Shooting Issues

[Ossmoses 0]

First time poster, but I have read the forums numerous times.  I am looking for some advice on some shooting issues I have been having with my Saiga 7.62x39.

 

Trying to sight in my rifle I started at 25 yrds.  Had trouble holding a zero but got a 2 in group and moved to 50. 

 

At 50, I was having issues keeping rounds on a 6 in paper plate, with some rounds not registering.  My friend and I tried loading one round at a time in the mag and noticed an improvement.  The second and subsequent shots out of the mag were widely scattered.  One round in the mag, hand cycled produced a less than 2 in group. 

 

At 100 yrds, we had the same issues.  Full mag produced a horrendous grouping.  One round out of the mag, hand cycled produced a better group on a 3 x 3 target of printer paper, but there were "missing" rounds that did not hit even the over large target. 

 

My question is, what would cause this.  Single rounds out of the mag always produced better groups, about where I would expect them to be.  Shooting from a full mag, produced issues starting with the first round cycled by the shot.  Also, at 100 yrds, some rounds were not hitting a paper target of over 20 in square.

 

FYI:  I used both WOLF ammo and Federal.  Federal was slightly more accurate, but not overly so.  Experienced "missing" rounds with both.

I used both iron sights and a POSP scope.  Results were the same for both.

 

Thanks in advance!!

[forsaken352 235]

Well, that's...Different. First thing I'd do is grab your sights and try to move them. See if there's any "play" in the front or rear irons (rear elevation obviously being excluded). Next, check the crown for any damage. Check it over thoroughly as even small nicks and dings can cause accuracy to suffer.  If that's not it, try loading two cartridges, fire one, let the second auto-load, then eject it to see if there's any obvious problems with it. Otherwise, pick up a good box of ammunition and see if those groups tighten up any. Make sure you are using a good rest, breathing, trigger control, etc. "I" would choose iron sights for now, at 25, with a 5 shot group to start, then if it improves any, move to 50 and see. The key here is simply to take your time, have the same exact point of aim for each shot, and be as steady as a rock, then slowly squeezing a round off. I apologize if it may seem like I am insulting your intelligence, but I do not know what your shooting experience is, so I have to be sure you have the basics down before putting too much blame into the equipment.

 

Again, this is just what I would do. Perhaps somebody more learn'ed than I will come along with another answer which is the one you are looking for. Good luck!

[Ossmoses 0]

No insult taken.  I have been shooting for years.  I am not the best shot in the world, but I can maintain MOA with my AR-15 at 100 yards. I know that the Saiga is not nearly that accurate, but it should be able to group better than this.

 

We did check the front sight.  It is not loose, so we ruled that out.  The auto fed rounds did not show any obvious damage, but I will recheck the next time I go out.  I will have to check the crown as well. 

 

Also, I would have thought the Federal box would have been better ammo than wolf.  It certainly looked better at 25 and 50 yards. 

 

Any ideas about the "missing" rounds?  Disintegrating or just bad accuracy?

 

I also had my range buddy, who is a MUCH better shooter than I am shoot as well.  That's how I knew something was wrong. 

Edited May 1, 2016 by Ossmoses

[forsaken352 235]

To me, it still seems like an issue with the crown. A buddy of mine just recently experienced a somewhat similar situation with his Mossberg MVP .308. He had tried to group several different brands of ammunition, and tried several different weight projectiles, and it would produce a ~2 - 2.5" "group" at 25yd., but it would always throw a random shot, as well, often times landing a good 4 or 5" away. Sure enough, I noticed that his crown had a couple of small dings. He sent it back to Mossberg, they re-barreled the action, and while still not a tack driver, it's 100% better. As far as bullet disintegration goes, I highly doubt it. You'd have to be using a very light projectile with a fast twist rate, so I'm thinking it's just shooting way off. However, an easy way to tell would be to set up a very large piece of cardboard behind your target. Make sure the cardboard is clean of any holes which may trick you into thinking they are bullet holes. Use a sharpie to circle any that exist. If one should "disappear" on you, check the cardboard.  Lastly, Federal should definitely print better than Wolf (assuming steel), you are correct.

Edited May 1, 2016 by forsaken352