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ramsfan6239

First Gun - Saiga 12 - NYS Thumbole Stock?

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Hey guys - After looking around for my first gun I settled on the Saiga 12. One of the very (If one of the only) tactical semi-auto shotguns I can get in NYS.

 

I plan on upgrading the handguard to add some rails and maybe some internals but for the most part I really need to ditch the stock. It's uncomfortable to hold/shoot.

 

I know pistol grips are illegal in NYS and from what I've read thumbhole stock are a grey area. My question is where would I find this style particular stock?

 

aj50d43295.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

I know there are some funky looking ones and maybe a wood one or two but I'm really keen on that style. Would an AK style thumbhole stock work as well?

 

For reference here is the one I purchased -

 

http://www.gandermountain.com/modperl/product/details.cgi?pdesc=Saiga-IZ109-Shotgun&i=617769

 

Thanks for your help.

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I know pistol grips are illegal in NYS and from what I've read thumbhole stock are a grey area.

 

 

 

according to your new law thumbhole stocks is not a  "grey area", they consider  that as a "assault weapon feature"

 

 

go to Pg 3, the definitions is there

 

http://www.nypdcea.org/pdfs/NYSP_Safe_Act_Field_Guide.pdf

Edited by Matthew Hopkins

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I know pistol grips are illegal in NYS and from what I've read thumbhole stock are a grey area.

 

 

 

according to your new law thumbhole stocks is not a  "grey area", they consider  that as a "assault weapon feature"

 

 

go to Pg 3, the definitions is there

 

http://www.nypdcea.org/pdfs/NYSP_Safe_Act_Field_Guide.pdf

 

 

Damn. Well, reading through that section, it says nothing about a pistol grip? (For semi-auto shotguns)...what does this mean? Pistol grips are OK on shotguns?

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IIRC, that is a Bulgarian thumb hole stock.... might help your search.

 

I'm no help with NYS law tho.

 

http://www.desertfoxsales.com/SLR95_BUTT_STOCK_p/dfs-240b.htm

 

Found that. There is no way it's $20 is it?

 

Sure looks that way. Its dirt cheap because it's for a milled receiver. Saiga 12 is stamped. Judging by the picture you put up (it has obviously been modified) in your first post, they can be made to work somehow, at least if only for a photo opportunity .

Edited by Mullet Man

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Damn. Well, reading through that section, it says nothing about a pistol grip? (For semi-auto shotguns)...what does this mean? Pistol grips are OK on shotguns?

 

 

 

if you go by the features, you can only have one feature. now I'm no lawyer, but I play one on the internet and I slept at a HOLIDAY INN, once biggrin.png. but to me, it seems that if you can make it so that the magazine no longer detachable  and can't hold  more then 7 "rounds"  then you can put a thumbhole stock on it. possibly a pistol grip  

 

but the questions becomes, how do they consider a magazine being "fixed"?  and  how do you load the mag if it is fixed?

 

disclaimer: don't take this as legal advice. I don't believe the defense, "but your honor,  Matthew Hopkins on the SAIGA 12 board said it will be OK"  will fly 021.gif 

 

 

BTW, I forgot to welcome you to the board. Welcome smile.png

Edited by Matthew Hopkins

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Damn. Well, reading through that section, it says nothing about a pistol grip? (For semi-auto shotguns)...what does this mean? Pistol grips are OK on shotguns?

 

 

 

if you go by the features, you can only have one feature. now I'm no lawyer, but I play one on the internet and I slept at a HOLIDAY INN, once biggrin.png. but to me, it seems that if you can make it so that the magazine no longer detachable  and can't hold  more then 7 "rounds"  then you can put a thumbhole stock on it. possibly a pistol grip  

 

but the questions becomes, what do they consider "fixed magazine" and  how do you load the mag if it is fixed?

 

disclaimer: don't take this as legal advice. I don't believe the defense, "but your honor,  Matthew Hopkins on the SAIGA 12 board said it will be OK" will fly 021.gif 

 

 

Lol. I'll keep my detachable mags for now. I'm only living in this dumb state for one more year then I'm moving to VT. I'll deal with the grip for now I suppose.

 

Thanks for everyones help!

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Lol. I'll keep my detachable mags for now. I'm only living in this dumb state for one more year then I'm moving to VT. I'll deal with the grip for now I suppose.

 

Thanks for everyones help!

 

 

 

don't tell me you'll be working for those 2 old hippies BEN AND JERRY. 021.gif 021.gif

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Thumbhole semi-Automatic shotguns that accept a detachable magazine are illegal in NY.

Edited by YOT

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I realize this thread is a little old, but I want to clarify something here. A semi auto shotgun that accepts a detachable magazine is considered an "assault weapon" in N.Y. It doesn't matter what other features it has. Where a semi auto rifle needs a detachable magazine plus one other evil feature, a semi auto shotgun needs only a detachable magazine. The exception is, "is it unable to hold more than five rounds in a fixed or detachable magazine?" I suppose that means you may only possess magazines that hold five or fewer round? Now, I don't have the time to dig into the written law again right now(at work), so don't quote me on this next part. Going strictly by the interactive menu on the safe act site, New Yorkers should be familiar with this, a semi auto shotgun, with a detachable magazine, that can only contain five rounds, May have any of the other banned features. Including pistol grips, bayo lugs, muzzle devices and the like.

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I realize this thread is a little old, but I want to clarify something here. A semi auto shotgun that accepts a detachable magazine is considered an "assault weapon" in N.Y. It doesn't matter what other features it has. Where a semi auto rifle needs a detachable magazine plus one other evil feature, a semi auto shotgun needs only a detachable magazine. The exception is, "is it unable to hold more than five rounds in a fixed or detachable magazine?" I suppose that means you may only possess magazines that hold five or fewer round? Now, I don't have the time to dig into the written law again right now(at work), so don't quote me on this next part. Going strictly by the interactive menu on the safe act site, New Yorkers should be familiar with this, a semi auto shotgun, with a detachable magazine, that can only contain five rounds, May have any of the other banned features. Including pistol grips, bayo lugs, muzzle devices and the like.

 

Please let us know what you find out. nothing.gif

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Is whistley face guy sarcastic? I'm just trying to help people get through this mess without going to jail. You know as well as I do that we're still suffering the consequences of other's ignorance. But seriously, can you confirm our deny the whole 5 round thing?

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Maybe just stick to an SVD style stock, i have one for converted models as well as a factory/sporter one that i won't be using once I get my saiga converted.

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.... But seriously, can you confirm our deny the whole 5 round thing?

 

No.

 

Ask a State Trooper.

 

 

See, I already went through this with you. And I sent you to a forum where some actual NY lawyers are members. 

 

FWIW, asking legal advice in an open forum borders on ridiculous. Even as an LEO, I wouldn't offer advice here, at this point. The law is written vaguely ON PURPOSE. Find facts through people who HAVE to give you facts, but there aren't any here that are in that position.

Edited by YOT

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I'm neither trying to offer advice ("don't quote me") or seek it. I'm just stating, first, the fact that semi auto shotguns are regulated in a different way than rifles, and secondly, my interpretation of how the nonsense is written. This is the point of forums and open discussion in general is it not? To state opinions and let people interpret them as they see fit? I tried to make it clear that my comments were not words to live by. Others in this thread have done the same as I, and were not met with the same disapproval. I'm just a guy, who likes guns, and has strong feelings and opinions about what happened to us back in 2013. Talking about it, reminding people of what is still going on, is what helps us get through it. Sweeping it under the rug means they win.

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I'm neither trying to offer advice ("don't quote me") or seek it. I'm just stating, first, the fact that semi auto shotguns are regulated in a different way than rifles, and secondly, my interpretation of how the nonsense is written. This is the point of forums and open discussion in general is it not? To state opinions and let people interpret them as they see fit? I tried to make it clear that my comments were not words to live by. Others in this thread have done the same as I, and were not met with the same disapproval. I'm just a guy, who likes guns, and has strong feelings and opinions about what happened to us back in 2013. Talking about it, reminding people of what is still going on, is what helps us get through it. Sweeping it under the rug means they win.

 

 

Your "interpretation" is what will get you in trouble. It's their 'interpretation" that is the law, which is exactly why I replied as I did. 

 

You are not alone in your "strong feelings and opinions" about the SafeAct, And I would gladly talk to you about that off-the-record and face-to-face. I won't however put into print what I think YOU should do. That's your choice. My choice is noncompliance and I will accept the consequences of that, if need be.

Edited by YOT
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I respect your choice. I'm not trying to be hostile, I just felt singled out and this is one topic that already has a lot of emotion tied into it, for me at least, and I'm sure others in the same spot. I will take your advice and keep my thoughts on the matter out of text. It will serve me better.

  • Like 1

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