnt even have the paper work on some items and only know they legal when they see your paper work. In the late 80's to early 90's there were people selling blank machine gun forms and people would fill in the blanks make a illegal gun legal. And the ATF didn't even know. That was illegal of course. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Question: What happens in the case of your death, if your local sheriff signed off? Can it legally go to your other family member(s)? I know with the trust, you have certain protections, but with the sheriff, could it be that they suddenly possess an illegal weapon/silencer/whatever. That is a major point of a good trust. I am a bit rusty on this, but from what I recall without a trust, the transfer to your heir can occur without a new tax stamp, since the tax has been paid, but they still need to register and be approved. CLEO could still cause problems. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SHOTGUN MESIAH 855 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) I went to a local gun smith/ dealer and got the news. I can get my class 3 license but it's 500 dollars and as mentioned the Feds can come into your gun store home or anything you own with no warrant and search it. But if you are just wanting one silencer a 200$ tax stamp can be given to get it but its about a 1.5 year waiting period on getting it yep, that are the rules here in NE, they can come into your house without a warrant anytime..... Go with the bump fire stock and save yourself a lot of money and headache not to mention privacy. When you sign off on a class 3 you are signing away your constitutional rights. Edited June 1, 2013 by SHOTGUN MESIAH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sdustin 578 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Shotgun mesiah please point out that law? Cause I've yet to see anything you can do other than commit a felony cause you to lose your 4th amendment rights. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sdustin 578 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 And even then once you have served your sentence of probation your 4th is restored. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SHOTGUN MESIAH 855 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 this is what I have been told by my local class 3 dealers. I will try to find substantial evidence to back this up. To me It is not worth it, because it puts a red flag on top of your ass and you will be monitored more than the average gun owner. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sdustin 578 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Haha "if there's a list we are all on it" I'll bet you have bought a weapon at an FFL? The ATF has been scanning forms fir a while. Your on this forum and I'll bet others? Facebook? I'll bet you post pro gun stuff on Facebook if you got one. If the Feds are montionering people or have a list "red flags" your on it trust me. And having a silencer is not going to make it any more so. Oh and was it class 3 dealers or just ma and pops gun store? Cause there are idiots everywhere. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SHOTGUN MESIAH 855 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) I'm one of the very few that has never had a Facebook account, and one of the really few if not only one on the planet that has never owned a cell phone...ever. With that being said, yes I have bought several guns from a FFL, But you cant tell me a class 3 does not make you more noticeable. A lot more so than just your average gun buyer. I'm not willing to take the chance to find out, it's bad enough now as is, I don't want to fuel the fire any more if ya know what I mean. If they ever do a sweep I guarantee the class 3 owners will be at the top of the list.. Edited June 1, 2013 by SHOTGUN MESIAH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Taive 0 Posted June 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 No you can not pass down guns/silencers if they can come looking for it and you have the stamp but no silencer you get jail time the only way to get rid of it is to have it legally destroyed I know this sounds dumb but it was what a dealer told me Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shandlanos 1,470 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) I went to a local gun smith/ dealer and got the news. I can get my class 3 license but it's 500 dollars and as mentioned the Feds can come into your gun store home or anything you own with no warrant and search it. But if you are just wanting one silencer a 200$ tax stamp can be given to get it but its about a 1.5 year waiting period on getting it yep, that are the rules here in NE, they can come into your house without a warrant anytime..... Go with the bump fire stock and save yourself a lot of money and headache not to mention privacy. When you sign off on a class 3 you are signing away your constitutional rights. No, they can't. You are dead, factually wrong. I live in Nebraska. I own Title II firearms. A very good friend is a licensee who deals in Title II firearms including machine guns. I tell you, as a point of fact - your home cannot be searched. This is an urban legend, passed from yokel to yokel for years. LICENSEES, who hold an FFL to deal in firearms, are subject to an inspection once a year at THEIR BUSINESS PREMISES ONLY, or more than once if problems are found and they come back to reinspect to see if those problems have been resolved. No you can not pass down guns/silencers if they can come looking for it and you have the stamp but no silencer you get jail time the only way to get rid of it is to have it legally destroyed I know this sounds dumb but it was what a dealer told me Not exactly true. You can saw up your item and report it to the ATF as destroyed. I know for post-sample machine guns they require a photograph of the cut up receiver - my buddy bought a couple of AC556 select-fire rifles from a PD or a prison, destroyed them by torching the receivers, for parts kits - he had to take photos proving he had destroyed the receivers. Now, if you report an item lost or stolen and it's found in your possession - that would be legal hot water. Note also that the ATF has "approved" specs for sawing up different weapons - what you consider destroyed, they may not. Edited June 1, 2013 by Shandlanos 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MegamanX 65 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 It took 9 months total to get my osprey... really ridiculous wait times Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sdustin 578 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Tavie you can pass them down and your heir can transfer them tax free. They also expedite the transfer since some has to posses the item. Read some at NFA talk or silencer talk these guys know much more then most about the subject. I hate to see lies spread like "they can search your house any time they want" and "you can't pass them on you must destroy them". The ATF can call and make an appointment to see the item, you don't have to let them in your house you don't even have to meet at your house, and they can't just ask for no reason, it would be like they found a mac11 at a crime scene full auto number ground off, you also own a Mac and live close by they may want to check if it was the one at the crime scene. NFA firearms have been use two times in crimes. One was a stolen machine-gun and the other was a sucide by a police officers wife with a silenced .22. The ATF leaves NFA owners alone cause they know that since 1934 no one has done anything with a firearm that was in the NFA. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shandlanos 1,470 Posted June 1, 2013 Report Share Posted June 1, 2013 Tavie you can pass them down and your heir can transfer them tax free. They also expedite the transfer since some has to posses the item. Read some at NFA talk or silencer talk these guys know much more then most about the subject. I hate to see lies spread like "they can search your house any time they want" and "you can't pass them on you must destroy them". The ATF can call and make an appointment to see the item, you don't have to let them in your house you don't even have to meet at your house, and they can't just ask for no reason, it would be like they found a mac11 at a crime scene full auto number ground off, you also own a Mac and live close by they may want to check if it was the one at the crime scene. NFA firearms have been use two times in crimes. One was a stolen machine-gun and the other was a sucide by a police officers wife with a silenced .22. The ATF leaves NFA owners alone cause they know that since 1934 no one has done anything with a firearm that was in the NFA. Not exactly true... There have been cases of legal silencers being used by poachers. Relatively minor crimes, but crimes nonetheless. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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