horatio 515 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 Evil You've forgotten more about guns then ill ever know, you're a hell of a guy. That being said. Ill never buy German wine Ill never buy French electronics And I sure as hell would never trust the Chinese with a controlled explosion 4" from my face. Interesting projects aside, I'm reminded of the gun that my coworker bought for 100 dollars that local LGS recommended tying to to tree and pulling the trigger with a rope because it was a cheap piece of crap If you decide to get one. Please be safe 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james lambert 3,059 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 At one time s12 was under 200.00 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mullet Man 2,114 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 At one time s12 was under 200.00 At one time the Chinese made really nice AK's too. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
horatio 515 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 And at one one time bread cost .13 cents a loaf as my dad likes to remind me. But he only made $2 an hour asI like to remind him Past prices are almost completely irrelevant. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 Well I'll give my opinion once I get some volume of lead down range.. My opinion is not as valuable as some others perhaps, since I'm just a magazine guy.. But I'm willing to put some lead down range and record the action with a high speed camera just in case something cool happens. If it starts acting up I'll document what happens. If evlblkwpnz does the same we should have a fairly clear picture of if these are worth messing with.. I know a few other people worked on them and had mixed opinions.. So maybe a little more data would clear the questions that surround this firearm.. If its total crap I'll say so, if its just crudely made then I'm sure many of us would have use for it. I recorded the process of what I did to the one we have, in fairly decent detail.. I'll also be taking detailed photos before putting a sizable number of rounds down range.. If something changes in a thousand rounds than we will have it documented. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james lambert 3,059 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 Well I'll give my opinion once I get some volume of lead down range.. My opinion is not as valuable as some others perhaps, since I'm just a magazine guy.. But I'm willing to put some lead down range and record the action with a high speed camera just in case something cool happens. If it starts acting up I'll document what happens. If evlblkwpnz does the same we should have a fairly clear picture of if these are worth messing with.. I know a few other people worked on them and had mixed opinions.. So maybe a little more data would clear the questions that surround this firearm.. If its total crap I'll say so, if its just crudely made then I'm sure many of use would have use for it. I recorded the process of what I did to the one we have in fairly decent detail.. I'll also be taking detailed photos before putting a sizable number of rounds down range.. If something changes in a thousand rounds than we will have it documented. i think your opinion is more valid than most 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 Thank you. So what would be a minimal test for first level inspection? I'm thinking 500 rds of 3 Dram, then measure for receiver rail spreading at the rear of the receiver, and check the bolt and carrier for denting. Measure denting. Then 50 or 100 3" magnum rounds in the high brass mode, then repeat the measuring. Followed by another 500 rds of 3 dram. I figure if the gun is not showing changes at that point, then odds are its ok. Not sure when I'll get some free time to do this.. Its either next week, or early November. Anyone have an opinion on something they want us to look for? Obviously we can continue to add to the round count if that is something everyone is worried about. I don't think I can shoot much more than 1000 rounds in a day, and shooting days don't come around often. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mullet Man 2,114 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 Bolt tail peening, firing pin mushrooming, extractor deformation/wear, carrier cracking. Top cover stability can reveal trunnion or rivet issues. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 I would take good closeup hi res before / after photos of all the bolt and carrier parts that typically get beat up or worn, the ones mentioned above as well as the feed foot, locking lugs (bolt and trunnion), bolt cam and the channel in the carrier, and I get a whole lot of Saiga carriers in here with the tail peened and flattened on them. Looks like they've been beaten flat with a sledge. That lower edge of that tail is the first thing to make contact with the hammer so the hammer also gets worn there, getting worse after the tail is badly flattened. One of the first things I fix and re-profile are these two surfaces. Hammer face denting from striker, ejector wear or burrs, Barrel hood and extractor notch, recoil spring parts, wobble in the gas piston / op rod, wear on the puck, thread wear on the gas plug and block, and tightness / fitting of gas tube all come to mind. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
uzitiger 193 Posted September 20, 2014 Report Share Posted September 20, 2014 (edited) S12s used to be $350 and everyone said they were junk. You're better off with something US made... No more saigas are coming, so... I remember that and it frustrated me that I couldn't afford it at the time. I never thought the Saigas were junk. Russians know how to make firearms that work and with Kalashnikov reliability. Genady Nikonov was the one who designed the S-12 from an AK to a shotgun and he did a great job. He also designed the AN-94 which had a two shot burst with a cable system. The Catamount Fury could be a good shotgun or it could be another piece of junk coming from China. I have no way of knowing. Edited September 20, 2014 by uzitiger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted September 22, 2014 Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 Interesting observation. The gas adjustment knob is really sloppy, but a Saiga-12 knob partially fits. The lower section needs to be turned down on a lathe but otherwise it looks like a good fit. I'm going to modify a five position knob and bring it along in the event the gun appears over gassed.. That way I have a way to turn it down a little. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Automatikjack 1 Posted September 28, 2014 Report Share Posted September 28, 2014 IIRC from researching them online is that they have weaker steel for the barrels and are limited to lead shot only. I took a look at one in store and the finish was pretty weird and chunky looking, almost like the factorydipped the gun in rhino liner. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vepr12x 89 Posted September 28, 2014 Report Share Posted September 28, 2014 Interested in seeing what the eaa imported jianshe annihilator is all about. Or better yet izmash or molot license schmiesser germany to produce saiga/veprs. They already have a deal with schmiesser to supply vepr 12's to 17 nato countries. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
evlblkwpnz 3,418 Posted October 6, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 I finally got up close and personal with a Catamount Fury. I broke it in under an hour. If there is a weakness, I always find it Quote Link to post Share on other sites
csspecs 1,987 Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 What broke? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vepr12x 89 Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 I finally got up close and personal with a Catamount Fury. I broke it in under an hour. If there is a weakness, I always find it Leavin us hangin here. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Racer 27 37 Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 (edited) I finally got up close and personal with a Catamount Fury. I broke it in under an hour. If there is a weakness, I always find it That's like a pretty lady on her knees with your dick in her hand leaning forward tongue out only to get up and walk away. Edited October 6, 2014 by Racer 27 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mullet Man 2,114 Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 I finally got up close and personal with a Catamount Fury. I broke it in under an hour. If there is a weakness, I always find it That's like a pretty lady on her knees with your dick in her hand leaning forward tongue out only to get up and walk away. Except in this case, the "lady" (I use that term very loosely because she wears underwear with dick holes in them) is Rosie O'Donnell Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DLT 1,646 Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 I just threw up a little. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
storm6490 2,768 Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 And at one one time bread cost .13 cents a loaf as my dad likes to remind me. But he only made $2 an hour asI like to remind him Past prices are almost completely irrelevant. Almost, but not in the case of the Saiga. When I purchased mine it was around 300 dollars. The dollar had about the same buying power with the exception of gas and that is a strictly regulated and almost monopolized commodity. As far as milk and other goods, it was about par. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Automatikjack 1 Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 This has to be a first, Rosie and Pretty used in the same sentence. Back to the topic at hand, out with it already damnit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
XD45 7,124 Posted October 6, 2014 Report Share Posted October 6, 2014 Remember the old joke. How do you keep an idiot in suspense? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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