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AR mag adapters

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I haven't been following these too much but recently got a saiga .223and want to put an adapter on it.

 

I'm not interested in paying a retarded price and sending the rifle away for that company to do so are there any other options that actually work? I can do it myself Ijust need a good adapter is all. Yea I know mill the trunnion away, etc...

 

Thanks for any info.

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I have one of each, the “send away job” as you call it and I did the MSA Bastard install myself. I will not be doing any head to head reviews, nor will I get into the pros and cons of each. I’ll just say I’m glad to have both. Since you already determined you don’t want the “send away job”  I’d suggest staying away from the adapter in post #2 and get the Bastard.  Both the Bastard and OLD adapter were from the same company (minus a name change) but with the Bastard you get LRBHO and you don’t have to worry about accidentally ejecting the adapter in post#2.

 

 

 

2uj1a8j.jpg

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Would be nice to get my order. They said mine was supposed to ship last week. 


I have one of each, the “send away job” as you call it and I did the MSA Bastard install myself. I will not be doing any head to head reviews, nor will I get into the pros and cons of each. I’ll just say I’m glad to have both. Since you already determined you don’t want the “send away job”  I’d suggest staying away from the adapter in post #2 and get the Bastard.  Both the Bastard and OLD adapter were from the same company (minus a name change) but with the Bastard you get LRBHO and you don’t have to worry about accidentally ejecting the adapter in post#2.

 

Would be nice if you would go into the pros and cons of each so people on the forum can make an informed decision. There is not much info out there about these and a review like that would be greatly beneficial to all IMO.

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Would be nice to get my order. They said mine was supposed to ship last week. 

I have one of each, the “send away job” as you call it and I did the MSA Bastard install myself. I will not be doing any head to head reviews, nor will I get into the pros and cons of each. I’ll just say I’m glad to have both. Since you already determined you don’t want the “send away job”  I’d suggest staying away from the adapter in post #2 and get the Bastard.  Both the Bastard and OLD adapter were from the same company (minus a name change) but with the Bastard you get LRBHO and you don’t have to worry about accidentally ejecting the adapter in post#2.

 

Would be nice if you would go into the pros and cons of each so people on the forum can make an informed decision. There is not much info out there about these and a review like that would be greatly beneficial to all IMO.

 

Without indorsing one system over the other both work and work well. Simply put the “send away” job is done by professionally and really comes out nice if you especially if you opt for their finish.  You end up with a steel adapter riveted to the receiver and excellent functionally with their mag and bolt release. It’s a very solid install. You get a strong & unique bullet guide unlike what we see in the standard conversion. The mag adapter is flared like you see on some of the higher-end AR lowers.

 

The Bastard is a self-install and which clearly states in the instructions (at least when I did my install) the milling should be done but a gunsmith or machine shop. That said If you are comfortable working with metal I say go for it but those or are not they may want to farm out at least the mill job or go with the “send away” job because if you take too much off your trunnion your S223 will be turned into a paper weight just that quick.  The Bastard is Aluminum like any other AR lower and looks like an AR lower. It has the standard AR mag release which I really like. That Bastard uses machine screws to attach to the receiver, you Loctite it and you’re done and it’s not going anywhere. Mine has been installed since early 2013 and has not moved. Prior to that I had the original MSA adapter in post #2 which make for a nice easy transition to the Bastard.

 

With the “send away” job you have someone doing the upgrade professionally with a known good procedure. With the Bastard if you don’t have a lathe (as I do not) it is going to be you and your dremel with NO room for error.  It was a lot of time testing and fitting but I have to tell you I enjoyed the every minute of the project, even the fact of knowing one wrong move with the dremel would end it all. So if you have a lathe or access to one you will be that much better off. I was one of the first to complete and the Bastard but like I said earlier it was easy for me because most milling was done because I upgraded from the old MSA adapter.  The MSA owner and S12 forum member was very helpful when I ran into some issues that weren’t documented. For example when I did my install these two issues weren’t documented. The US hammer  needs to re-profiled like the original or simply use your original hammer. The other issue was the LHBHO needed to be re-profiled right out of the box. I would hope the LRBHO is now properly shaped and they are providing a hammer or at least documenting these issues. Hope this helps

 

 

Edit: typos

Edited by Another-Saiga-Fan
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Yeah, thanks for posting. I hope so too. I ordered the one in post number two. Was going to go with the bastard but changed my mind because I thought it didnt require milling and allowed for use of AK mags if one chose to remove it on the fly for some reason. 


sweet rifle by the way

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Thank you Sir.

 

Unfortunately they all three have to be milled. My gut feeling is we are OK with the .223/5.56 because the recoil is non-existent however if there were a mod for the Saiga 308 to accept US 308 mags and it required milling I’d probably stay clear of that one based on the recoil alone.

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Thanks for the info. I am definitly NOT paying for something worth as much as the rifle itself so it looks like the bastard or MSA one is my best option.

 

I HATE the bolt hold-open mods on AKs. Get that shit off my AK. I just want to use ar mags.

 

Now what's with the hammer? Was it a tapco one that needed re-profiling? Why? I will probably use a Bulgarian or Russian one anyways.

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If you go with the Bastard without the LRBHO the hammer is a non-issue. You only need the hammer re-profiled for the LRBHO if you use a Tapco hammer. If you use the stock hammer (in your Tapco trigger) no mod is needed. I don’t know how they package them now but when they first deployed the Bastards the LRBHO was an add-on. Personally now that I’ve experienced the LRBHO it be hard to go back but that’s your call. Good luck on whichever way you go.

Edited by Another-Saiga-Fan
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^ Good info, thanks a ton!

 

Both the Bastard and OLD adapter were from the same company (minus a name change) but with the Bastard you get LRBHO and you don’t have to worry about accidentally ejecting the adapter in post#2.

 

 

Does that one in question happen to accidentally fall out allot?

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^ Good info, thanks a ton!

 

Both the Bastard and OLD adapter were from the same company (minus a name change) but with the Bastard you get LRBHO and you don’t have to worry about accidentally ejecting the adapter in post#2.

 

 

Does that one in question happen to accidentally fall out allot?

 It will not fall out unless you release it. I have the Saiga in 7.62x39 so out of habit I’d still grab the S223 mag release. If you only have the one Saiga you perhaps could force yourself to remember not to grab the S223 mag release.  For me toggling between the S223 and S762 at the range I would always continue to grab the S223 mag release. If you are going to do the old adapter you could probably modify S223 mag release to lock-it-out with a small machine screw. I attached two pics one is the Old adapter where you *could possibility* drill and run a small machine screw thru or just a drill & tap a shorter screw, your choice or maybe something else to lock it out. The other image is the Bastard without the LRBHO installed. That cut-out is where the LRBHO handle for manual operation would be located.  Unless they made changes the Bastard worked  fine without the LRBHO when I did my S223

11v1led.jpg

zvzi0z.jpg

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yeah, but that ones polymer. the ones from CDG are metal....I think. I have the one from Atlantic. Its not bad at all. Havent given it a fare test yet though, but initial impressions are its ok. 

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Atlantic Firearms sells an AK pistol that comes with a mag adapter installed on it:

 

M85NP 5.56 AK Pistol with AR15 Magazine Adapter http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/component/virtuemart/shipping-rifles/pap-m85-pistol-detail.html?Itemid=0

 

attachicon.gifm85pistol9.jpg

 

Wonder who makes this adapter?

 

It is a Zastava factory job, and is plastic.

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I have just installed the Canis M4 adapter  and had no problem with the installation. Did the milling and it snapped right in.

My problem came when the bullets would not feed, hitting about a 1/8 of an inch low on the breech .So I ordered a bullet guide from Carolina, which i had planned on.

The guide did not work be cause the taper was to much and was not lifting the bullet. So I made one out of bar stock the same as the one I purchased but with no taper and it worked just fine. 

Also broke the tap off flush with the hole ( first time ever)  so I froze it and punched it out ,got a new tap and finished the hole.

Looking forward to shooting it in a few weeks.

For the money and the fact I can shoot both AR and AK mags is a win win.

I had fun doing it

Also you will have to trim the AK release rivet's to get the adapters release to travel inward. Pmags drop free.

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I have just installed the Canis M4 adapter and had no problem with the installation. Did the milling and it snapped right in.

My problem came when the bullets would not feed, hitting about a 1/8 of an inch low on the breech .So I ordered a bullet guide from Carolina, which i had planned on.

The guide did not work be cause the taper was to much and was not lifting the bullet. So I made one out of bar stock the same as the one I purchased but with no taper and it worked just fine.

Also broke the tap off flush with the hole ( first time ever) so I froze it and punched it out ,got a new tap and finished the hole.

Looking forward to shooting it in a few weeks.

For the money and the fact I can shoot both AR and AK mags is a win win.

I had fun doing it

Also you will have to trim the AK release rivet's to get the adapters release to travel inward. Pmags drop free.

glad you got it to work! That would have sucked if it didn't. Way to keep at it. Still haven't attempted to do the mods. Have a dremil bit but that's it. Would really like an end mill bit to make it easier and take less time. Thanks for all the tips on installation. Kind regards and happy shooting
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AZG I did the milling with a dremel and carbide bit , worked great.

Maybe you could post some detailed pictures of the work you did with the carbide bit if you don't mind.

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If you go with the Bastard without the LRBHO the hammer is a non-issue. You only need the hammer re-profiled for the LRBHO if you use a Tapco hammer. If you use the stock hammer (in your Tapco trigger) no mod is needed. I don’t know how they package them now but when they first deployed the Bastards the LRBHO was an add-on. Personally now that I’ve experienced the LRBHO it be hard to go back but that’s your call. Good luck on whichever way you go.

I know you some of you guys are doing the original adapter and this don't apply but I would negligent if I didn't correct it. It was a while ago when I did the mods so sometimes details all run together.  The correction is the original trigger needs a slight trim as well with the Bastard and LRHBO install. Like the Tapco the lower from half needs a trim to clear the LRBHO. Again if you do the Bastard w/o the lrbho or original adapter no hammer mods are needed.

 

I went shooting today when I cleaned the Bastard gun tonight and seen the trim job clear as day and figured I better correct this. Just to  reiterate I went with the stock hammer because I seen a post on another forum and it was sort of confirmed here on S12 as well that the Tapco hammer may beat up the bolt on the 223 more so than with other calibers.  I actually put the factory hammer back in my 7.62x39 as well. Sorry for the mix-up

Edited by Another-Saiga-Fan
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How long does it take for Canis to ship these cause I got mine ordered in June and now it's Oct....

 

They don't like to answer emails either and have no phone number so......

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These threads make me want to get an AR adapter so bad...  Afraid to do the work myself.  :(

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These threads make me want to get an AR adapter so bad...  Afraid to do the work myself.  sad.png

I don’t think you will be sorry if you had one done professionally.  This thread contains my DIY job but I also had one done professionally, here’s both side by side in the image #2 FYI the Bastard rifle is the same one in this thread,  I blacked-it-out...

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These threads make me want to get an AR adapter so bad... Afraid to do the work myself. sad.png

I don’t think you will be sorry if you had one done professionally. This thread contains my DIY job but I also had one done professionally, here’s both side by side in the image #2 FYI the Bastard rifle is the same one in this thread, I blacked-it-out...

Yeah, I love the look of the Bastard.

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These threads make me want to get an AR adapter so bad...  Afraid to do the work myself.  sad.png

 

Don't bother. You won't get your adapter. Apparently they don't ship them to you and don't have any way to contact them either.

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Hmm, yeah just noticed that they don't list the weight on the website. 

 

I'd weight mine but don't have a decent scale... what I can say is that I don't really notice the weight on the gun. Its all Aluminum and machined out pretty well so there's not this huge heavy hunk of metal hanging off the bottom of the receiver. 

 

If you're really interested in the weight, could probably email/message canis and they'd know for sure.

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Thanks. I actually did that, back when I got on the waiting list. But I was a younger man back then, full of piss and vinegar. Things are different now. I'm months older and weaker.

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