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Magazine dropping out after firing


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I recently installed a extended magazine release on my Vepr-12 and since the mag has been dropping out after i shoot a round. I think to fix this i either have to file a little off the rear tang of the mag a or file a little off the top of the my new extended mag release. Right?

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I personally wouldn't modify a factory mag, especially if it was working perfectly before the change. More than likely the top of the mag release needs to be filed down ever so lightly.. With both releases off the gun try to compare if the new one is slightly longer above where it mounts

 

EDIT: phone keyboards suck 

Edited by Jeluvsk
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What kind of extended magazine release did you put on?  Some times the extra weight of the release can move forward (inertia) during recoil and release the magazine.  A stronger spring will fix this. DO NOT modify the magazine or the release if it is fully engaging. 

 

Normally the ambi mag releases are the ones to do this since they have a lever on both sides, which means more weight.

 

If it is one of my (JTE) extended magazine releases, PM me and I will tell you how to fix the spring. 

 

If it is someone else mag release, tough shit!  Should have bought one of mine:)

 

Jack

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What kind of extended magazine release did you put on?  Some times the extra weight of the release can move forward (inertia) during recoil and release the magazine.  A stronger spring will fix this. DO NOT modify the magazine or the release. 

 

Normally the ambi mag releases are the ones to do this since they have a lever on both sides, which means more weight.

 

If it is one of my (JTE) extended magazine releases, PM me and I will tell you how to fix the spring. 

 

If it is someone else mag release, tough shit!  Should have bought one of mine:)

 

Jack

I was thinking weight and inertia too.

 

I don't own a S-12 but, that was the scenario playing out in my head.

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JT is a hell alot smarter than me when it comes to any firearm.. I have a RAM on one of mine, and I too had a problem where the mag release didn't lock all the way causing the mag to drop out once I fired it.. I went to the manufacturer website and it said to use a file..

 

Guess if I'd bought a JT Engineering I would have better quality part :)

 

 

http://www.ramsfs.com/Pages/RAMS12XCpictures.aspx

 

Due to the variation in tolerances on these shotguns, a very small amount of fitting may be required on the lip of the catch where it engages the rear of the magazine.  This can easily be done with a file and will only take a few minutes.

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When I replaced ALL of my latches with JTE extended latches, my V12 mags needed adjusting. The JTE latches are the exact same length as the S12 latches. However, the V12 latches are shorter. Thus, I filed the rear lugs on my V12 mags and now every mag fits in every gun. Ymmv.

 

9f72131a60431299d4bb5e17e73931d8_zps0329

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I would have hoped the OP would have checked this to start with.  If the latch is not fully engaging, then definitely some materiel has to be removed somewhere.

 

Hate trying to diagnose problems over the internet!!  Never really have all the information you need or people do not know the proper terminology.

 

Jack

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JT is a hell alot smarter than me when it comes to any firearm.. I have a RAM on one of mine, and I too had a problem where the mag release didn't lock all the way causing the mag to drop out once I fired it.. I went to the manufacturer website and it said to use a file..

 

Thanks!!  But I get ate up with the dumb ass sometimes!!   Not often, but it happens to the best of us:)

 

Jack

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I recently installed a extended magazine release on my Vepr-12 and since the mag has been dropping out after i shoot a round. I think to fix this i either have to file a little off the rear tang of the mag a or file a little off the top of the my new extended mag release. Right?

 

Do not touch the mag. You will need to only remove the extended mag release, file it down (it's easier just to run it back and forth on the file itself than to run the file over it) to match the length of the factory mag release tab (do not over file it), and then re-install the mag release.

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My apologies, I made the assumption the OP would  pre-fit the part to ensure it would engage.  My mistake!  Very few aftermarket parts are truly a "Drop In" part with the Russian Firearms.

 

The easiest way to do it is like this:  Remove the mag release. Without the spring, install the mag release and use a drill bit or punch that is the same size as the hole.  Fit the magazine and see if there is full engagement of the release.  If not, take out the release and file off a few thousands and retry.  Do this until you have a compete engagement of the release into the rear lug of the magazine.  It can be a few thousands loose and not be a problem.

 

If the magazine continues to drop when a shot is fired, then look at the spring tension.

 

Jack

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I recently installed a extended magazine release on my Vepr-12 and since the mag has been dropping out after i shoot a round. I think to fix this i either have to file a little off the rear tang of the mag a or file a little off the top of the my new extended mag release. Right?

 

 

Do not touch the mag. You will need to only remove the extended mag release, file it down (it's easier just to run it back and forth on the file itself than to run the file over it) to match the length of the factory mag release tab (do not over file it), and then re-install the mag release.

To clarify, I filed my mags because I have both Saiga and Vepr magwell guns. The Saiga mags were already filed on at the factory so that the would fit the longer Saiga latches. Those mags were sloppy (vertically) in my Vepr12's. For me, it was easiest to standardize everything by purchasing the JTE latches. My Saiga magwell mags would still be nice and tight in my guns. I filed my Vepr mags to the exact same dimensions as the Saiga mags. Now, all my latches are the same length and all my mags will run in all my guns.

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...I wonder if it'd be possible to have a magazine automatically eject after the last round is chambered? It'd be an advantage for the gamers in competition, and some of those guys will spend top dollar to gain even a small edge.

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I had a similar issues with the mags dropping out after each shot. I fixed it by filing on the ramp of the latch. I posted pics if your interested.

 

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/84047-sgm-mags-jamming/&do=findComment&comment=847435

 

Would you mind sharing what you figured out in order to easily get the spring and mag catch installed back on the gun?

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My apologies, I made the assumption the OP would  pre-fit the part to ensure it would engage.  My mistake!  Very few aftermarket parts are truly a "Drop In" part with the Russian Firearms.

 

The easiest way to do it is like this:  Remove the mag release. Without the spring, install the mag release and use a drill bit or punch that is the same size as the hole.  Fit the magazine and see if there is full engagement of the release.  If not, take out the release and file off a few thousands and retry.  Do this until you have a compete engagement of the release into the rear lug of the magazine.  It can be a few thousands loose and not be a problem.

 

If the magazine continues to drop when a shot is fired, then look at the spring tension.

 

Jack

Yes it is a JTE extended mag release I purchased from CSS. I had a bitch of a time installing it with the magwell in the way and then having to remove it again in order to file it down so it would seat properly on the rear end of the mag. So what could i do to the spring to help this situation? I was just going to file the top of the release some more untill I get that nice 'click' from the mag like i get on my S-12 JTE mag release. 

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My apologies, I made the assumption the OP would  pre-fit the part to ensure it would engage.  My mistake!  Very few aftermarket parts are truly a "Drop In" part with the Russian Firearms.

 

The easiest way to do it is like this:  Remove the mag release. Without the spring, install the mag release and use a drill bit or punch that is the same size as the hole.  Fit the magazine and see if there is full engagement of the release.  If not, take out the release and file off a few thousands and retry.  Do this until you have a compete engagement of the release into the rear lug of the magazine.  It can be a few thousands loose and not be a problem.

 

If the magazine continues to drop when a shot is fired, then look at the spring tension.

 

Jack

Yes it is a JTE extended mag release I purchased from CSS. I had a bitch of a time installing it with the magwell in the way and then having to remove it again in order to file it down so it would seat properly on the rear end of the mag. So what could i do to the spring to help this situation? I was just going to file the top of the release some more untill I get that nice 'click' from the mag like i get on my S-12 JTE mag release. 

 

PM me your address and I will send you another spring.  I know it is a pain to remove the mag well, but it does make it easier to install the release.

 

Regards,

 

Jack Travers

JT Engineering

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From our product description page of the JT mag release.

To use on the Vepr 12 you will need remove a small amount of material from the top edge to match the factory magazine catch.  http://www.carolinashooterssupply.com/product_p/jte-extrl.htm

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Since I threw away my stock mag release that came with my Vepr-12 I dont have anything to compare my new JT mag release too when it comes to how much I need to file it down. I could guess and and file it then install it then remove it, then file it again all untill it find the right fit. But would really help me you guys could give me a messurement of your JT mag release length. I had such a hard time intalling the first time I smashed my damn stool.

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Since I threw away my stock mag release that came with my Vepr-12 I dont have anything to compare my new JT mag release too when it comes to how much I need to file it down. I could guess and and file it then install it then remove it, then file it again all untill it find the right fit. But would really help me you guys could give me a messurement of your JT mag release length. I had such a hard time intalling the first time I smashed my damn stool.

PM me your address and I'll send you one.

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I had a similar issues with the mags dropping out after each shot. I fixed it by filing on the ramp of the latch. I posted pics if your interested.

 

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/84047-sgm-mags-jamming/&do=findComment&comment=847435

 

Would you mind sharing what you figured out in order to easily get the spring and mag catch installed back on the gun?

 

 

 

 

NOTE: This could damage your gun and I'm not responsible if you break it or can't put it back together.

 

 

 

 

If you choose to file your tab make sure you be very slow to remove materiel. It doesn't take much. Generally you want to

 

1. File a small amount of materiel off the ramp.

2. Place the veprs mag catch back in the gun insert the pin (without the spring and watch where the tab grabs through the small opening behind the magwell.

3. If the catch is grabbing 3/4 of the tab or greater I'd probably stop.

4. Repeat as needed until the catch is grabbing appropriately.

5. Reinsert spring, veper mag catch, pin

 

Remember You only have one mag catch so slow and steady is your friend unless you order another catch. Some recommend buying another one. I did and found that the pin was held in by the tight tolerances of the holes in the vepers mag tab. The Saga one I ordered didn't have these tight tolerances so If you choose to use a different mag catch to file on keep in mind you may need a different pin or just find a different way to prevent the pin from falling out.

 

The arrow points to the ramp I mentioned the tight tolerances on the holes hold the pin in.

 

IMAG0149_zps6f7f2681.jpg

 

vepr mag tab ->   ||||||

PIN -->     ======0_0   <--- = Holes tight tolerances

                            ||||||

                            ||||||

 

Note: The spring is a PAIN to but back in if you've never done it before. The easiest way I could find was to use a pair of needle nose pliers and place one leg of the spring against the opening while torquing the springs other leg down so that you can slip the spring down into the veprs mag catch hole.

 

IMPORTANT: with just the pliers you will only be able to get the spring about half way into the hole and will be unable to get it down enough to slip the pin through it. DON'T FORCE THE SPRING INTO THE GUN. I damaged my spring and so did a few other ppl when they reinstalled their tabs. Luckily I had an extra.

 

 

To avoid damaging the spring:

 

1. Place the gun down with the magwell facing up, the barrel to the left, and the stock to the right. If for some reason your gun cant be oriented in this way there's something wrong. big_smile.gif

2. The spring will always catch inside the right side of the hole.

3. Take some micro screwdrivers and play with the leg , and apply pressure to the top of the spring as needed. The problem is that there's a small lip the spring leg gets caught on and you have to use the screw drivers to pull the leg over the lip.

 

The first time I did this it took me around 1 to 2 hrs to figure this all out. 2nd time it took me around 5 - 10 fumbling through it. The hardest part of reinstalling the spring is getting it over the lip.

 

If you choose to do this need some help I'll take some more pics or make a video. I attempted to create a tutorial initially but never finished it I'll post a small clip of inserting the sprig before you have to play with the leg.

Edited by papa_celms
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So after removing my JT mag release and filing it down to the size of the original mag release, assisted by sunnybean, i re-installed it and test fit my factory mag and SGM mag which both seem to fit fine. Then off to the range for a test fire. Upon shooting my factory Russian 5 round mag continued to drop out after the first initial shot. But the SGM mag never fell out after firing but sometimes never pushed the shells all the way to the top which resulted in a stove pipe or the LBHO engaging which in return I just pressed up on the slide release and loaded it. So I guess i have a few situations.

 

1: Why is the factory mag still dropping out and the SGM is not?

 

2: Why is my SGM mag not pushing my shells to the top all of the time even after i removed the 'follower' and sanded down the sides to remove friction? Before i do more sanding I just wanted to know any other options.

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Without seeing the gun I'd have to guess that the factory mags just need a hair of break-in to work properly. Can you feel the latch bottoming out on the metal feed lip? If so, you might just have to actuate the latch a few times back and forth to wear in the plastic. You might have left a hair too much material on the latch which would make it not close all the way.

 

On the SGM's, my guess would be that your magwell opening in the receiver is a bit tight and is causing the sides of the mag's walls to pinch a bit. This creates drag on the follower and then FTFeed. Fully insert an empty mag and, with the bolt and carrier out and the top cover open, see if the follower is dragging by pushing it down with a dowel. You may notice that the follower begins to drag on the walls for the last couple of inches. I had a number that exhibited this problem. My easy solution was to hit the outside of the mag a few times with a file where the sides of the mag contact the receiver. Ymmv.

Edited by sunnybean
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