7808 2 Posted March 26, 2014 Report Share Posted March 26, 2014 I want to convert my saiga 12, but I don't like stock and grip options in the kits, id rather buy the parts individually, I do alot of searching and just end up reading for an hour about all kinds of peoples random conversions, but it there just a simple list of all exact parts needed? Also, What's the difference from a tapco or arsenal fcg from cheaperthandirt vs the "modified" ones in the saiga conversion kits? Do most unconverted saigas come slotted for single hook triggers? I dont really like the look of the bolt on trigger guard either, id like to reuse the original. Can I use pretty much any ak pistol grip? Any ak stock for stamped reciever? Ive read bad stories about people mig welding on receivers, is there ways to do it without compromising the metal? Or just certain areas that shouldn't be mig welded on it? Wish I had a tig welder but I dont Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HighPlainsDrifter 466 Posted March 26, 2014 Report Share Posted March 26, 2014 I want to convert my saiga 12, but I don't like stock and grip options in the kits, id rather buy the parts individually, I do alot of searching and just end up reading for an hour about all kinds of peoples random conversions, but it there just a simple list of all exact parts needed? Also, What's the difference from a tapco or arsenal fcg from cheaperthandirt vs the "modified" ones in the saiga conversion kits? Do most unconverted saigas come slotted for single hook triggers? I dont really like the look of the bolt on trigger guard either, id like to reuse the original. Can I use pretty much any ak pistol grip? Any ak stock for stamped reciever? Ive read bad stories about people mig welding on receivers, is there ways to do it without compromising the metal? Or just certain areas that shouldn't be mig welded on it? Wish I had a tig welder but I dont A. List of parts... stock pistol grip trigger guard FCG (single hook) retaining plate/shepherd's crook disconnector spring B. "modified" FCG might be polished but I'm not sure. What's different, probably nothing. C. Saiga shotguns use a single hook, rifles use a double hook. D. Use the original trigger guard? Personally I wouldn't. A few builders reshape the original trigger guard, turn it around and rivet it in. I don't like the look. I would either consider the S-12 trigger guard from Ak-builder or the MD-arms trigger guard (find at what-a-country). E. AK PG: Yes F. AK stock: Yes G. I will pass on giving advice on welding... When converting post pictures and give us a thread to comment on. If you haven't decided on what parts to use browse the picture thread. Shit-ton of tried and true options. Good luck! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wade Pruetz 103 Posted March 26, 2014 Report Share Posted March 26, 2014 Well you aren't going to like my answer, but if you want it done right and don't have the skills or equipment to do it yourself I would send it to one of the many vendors that support this site and do this for a living. I have built many a saiga12 conversion, built my own krinkovs, and SBS's over the years. Its a lot of work to do it right. If you are happy screwing on parts to your gun then there are a lot of kits and parts to do so. I have done it myself when I started in this game, but if you put your DYI gun next to a professional builder there really isn't any comparison. Some people don't care to spend the money on a professional builder or don't mind the look of a kit gun so you need to really decide what level of conversion you will be most happy with. A friend of mine is a builder and I have told him more than once that before I knew better, I thought the price he was charging to convert an S12 was very expensive. After doing it myself a couple of times I think what he charges is a bargain! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
burntpowder 23 Posted March 26, 2014 Report Share Posted March 26, 2014 B. "modified" FCG might be polished but I'm not sure. What's different, probably nothing. I thought the modified FCG had the right side of the base of the hammer trimmed already for the BHO where as the non-modified do not. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
7808 2 Posted March 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2014 (edited) I just read a thread at the top of this section of the forum and it looks like you do have to ground down parts on the fcg. Ninerrider(or anyone) can you point out some differences between professionally converted guns and average done at home with tools from your average home improvement store? I'm not really into dumping tons of money into my guns, but I'm not looking to decrease there value or make them function worse then when I got them either Also, I like doing things myself for the satisfaction Edited March 26, 2014 by 7808 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunman1 1,753 Posted March 26, 2014 Report Share Posted March 26, 2014 The conversion parts for the Saiga FCG are custom machined/ground, to fit the gun that you intend to put them in. Cobra sells a nicely tuned and polished FCG, that you probably will not be able to duplicate, as he and the other vendors here have many years of experience with the Saiga platform. I have one of Cobra's FCG in my S-20 and it's a fuken dream. I bought a conversion buffer tube from CSS for my S-308, then ordered a Magpul stock for it. I reused the trigger guard on my S-20, problem with that is, there's no way to secure the front of it, it just kinda tucks under the mag release, not really the best way to do it. I will go out on limb here and offer a little advice, if you really don't want dump a bunch of money into a gun, then listen to the people who have already done this, buy the parts you want from the reputable vendors on this site, and maybe you only have to spend your money once. If you go buying parts that have not been manufactured/modified for the gun that you intend to put them in, then you are totally on yer own, and good luck to you sir. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Big John! 2,062 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 I've been able to do a few builds using nothing but parts from Carolina Shooters Supply. Plus they give us 10% off. I've never bought a build kit. I just fill my cart with all the stuff I need. The Tapco G2 FCG from CSS is already profiled as well. No way (for me) that all of the aftermarket trigger guards are so ugly that it's worth reusing the original. As for AK Builder... I think they are way overpriced. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HighPlainsDrifter 466 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 As for AK Builder... I think they are way overpriced. $18 for the trigger guard $6 for the selector stop I'll pay $24 just so long as I don't have to look at this... Look at it up close and it clearly looks wrong. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunman1 1,753 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 ^^^^man that's pretty fucked up Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HighPlainsDrifter 466 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 (edited) ^^^^man that's pretty fucked up Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not. When it comes to a professional build I do expect more. I paid $1900 for that build. It's really a nice gun but I find turning around and reusing a factory trigger guard down right fucking tacky. When it comes to quality why cut the corners? I'll pay $1925 if they would have just done it right from the beginning. Needless to say, after my dealings with RJF you can now find this build on consignment. Not necessarily over a trigger guard, but the whole experience left a bad taste in my mouth. Edited March 27, 2014 by HighPlainsDrifter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Matthew Hopkins 1,065 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 (edited) The Tapco G2 FCG from CSS is already profiled as well. No way (for me) that all of the aftermarket trigger guards are so ugly that it's worth reusing the original. As for AK Builder... I think they are way overpriced. for the trigger group, I used the original disconnector and hammer, had a trigger from a old parts kit laying around that I profiled as the original. total cost there 0 dollars. I did the same as you by reusing the original trigger guard, just turned it 180 degrees, read that trick from the tutorial by Moe Zambeak on his step-by-step conversion, cost there 0 dollars. and before any of you "parts police" come posting about parts count, 922r. there is enough US parts on mine that I didn't need to buy a US FCG. US magazine, 3 parts US pistol grip US buttstock US handguard so there Edited March 27, 2014 by Matthew Hopkins Quote Link to post Share on other sites
7808 2 Posted March 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 So all I really need to order from Css: modified for saiga g2 trigger group Ak pistol grip - probably getting the caa upg47(like it on my ar) Ak stock - plain tapco black stock Few more unnecessary parts to make it 922r, trigger guard and selector stop if I don't want to reuse mine Anything missing? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HighPlainsDrifter 466 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 (edited) So all I really need to order from Css: modified for saiga g2 trigger group Ak pistol grip - probably getting the caa upg47(like it on my ar) Ak stock - plain tapco black stock Few more unnecessary parts to make it 922r, trigger guard and selector stop if I don't want to reuse mine Anything missing? disconnector spring retaining plate/shepherd's crook pistol grip nut and screw Edited: Go to the CSS vendor page and find their 10% coupon code. Edited March 27, 2014 by HighPlainsDrifter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
7808 2 Posted March 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 (edited) Thanks. I think the trigger group from Css includes the Shepards crook, not sure about disconnector spring, forgot to add pistol grip nut and screw (had it in my cart when I did a practice run though too see how much $) thanks for the coupon code tip Edited March 27, 2014 by 7808 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HighPlainsDrifter 466 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 Thanks. I think the trigger group from Css includes the Shepards crook, not sure about disconnector spring, forgot to add pistol grip nut and screw (had it in my cart when I did a practice run though too see how much $) Buy a retaining plate as well. It is easier than the shepherd's crook, you'll see... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunman1 1,753 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 ^^^^man that's pretty fucked up Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not. When it comes to a professional build I do expect more. I paid $1900 for that build. It's really a nice gun but I find turning around and reusing a factory trigger guard down right fucking tacky. When it comes to quality why cut the corners? I'll pay $1925 if they would have just done it right from the beginning. Needless to say, after my dealings with RJF you can now find this build on consignment. Not necessarily over a trigger guard, but the whole experience left a bad taste in my mouth. Nope, not being sarcastic. When I first responded, it appeared to me that the sporter plate was still in place, now I'm not sure what the deal is, but it looks pretty fucked up to me. What kind of gun is it? Why is there so much space between the trigger and mag release? What the fuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HighPlainsDrifter 466 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 (edited) ^^^^man that's pretty fucked up Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not. When it comes to a professional build I do expect more. I paid $1900 for that build. It's really a nice gun but I find turning around and reusing a factory trigger guard down right fucking tacky. When it comes to quality why cut the corners? I'll pay $1925 if they would have just done it right from the beginning. Needless to say, after my dealings with RJF you can now find this build on consignment. Not necessarily over a trigger guard, but the whole experience left a bad taste in my mouth. Nope, not being sarcastic. When I first responded, it appeared to me that the sporter plate was still in place, now I'm not sure what the deal is, but it looks pretty fucked up to me. What kind of gun is it? Why is there so much space between the trigger and mag release? What the fuck This is a Red Jacket Firearms build. They reshaped the original sporter trigger guard, turned it around 180 degrees, and riveted it in place. The sporter plate has been removed. I was considering replacing the trigger guard but they had to drill a hole for the front rivet that I don't want to deal with. Every time I pick it up I notice the trigger guard's backwards angle and how it doesn't quite meet up with the pistol grip correctly. Apparently this is SOP for Red Jacket. Instead of getting all pissed, I've let go of my disappointment and have put the build up for sale. Edited March 27, 2014 by HighPlainsDrifter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Matthew Hopkins 1,065 Posted March 27, 2014 Report Share Posted March 27, 2014 (edited) This is a Red Jacket Firearms build. They reshaped the original sporter trigger guard, turned it around 180 degrees, and riveted it in place. The sporter plate has been removed. I was considering replacing the trigger guard but they had to drill a hole for the front rivet that I don't want to deal with. I turned my original trigger guard around, but I bent the guard forward to put in more of a curve in it, instead of the front being straight, it doesn't look 100 percent perfect, but for that little effort, it does look better then having the front straight. I didn't need to drill any hole, I used the original front hole. your trigger does look a bit far back, mine isn't that far back. I suspect that they drilled the pistol grip screw hole too far forward. yeah, if I paid 1900 bucks and it came looking like I could have done a much better job for 0 dollars, I would be pissed Edited March 27, 2014 by Matthew Hopkins Quote Link to post Share on other sites
7808 2 Posted March 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2014 (edited) Was sitting at my computer in a lazy mood and went with a kit from CSs, got the retainer plate and modified bho and a extra 8rnd mag. Couldn't decide which stock I wanted so went with the plain tapco for now Figured I can customize it more later when I have more money lol Edited March 28, 2014 by 7808 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Inspector 12 37 Posted March 28, 2014 Report Share Posted March 28, 2014 (edited) Thanks. I think the trigger group from Css includes the Shepards crook, not sure about disconnector spring, forgot to add pistol grip nut and screw (had it in my cart when I did a practice run though too see how much $) Buy a retaining plate as well. It is easier than the shepherd's crook, you'll see... I had installed a retaining plate on my S 12 when I did the conversion. Sent the gun into JT Engineering for his "reliability service" and when the gun came home it had the retaining plate in the parts bag and a shepherds crook installed. The action is noticeably smoother now, all I can surmise is the retaining plate I had bought (the one that now seems no longer available at CSS) was interfering with the action?? My S 12 now shoots 1200 FPS low base shells as fast as you care to pull the trigger with no fail to feed or extracts. Very well pleased with the work at JT Engineering. As to trigger guards, I went with the CSS billet bolt on version. I like the way it attaches, I also like that the pistol grip mount is part of the trigger guard. Now no pistol grip nut is needed and I didn't have to try to file a square hole in the receiver. Edited March 28, 2014 by Inspector 12 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bioweaponeer 2 Posted March 28, 2014 Report Share Posted March 28, 2014 (edited) I cruised around and read a dozen build threads on here and the got the parts and did it myself, looking back I spent more on parts than I wanted, but I get everything the way I wanted it and then had a fun time putting it together. I didnt weld anything, I think the only modification I had to do was cut the tang off(due to parts I ordered). And yes I know I need to cover up the paint on the bottom Edited March 28, 2014 by bioweaponeer Quote Link to post Share on other sites
7808 2 Posted March 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2014 I got the Css trigger guard too, didn't like the look of the tromix, that's nice the Css one has the pistol grip mount built in, did not know that Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wagnikov 186 Posted March 28, 2014 Report Share Posted March 28, 2014 To original post. Cheap ehh? Weld the "trigger" back on where they milled it off. Usual bolt up stuff, reuse everything. This was my first saiga, I have evolved much since then. But no shame in doing what you can with the skills and tools available. Hell, it came with a tapco non-converted adapter stock. I reused the pistol grip and buffer tube! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
7808 2 Posted April 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2014 (edited) converted using c s s trigger guard tapco stock mft grip, tapco stock Sucks almost wrecked it getting it flush against back of receiver, c s s trigger guard = not super impressed either, had to elongated hole in reciever to get it to fit, also had to melt mft grip to get it to fit against grip and bolt up I like the grip alot, stock is too damn short for my alien type body Edited April 1, 2014 by 7808 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bioweaponeer 2 Posted April 1, 2014 Report Share Posted April 1, 2014 nice job, looks good Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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