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.30 caliber cartridges' pluses and minuses?


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Hello Everyone: 

 

I apologize if this has been debated here before, but I am trying to learn more about three popular .30 caliber cartridges. I also seek more insight into why the .308 is supposedly a superior .30 caliber cartridge. 

 

It seems the three most popular .30 caliber cartridges are the .308, the .30-06, and the .300 Winchester Magnum. I remember deciding to get a .30-06 rifle because it is a very versatile cartridge. You can reload it for almost anything. It shoots a very wide spectrum of bullets. My .30-06 is quite accurate too even though it's an older Rem 700 ADL with a skinny barrel. 

 

However, I keep hearing how the .308 is a more accurate round. It doesn't hold as much powder though, but it's what a lot of competition shooters, snipers, and law enforcement use. 

 

The .300 Win. Mag. is famous for long range capability and being used by Chris Kyle. Interestingly, for all its size and power, the latest issue of American Rifleman says you burn "20-25% more propellant than the .30-06 to gain a 10% increase in velocity when shooting the same weight bullets." it also says that's only a 200 - 300 f.p.s increase in velocity. I guess that's a lot. They stress it's a great elk cartridge. However, I've heard there's quicker bore erosion with .300 Win. Mag. Of course, there's a lot more recoil too.

 

A question is which one is the best choice if you're rifle shopping? I recently was infatuated with Savage's 110 FCP in .300 Win Mag with a thick barrel and HS Precision stock, but if I ever do get to go hunting I can still take deer or elk or hogs with a .30-06. I find it interesting that many new bolt rifles like Savage's 110 FCP are not available in .30-06, but you can get them in .308, .300 Win Mag., and .338 Lapua. It's like the .30-06 has been skipped and is only available with more traditional hunting rifles. Why?

 

So why is the .308 supposedly a more accurate cartridge, and the .300 Win. Mag. a more popular choice for hunters these days compared to the .30-06 when they all shoot the same diameter bullets? Given it's versatility, I don't understand why many new models of bolt rifles are not chambered in .30-06 too. I noticed Remington's 700 "Long Range" rifle with a heavier barrel does include .30-06 as a choice, but that seems to be an exception these days. 

 

Just wondering guys. I've never heard an explanation about the .308, and I recently saw a good video suggesting the 6.5 Creedmore is a better choice than the .300 Win Mag. for long range shooting. Please pardon any ignorance on my part of external ballistics.

 

Despite all of the above, the .30-30 is still a great 100 - 200 yard rifle too. Heck ... I've seen elk taken with bows & arrows. 

 

Thank you. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I can answer part of your question. New bolt action rifles are usually designed so the action can be used with several different calibers with minimal changes. So you see a lot of near-identical rifles with different chamberings. Take the Ruger American line for example. .223, .243, 6.5, .308 are some of the chamberings available. Those are all "short" cartridges that use a short action. Cartridges like the 25-06 and 30-06 are "long" cartridges that use a long action. Since short actions can be use for more chamberings and more popular rounds, guess which gets made?

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I don't think .308 is inherently "more accurate" than .30-06.

I think it is usually referred to as being more "efficient".

IE: It will do about 97% of what a .30-06 will do in the 140gn to 175gn bullet weight range, in a more compact package.

This allows the use of shorter, stiffer actions and the use of about 4/5ths the amount of powder (shorter burn column).

Also. .300 Win Mag is to .30-06 as .30-06 is to .308. 

.300 Win Mag really comes into it's own with bullets of 200gn to 220gn weights.

 

Macbeau...

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 .308 is a 'modernized' 30-O6 for military use. When you shoot as many rounds as the military, then the savings from the reduced weight and volume of the ammo compounds like mortgage interest!

 A .308 can do anything a 30-O6  from 55gr acellerators up to about 150gr or so, and in a shorter lighter action. The 30-O6 can do all that and drop Moose with 200gr., 300 Magnum does what 30-O6 does, and can throw heavy bullets FASTER!

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I'd venture to say one of the 3 most popular .30 caliber rounds would go to 7.62x39. It has the benefit of being dirt cheap in comparison to the others. Terminal ballistics aren't as good as those you mentioned so if that is part of what you are looking for, the .308 is the more economical choice of the 3 and has basically all the benefits plus a bunch of its own, like rifle availability

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+1 to post 3 I've got a 30-06 but I wish it were 308. If you are comparing most loads of 308 win/7.62 Nato to 30-06 or 7.62x54, there is almost no meaningful difference. 30-06 can be loaded slightly hotter with some projectile types, but in many of the more popular loads, the 308 will be slightly more consistent due to the case efficiency. 

 

The brass is just more compact, more plentiful, etc. You don't need to carry as much or move your hand as far.

 

Actually a lot of cartridges out perform 30 cal depending on your task. If you want to do precision shooting, one of the ~.270 cal  or 7mm cartridges based on the 308 as a parent cartridge will tend to do better almost across the board. And be more cost effective to reload (pretty much a given for long range precision). The savage rifle you posted is mostly for the precision stuff, so perhaps you might want to look at 270 Win, 243 Win.... 

 

If you want to run milsurp modern tactical stuff then 308 is the winner. Ammo is cheap and plentiful comparatively, and there are lots of choices for firearms.

 

If you want to hunt, well so many choices, you'll need to give more info about what you are hunting and the kind of distances you have in mind. Then people other than me can give better input.

Edited by GunFun
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I have hunted big game in Montana for many years, I love the 30-06. I have never been as impressed with the .308 round. It's a military round made to be "Good enough" to terminate a Human life, not anything as big as an Elk or Moose. I've had .308 bullets not exit a deer on broadside shots, so, had I not made a heart shot, it could have ran, without leaving any blood trail. Also, 30-06 ammo is Everywhere. If you lose, or forget your ammo, no problem, buy it anywhere.

 As for the 300 win mag, you had better have a tough shoulder, and reload your own ammo, or you're looking at (at least) $3 every time you pull the trigger. Plus I wouldn't shoot a whitetail doe, or Antelope with that cannon. It can be "Too much gun."

I've had an FN patrol bolt rifle, in .308,  a very accurate firearm, but no more so, and much heavier than my Weatherby 30-06. My uncle had a Howe 300 win mag, but preferred shooting his 30-06........it's never let him down.

 Personally, I think the 30-06 is the overall best hunting round. The widest range of bullets, and very accurate, all of the newer, or supposedly better calibers are just reinventing the wheel......or trying to.....

 30-06 can get you anything from a lil Antelope, to a Bull Moose.

And it's sold everywhere, usually pretty cheap.

 I've also had a .270.

Edited by RobRez
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I think the stuff you are saying applies to military level loads, but not full spec 308. 

 

with 165 grainers they are ballistic twins. Considering that 165 is just about the perfect 30-06 bullet, having the trajectory of 150 grain 30-06 and more energy at long range than the 180s, it is as close to one size fits all as a hunting round gets.


Just about every load available for 30-06 is available in 308 Win with near identical performance. Only the heaviest bullets get a boost with 30-06. The same projectiles can be used in both. Now the military stuff is way lighter than the hunting grade 308. Also, 308 Win is rated to more pressure than the 7.62x51, even though the military brass is thicker. That means you can make some very stout loads using mil type brass and have extra margin of error and better case efficiency.

 

You have shot 100% more big game than I have. (other than some marine varminting)

Edited by GunFun
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A big thing I noticed with .308, is that as a NATO caliber, and common on "scary black guns" is that it is closely tied to the semi auto, scary gun crowd and thusly becomes scarce and expensive every time a Gun Grab scare or Ban scare happens.....too expensive and hoarded when people panic. Here in Montana, I can buy 30-06 at most any gas station for about a buck a round.

Numbers on paper and perceived energy levels are a totally different thing than actually hunting/killing and then getting to actually see the damage, by gutting the animal. I have not witnessed the performance of the .308 as being nearly as impressive as the 30-06, in my experience. Granted, both have done the jobs I asked of them, but I wouldn't use a .308 for Elk or Moose, or Bear.

Edited by RobRez
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Since short actions can be use for more chamberings and more popular rounds, guess which gets made?

 

This is precisely wrong.  The short actions can only be chambered in the short action rounds, while the long actions can be chambered in both; they are just longer than they need to be for the shorter rounds.  The short actions are more popular because the rifles made with them are shorter and lighter.

 

All else being equal, a shorter powder column will have a more consistent burn, and therefore cartridges with this attribute will tend towards greater accuracy than longer cartridges.  However, at hunting ranges you are not likely to notice much of a difference.  At longer ranges (sniping, competition, etc) the difference becomes more noticeable, such that the shorter rounds dominate.

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I have a 30-06, 300 win mag, and a 308. I hunt with all of them. The 308 is semi so it makes the perfect gun for putting free range organic pork on the table...pigs seldom travel alone..so quick follow up shots are needed to make the most of the opportunity. I use the 30-06 for deer out to 250. I use the 300 when I don't want to track or when hunting ag fields where a 300+ shot is needed...mostly hunting in swamps...not a fan of tracking an animal in the dark thru a swamp filled with gators and cotton mouths. A 200gr trophy bonded round usually doesn't require tracking......So like others said above...what is your need?

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