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Einstein69

New saiga problems cycling

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First time taking the saiga shooting. Picked up some federal 1 1/8 oz, 1oz super x slugs and estate 00 buck which I had the most problems with.

 

I was having more failure to feeds than fTE's. I have 4 gas ports which are aligned just okay, tax 47 auto plug, reduced recoil spring, CSS puck. The auto plug adjustment is maxed out. I'm assuming I have more problems.

 

Is over sizing the gas ports overkill if it is not what MY saiga needs?

What can I do tomorrow to get this thing running like a champ.

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If it's new try getting some 3" shells running through it to work it in ,

not sure why you have all these new parts installed , did you buy it like this if  so maybe you could take it back to the shop that sold it , 

 

was it running good before all the new stuff was put in ?

 

there's heaps of info on this site to sift through as well , thats what i did . but mine was fine straight out the box . 

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Take off all that new crap and try again. Did you oil the bcg and bolt? Try cycling the bcg a shit load of times to break it in a little bit.

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It was bought like that from a forum member who claimed it was brand new and had extras installed. Some, if not all the parts on the gun were used.  He did not send factory plug or puck so I can't say how it runs with them although I hope he can locate them for me. 

 

I didn't shoot any 3" but the slugs I did have seemed to of have cycled better. 

The shells were getting stuck on the bottom lip of the barrel it seemed. Some needed to be pulled up or wiggled to get in 


Everything is oiled lightly 

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Mainly FTF after maxing out adjustment on the auto plug with very few FTE.

AGP Gen 2 + 3 10 rounders & md20. Agp had better results overall but still had feeding issues. 

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Send it off to JT Engineering. Jack does awesome work he converted my 12 and just fixed my 20 gauge saiga. Worth every penny. 

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FTF would happen even after ejecting a shell and especially after having a FTE. It was worst with the estate brand ammo but it also had problems with the other types of ammo I was using

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Many failure to feed (and eject) problems are caused by the bolt carrier not moving fast enough.  More lubrication is often the simple answer to this problem.  You don't need to modify the gun to make it cycle properly if you use enough oil in the right places.  You might want to modify it to obtain different (higher) performance, but that's another matter.

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Read the forum and the stickies are very enlightening. More than once you will read things  like "Get your gun running right before making any aftermarket parts." or "Put the factory parts back on and change one thing at a time." Some railed hand guards are notorious for creating problem.

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It's a new old Saiga. I guess it's been owned for 1 year with no firing, then I buy it and didn't receive stock parts, maybe I will later. 

I thought that no doubt this gun would run flawless the way it's set up and it was the opposite. 

 

Is the auto plug suppose to be even near to maxing out adjustment? 

 

Maybe no more federal target load for me 

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It's a new old Saiga. I guess it's been owned for 1 year with no firing, then I buy it and didn't receive stock parts, maybe I will later. 

I thought that no doubt this gun would run flawless the way it's set up and it was the opposite. 

 

Is the auto plug suppose to be even near to maxing out adjustment? 

 

Maybe no more federal target load for me

 

No, it can be made to fire 100%. You just have to do your homework and do the work yourself or pay someone competent with the knowledge of these guns to do the work. That decision is yours, but it's very difficult to tell you what's the fix without actually seeing it.

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Have you checked to see if the ports are clear, having the correct amount of ports does not always mean that that your getting enough gas. Maybe they are blocked or clogged.

Sometimes FTF are caused by the extractor slot, that is what gave me problems once upon a moon. My advice is read up, get that weak spring out of there, and make sure you are getting enough gas.

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Gun was all clean and oiled and new before shooting, but i did not check the gas ports after firing until now and a considerable amount of dust was sitting in the tube and around the edges of the puck, the material that is larger looks like pieces shaved ever so slightly from the magazine's. 

 

Magazine shaving normal? About a penny sized amount of dust dumped out. Maybe my problem is solved haha 


Besides all the material sitting in there the gas ports are not stuffed full of carbon 

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Haha.if you have alot of carbon build up that wont come off soak the puck in some ever clear, and take a rag soaked with solvent and shove it into your gas block. Scrub all of the carbon off of the gas knob to.

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Gun was all clean and oiled and new before shooting, but i did not check the gas ports after firing until now and a considerable amount of dust was sitting in the tube and around the edges of the puck, the material that is larger looks like pieces shaved ever so slightly from the magazine's. 

 

Magazine shaving normal? About a penny sized amount of dust dumped out. Maybe my problem is solved haha 

Besides all the material sitting in there the gas ports are not stuffed full of carbon 

 

Run the gas chamber dry. NO oil. It will gum it up.

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No oil in there those shavings were all dry. Maybe I'll just have to shoot shoot shoot. 

 

Do you guys recommend modifying the gas port holes if the 4th hole is being partially blocked from poor alignment?

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No oil in there those shavings were all dry. Maybe I'll just have to shoot shoot shoot. 

 

Do you guys recommend modifying the gas port holes if the 4th hole is being partially blocked from poor alignment?

 

Read the stickies. 

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1 hole MAY have about a half paperclip overhang blockage. 

I guess it's hard to say after only shooting 120 rounds. 


1 hole MAY have about a half paperclip overhang blockage. 

I guess it's hard to say after only shooting 120 rounds. 

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The recoil spring is what powers the feed portion of the cycle. The "reliability" springs are weaker. Put the factory recoil spring back in. There are other things that can be done, but losing the "reliability" spring is where I would start.

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That's right what Yeoldetool says: Do not put oil on any parts in the gas tube.  Make sure the bolt carrier groups is clean and oiled so it slides easily, and the bolt turns.  Basically any metal-on-metal sliding contact.  My experience with the AK platform was in combat, where we cleaned and oiled them every day and didn't fire as many rounds as you might do in a competition.  As for the the Saiga-12, make sure you use the type of cartridge ('shotgun shell') where the nose (the other end from the brass) always curves toward the centre.  Some makes of cartridge have a little flare at the end.  Don't use these, as they have slightly more tendency for a failure to feed or failure to eject. The AK platform is notorious for giving you a snootful of smoke, but this does not necessarily indicate you've put in too much oil.

 

The AK platform/Saiga-12 are great and reliable even when dirty, and they should cycle flawlessly unmodified, but they do need to be cleaned so there is no buildup of muck. I don't know how widespread this story is, but sometimes the 'Muj' just plunge the whole AK rifle in a barrel of diesel to clean and oil it in one quick and easy operation!  Don't try that at home.

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I am going to try running a few hundred more rounds, it has it's almost flawless cycling every 4th mag or so. If I continue to have problems I will proceed to modifying probably the gas block first and then depending on how effective that was I will shave and polish around bottom lip where shells feed. Hopefully it starts working before I get carried away modding and pissed off at it and just junk it

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I got the plug and gas tube really clean and took it shooting. Css puck,tac47 auto plug(was bottomed out shooting federal 7.5 shot 1 1/8 oz), stock spring was put back in and the rails were lubed. I have also done a light polish on the bolt,carrier and hammer.

 

The best it did with the light loads was 9 consecutive shots! But only once. Failure to eject and to feed. The shells get stuck and stop the carrier motion. Should I follow up on  the tutorial to polish the barrel lip where shells feed? 

 

I had much better results shooting 00B & slugs. Only a couple failures after I backed the auto plug out to re-adjust for the heavier loads. I was actually impressed this time after it continued cycling slugs without failures. 

 

Any tips for the mean time? 

I'm going to stock up on heavier shots and hold off on modifying.....until next time. 

 

All 4 gas ports are clear of build up, the 4th hole is sitting just a hair behind the gas block......

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If you do anything to the gas block, just take off enough material exactly where the partially covered port is to allow gas to flow through the port. Do not do the "D mod". It is a good intention with potentially ill results.

 

Put about 5 wraps of teflon tape around the autoplug. If you were looking at the part of the Autoplug that goes into the gas block, wrap the teflon tape on it clockwise.

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This is 1 way shells fail to feed. Caused by the agp mag?

The shell hull is wedged between the two humps.

Is it safe to lightly remove metal from either of those humps?

post-49095-0-14574700-1399351311_thumb.jpg

post-49095-0-75123200-1399351339_thumb.jpg

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