No More Felons & Convicts Says DOJ

[james lambert 3,059]

pointing to one wrong does not excuse another.

 

and drugs are NOT the same as alcohol 

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

pointing to one wrong does not excuse another.

 

and drugs are NOT the same as alcohol

Alcohol is a drug by every definition, legal and chemical

[james lambert 3,059]

Ignorant children

 

And some wonder how we have come to this place

[randumbthoughts 75]

 

You buy the dope from people at some level....but the cash goes to the top.

 

 

How about the guy growing a few plants in his closet, arrested, imprisoned, and branded a criminal for life because of a nosey neighbor?

 

It's interesting, because you would probably say that someone who owned a 12-round magazine, or cut a barrel a little too short, or had a fun toy without the right kind of paperwork....is being unjustly punished.

 

There are a great many things which we've been conditioned to accept. We've been told that we are so different from our fellow man. 

 

I suppose divide and conquer really works. 

 

EDIT: And I'm no doctor, nor scientist. But it's pretty obvious that marijuana is no more harmful than alcohol. 

Edited May 8, 2016 by randumbthoughts

[james lambert 3,059]

choose to commit a crime, expect to pay a price.

 

 personal  responsibility for ones actions.

Just because you don't agree with a law , does not give you the right to break it.

 

Its NOT obvious that marijuana is no more harmful than drinking.

Look at some REAL studies on lung disease and brain development in younger subjects.

 

I couldnt care less for those who choose to be dumbfuck potheads, but I do take offence to supporting the cartels and making the oh so worn out excuses for drug use in general.

 

drinking in excess is also a stupid destructive thing to do, as  is smoking.both are legal

I have seen more than enough death and destruction from drugs as is, dont need any more.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

choose to commit a crime, expect to pay a price.

 

personal responsibility for ones actions.

Just because you don't agree with a law , does not give you the right to break it.

 

Its NOT obvious that marijuana is no more harmful than drinking.

Look at some REAL studies on lung disease and brain development in younger subjects.

 

I couldnt care less for those who choose to be dumbfuck potheads, but I do take offence to supporting the cartels and making the oh so worn out excuses for drug use in general.

 

drinking in excess is also a stupid destructive thing to do, as is smoking.both are legal

I have seen more than enough death and destruction from drugs as is, dont need any more.

Let's be perfectly honest on this:

A man growing his own isn't funding cartels. He is never going to over dose, he isn't even a proveable increased cancer risk.

Nobody is advocating sales to minors.

In fact you could more effectively restrict distribution to minors with enforible regulations. Because street dealers don't care who buys, but licensed business DO.

 

Your position is that whatever is law is is just. That equates a man of fluid moral principles. Morals that can be written and rewritten as hillary Clinton sees fit. Or whatever evil politican decides.

Now for cartels and traffickers.... answer me this : why don't they bother smuggling alcohol? It's a billion dollar industry, you think they don't want that money? You think that brewing or distillation is more work than synthesizing complex chemical compounds to make drugs.

 

Nearly 88,0009 people (approximately 62,000 men and 26,000 women9) die from alcohol-related causes annually, making it the fourth leading preventable cause of death in the United States. In 2014, alcohol-impaired driving fatalities accounted for 9,967 deaths (31 percent of overall driving fatalities).Jan 14, 2016

 

Alcohol Facts and Statistics | National Institute on Alcohol ...

 

National Institutes of Health (.gov) › niaaa › ..

 

Now go to that same site, and try to find some marijuana related deaths.... ( it's a government site so it should be as unbiased or biased for prohibition yet no data on deaths)

So now either public safety is your concern and alcohol is immoral and wrong or its not... I honestly can't believe you'd be of such fluid principles that your only guide is a legislators pen.

Edited May 8, 2016 by poolingmyignorance

[G O B 3,516]

The THOUSANDS of people murdered by drug cartels and smugglers are not victims of crime .

 

You buy the dope from people at some level....but the cash goes to the top.

victimless crime my ass!

 

your arguments are defining the type of person you are 

And yours define YOU.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

 

 

The THOUSANDS of people murdered by drug cartels and smugglers are not victims of crime .

 

You buy the dope from people at some level....but the cash goes to the top.

victimless crime my ass!

 

your arguments are defining the type of person you are

And yours define YOU.

What he refuses to see is that we could land a fatal blow to those cartels and over night reduce them from a world power to an average street gang and save thousands of lives both citizen and officers alike.

70% of cartel money is from marijuana. Tell me a fortune 500 company that could survive a 70% revenue loss.

[james lambert 3,059]

 

The THOUSANDS of people murdered by drug cartels and smugglers are not victims of crime .

 

You buy the dope from people at some level....but the cash goes to the top.

victimless crime my ass!

 

your arguments are defining the type of person you are 

And yours define YOU.

 

Sure do!!!

 

I am a law abiding productive citizen, a veteran , a volunteer who has given thousands of hours serving my community.

I have worked with the addicted seen the results of drug use.

Seven years in law enforcement as a deputy.

Worked search and rescue.I could go on and on 

 

I will gladly be defined by my record, or my conservative Christian values.

Dont be too surprised If I am intolerant of potheads, druggies, traffickers, thieves, illegal aliens, liberals, communists, corrupt people in ANY position of power or just plain simple stupid people.

 

I am too old and too familiar with the real world to listen to little whiney punks rail against the very core of our society, or argue their love of dope.

Or their bleeding heart sympathy for criminals being labeled for EXACTLY what they are  

Edited May 8, 2016 by unforgiven

[menace667 194]

 

So, I read a lot of these posts and keep seeing the phrase "victimless crime". Can you please explain what this is for me? I was a cop and for a crime to occur there had to be a victim, be it a person or "the state" there was always a victim. Also, just because a person was not a victim doesn't make it victimless. Crack dealers who are arrested for distribution, where the victim is "the state" and not an actual individual, will and do have an impact on society. Same for any drug dealer, drunk driver, reckless driver, financial criminal, etc....

 

I do agree that at times there are asinine laws written and enforced, but often when you hear stories about crazy prosecutions there was more to the story. Also, you aren't convicted by a judge or lawyer but by a jury of your "peers" so if it is some crazy ass conviction they are ultimately responsible for passing down the decision, so by convicting on these crazy charges the public at large are abeddng the creation of these laws.

 

One last point. Felon is a term that describes the severity of a crime for which you were convicted. Everyone doesn't immediately think murder of rape, but people do see that often you showed little care for the safety and security of the public at large through your actions. if Uncle Sam steps in and protects your status as a felon post incarceration those you come in contact with now become victims. How would you like to run a company that handles tons of cash and you hire a thief, which you didn't know about because the government coddled him. Same for these "victimless" white collar criminals. They still have their degrees and can get right back to others money and lives with no one knowing the better. Do you want a thief handling your 401k accounts? How about your personal medical records? Bank transactions? How about being your wife's attendant in a hospital? It is easy to sympathize until it will directly impact you. When you say "sure I would give them a chance", and you probably will, think how you would feel when you can never retire because your 401k was stolen by a career criminal who ran off to a foreign beach, of your kids college fund just dried up, or hell your kid was killed I a bus crash by a drunk bus driver who was a habitual offender but didn't have to disclose that little tidbit on their application so they didn't have to be penalized.

Victimless crime : drug possession/use

Making sales victimless by default

The state is only a "victim" in the sense that the arbitrary dictate they imposed was violated and left avenues for confiscation of revenue.

Just compare any law against drugs to alcohol or prescription deaths and yet to justify them.

Then before you get on the "trafficking " issue ,keep in mind those traffickers wouldn't have a market of their product wasn't black market and could be regulated.

Another example would be prostitution. (Some states a felony after multiple arrest) still safer when regulated.

Then of course there are the magazine restrictions and assault weapons bans..

Again the only "victim" is the states arbitrary dictate. It's literally holding respect of a piece of paper written by scum bags like Bloomberg in higher regard than fellow humans rights to choose how to live their lives.

I will touch a few points you made-

1) you say that is drugs were legal there would be no market for criminals to profit (trafficking): I lived in CO for the last two years, where marijuana was made legal for recreational use. All it did was embolden those who use to be brazen about their public use, to include DUI. Also, there were multiple multi-million dollar busts where people took advantage of the legality to grow for personal consumption and still sell to avoid taxation. Before you say tax evasion is a victimless crime, every dollar you avoid paying will inevitably come out of someone else's pocket to make the government function.

 

2) hooking- you say regulation makes it safer (ironic since regulation is simply laws governing the profession and failure to adhere to them has repercussions). The problem with legal hooking is that it is an impossible profession to regulate, and offer some form of safety to either the hooker or their John, so criminalization is meant to deter the action.

 

3) weapons ban- these are asinine and we all know it.

 

The reality of it all is you have no requirement to abide by the laws, but your decision can have consequences. You can either take the route that ends with you being a criminal or try to use the proper channels and change things, which can happen but usually requires more effort. Have conviction to make change to the laws and don't just complain about them or be part of the problem.... Your call.

[Machinist 150]

I grew up in what most people define as the Hood, very easy to be envolved in criminal activities with your buds. As you start to grow-up you make adult decisions at an early age, I chose not to be envolved in the neighborhood activities. All the parents who lived on the block where I grew-up (1 city block) had at least one child go to jail for various reasons including my younger brother, all felonies. I know what they were envolved with, there were no victimless crimes committed by my exfriends.When arrested they were charged only with the crime they committed. Proving others crimes were committed was impossible unless someone snitched, no one did. We all have choices in life...When my children were growing-up preached to my children adult decision have adult consequences. If you are a doctor, you are called doctor...

[menace667 194]

If you are a doctor, you are called doctor...

Best quote yet. This about sums it up. My best friend made a poor choice as a teen and spent some time in prison. It took work when he got out, but staying straight and working his ass off proved to folks he wanted to chance and needed a chance. He is now a manager for a company and makes decent money, even for a non felon. Problem isn't that there aren't chances to be had, it is that those who are branded with the title criminal or felon rarely want to put in the work and time to change people opinion of them.... Which is usually what led to their poor choices in the first place. Why work for what you can steal, right???

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

 

 

So, I read a lot of these posts and keep seeing the phrase "victimless crime". Can you please explain what this is for me? I was a cop and for a crime to occur there had to be a victim, be it a person or "the state" there was always a victim. Also, just because a person was not a victim doesn't make it victimless. Crack dealers who are arrested for distribution, where the victim is "the state" and not an actual individual, will and do have an impact on society. Same for any drug dealer, drunk driver, reckless driver, financial criminal, etc....

 

I do agree that at times there are asinine laws written and enforced, but often when you hear stories about crazy prosecutions there was more to the story. Also, you aren't convicted by a judge or lawyer but by a jury of your "peers" so if it is some crazy ass conviction they are ultimately responsible for passing down the decision, so by convicting on these crazy charges the public at large are abeddng the creation of these laws.

 

One last point. Felon is a term that describes the severity of a crime for which you were convicted. Everyone doesn't immediately think murder of rape, but people do see that often you showed little care for the safety and security of the public at large through your actions. if Uncle Sam steps in and protects your status as a felon post incarceration those you come in contact with now become victims. How would you like to run a company that handles tons of cash and you hire a thief, which you didn't know about because the government coddled him. Same for these "victimless" white collar criminals. They still have their degrees and can get right back to others money and lives with no one knowing the better. Do you want a thief handling your 401k accounts? How about your personal medical records? Bank transactions? How about being your wife's attendant in a hospital? It is easy to sympathize until it will directly impact you. When you say "sure I would give them a chance", and you probably will, think how you would feel when you can never retire because your 401k was stolen by a career criminal who ran off to a foreign beach, of your kids college fund just dried up, or hell your kid was killed I a bus crash by a drunk bus driver who was a habitual offender but didn't have to disclose that little tidbit on their application so they didn't have to be penalized.

Victimless crime : drug possession/use

Making sales victimless by default

The state is only a "victim" in the sense that the arbitrary dictate they imposed was violated and left avenues for confiscation of revenue.

Just compare any law against drugs to alcohol or prescription deaths and yet to justify them.

Then before you get on the "trafficking " issue ,keep in mind those traffickers wouldn't have a market of their product wasn't black market and could be regulated.

Another example would be prostitution. (Some states a felony after multiple arrest) still safer when regulated.

Then of course there are the magazine restrictions and assault weapons bans..

Again the only "victim" is the states arbitrary dictate. It's literally holding respect of a piece of paper written by scum bags like Bloomberg in higher regard than fellow humans rights to choose how to live their lives.

I will touch a few points you made-

1) you say that is drugs were legal there would be no market for criminals to profit (trafficking): I lived in CO for the last two years, where marijuana was made legal for recreational use. All it did was embolden those who use to be brazen about their public use, to include DUI. Also, there were multiple multi-million dollar busts where people took advantage of the legality to grow for personal consumption and still sell to avoid taxation. Before you say tax evasion is a victimless crime, every dollar you avoid paying will inevitably come out of someone else's pocket to make the government function.

 

2) hooking- you say regulation makes it safer (ironic since regulation is simply laws governing the profession and failure to adhere to them has repercussions). The problem with legal hooking is that it is an impossible profession to regulate, and offer some form of safety to either the hooker or their John, so criminalization is meant to deter the action.

 

3) weapons ban- these are asinine and we all know it.

 

The reality of it all is you have no requirement to abide by the laws, but your decision can have consequences. You can either take the route that ends with you being a criminal or try to use the proper channels and change things, which can happen but usually requires more effort. Have conviction to make change to the laws and don't just complain about them or be part of the problem.... Your call.

First, I really appreciate the well thought out argument. You didn't even resort to any name calling or accusations of substance abuse. I applaud you.

Now I think it's important to recognize that tax evasion exist within ALL fields of vocation...so if that's the catalyst for legality, vs illegality, then I everything should be illegal.

Colorado has a unique geographic issue due to it being surrounded by prohibition states so some trafficking is going to occur unless all states hop on.

Hooking as you so eloquently put it can be regulated and is in Nevada and many countries. There are methods of checking employee vs health records,.. taxes are the only real issue as the "product" cant be inventoried.

[JonWienke 131]

So, I read a lot of these posts and keep seeing the phrase "victimless crime". Can you please explain what this is for me?

You're not very bright, asking that question on a gun board. How about the guy who owns a firearm with a barrel 0.1" shorter than some arbitrary number, who gets sentenced to a lengthy term in prison even though he never used it to commit a crime or acted irresponsibly with it. Who is the "victim" if someone merely owns a firearm that fails to meet certain arbitrarily-defined unconstitutional criteria?

[jerry52 893]

 

If you are a doctor, you are called doctor...

Best quote yet. This about sums it up. My best friend made a poor choice as a teen and spent some time in prison. It took work when he got out, but staying straight and working his ass off proved to folks he wanted to chance and needed a chance. He is now a manager for a company and makes decent money, even for a non felon. Problem isn't that there aren't chances to be had, it is that those who are branded with the title criminal or felon rarely want to put in the work and time to change people opinion of them.... Which is usually what led to their poor choices in the first place. Why work for what you can steal, right???

There are always actions and results for poor choices. If one is careless and makes the wrong choice and loses an arm.

Well life will not be the same will it. Peoples opinion of you will change as well,you cannot control that.

What you can control to a point is how you are perceived by others by your proven ability and nature

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

 

So, I read a lot of these posts and keep seeing the phrase "victimless crime". Can you please explain what this is for me?

You're not very bright, asking that question on a gun board. How about the guy who owns a firearm with a barrel 0.1" shorter than some arbitrary number, who gets sentenced to a lengthy term in prison even though he never used it to commit a crime or acted irresponsibly with it. Who is the "victim" if someone merely owns a firearm that fails to meet certain arbitrarily-defined unconstitutional criteria?

The state, remember? It's very sensitive and we must respect it's "safe space" or it will have a transgender issue.

Funny how "the state" is we the people, but it's politican lobbyists who decide what laws are imposed upon us.

[YOT 3,742]

 

So, I read a lot of these posts and keep seeing the phrase "victimless crime". Can you please explain what this is for me?

You're not very bright, asking that question on a gun board. How about the guy who owns a firearm with a barrel 0.1" shorter than some arbitrary number, who gets sentenced to a lengthy term in prison even though he never used it to commit a crime or acted irresponsibly with it. Who is the "victim" if someone merely owns a firearm that fails to meet certain arbitrarily-defined unconstitutional criteria?

 

 

 

Nowhere in the definition of "crime" does it say there has to be a victim. Perhaps that is something you wish was in there. It's not.

 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/crime

 

Further:

 

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/crime

Edited May 9, 2016 by YOT

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

 

 

 

So, I read a lot of these posts and keep seeing the phrase "victimless crime". Can you please explain what this is for me?

You're not very bright, asking that question on a gun board. How about the guy who owns a firearm with a barrel 0.1" shorter than some arbitrary number, who gets sentenced to a lengthy term in prison even though he never used it to commit a crime or acted irresponsibly with it. Who is the "victim" if someone merely owns a firearm that fails to meet certain arbitrarily-defined unconstitutional criteria?

 

Nowhere in the definition of "crime" does it say there has to be a victim. Perhaps that is something you wish was in there. It's not.

 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/crime

 

Further:

 

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/crime

If there is no victim them you're not supporting a system that is designed to implement justice, but instead creating legal pitfalls to take advantage of the unwary. This is predatoey behavior and when citzens take part in it we call it "extortion " and THAT is a crime with a victim.

[randumbthoughts 75]

 

 

 

 

So, I read a lot of these posts and keep seeing the phrase "victimless crime". Can you please explain what this is for me?

You're not very bright, asking that question on a gun board. How about the guy who owns a firearm with a barrel 0.1" shorter than some arbitrary number, who gets sentenced to a lengthy term in prison even though he never used it to commit a crime or acted irresponsibly with it. Who is the "victim" if someone merely owns a firearm that fails to meet certain arbitrarily-defined unconstitutional criteria?

Nowhere in the definition of "crime" does it say there has to be a victim. Perhaps that is something you wish was in there. It's not.

 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/crime

 

Further:

 

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/crime

If there is no victim them you're not supporting a system that is designed to implement justice, but instead creating legal pitfalls to take advantage of the unwary. This is predatoey behavior and when citzens take part in it we call it "extortion " and THAT is a crime with a victim.

A steady stream of nonviolent, non harmful people keeps the prisoners coming in. That keeps the beds full so everyone from the manufacturers using free labor to the prison telecoms that charge $6 a minute for calls. Keep making that money. And of course the corrections officers keep their jobs as well. Prison is a business and no company likes downsizing. Edited May 9, 2016 by randumbthoughts

[Machinist 150]

Can you cite which manufactures use prison labor? I'm aware of the fact the states use prison labor to make license plates to control the cost, also prisons use felons labor to grow food to feed the felons. Along with giving the felons (found guilty of committing a felony) a few dollars to spend at the commissary, I believe the work allows the felons to purchase items, instead of stealing from fellow felons.

Telephone calls for the most part are made collect to the party contacted by the felon. I'm not soft on crime...

Maybe take a long and in-depth look at your position. Society functions due to the majority of people abiding by established laws, not anarchy... Just an old man's view about the world we live in.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Can you cite which manufactures use prison labor? I'm aware of the fact the states use prison labor to make license plates to control the cost, also prisons use felons labor to grow food to feed the felons. Along with giving the felons (found guilty of committing a felony) a few dollars to spend at the commissary, I believe the work allows the felons to purchase items, instead of stealing from fellow felons.

Telephone calls for the most part are made collect to the party contacted by the felon. I'm not soft on crime...

Maybe take a long and in-depth look at your position. Society functions due to the majority of people abiding by established laws, not anarchy... Just an old man's view about the world we live in.

Nobody is advocating for anarchy... just contemplating how many laws a society needs to function. If there is no victim you are not advocating a free society instead you are advocating an authoritarian society, either economical ,cultural, or worse, both.

Ever judicial session thousands of laws are voted on and passed by representives whom haven't even read the entire bill,if any of it beyond its lobbist,and if they themselves are exempt. One law for thee,another for me.

[YOT 3,742]

Can you cite which manufactures use prison labor? I'm aware of the fact the states use prison labor to make license plates to control the cost, also prisons use felons labor to grow food to feed the felons. Along with giving the felons (found guilty of committing a felony) a few dollars to spend at the commissary, I believe the work allows the felons to purchase items, instead of stealing from fellow felons.

Telephone calls for the most part are made collect to the party contacted by the felon. I'm not soft on crime...

Maybe take a long and in-depth look at your position. Society functions due to the majority of people abiding by established laws, not anarchy... Just an old man's view about the world we live in.

 

Soap and other cleaning products are made at our prison, for use in State agencies only. Ingredients are bought from Dial and other manufacturing suppliers, by taxpayers. The highest paid inmates at our facility earn 15¢ for 30 hours per week. Most make a dime. They start at 7 1/2¢. Wages are on taxpayers. $9 will buy a pack of Newports and a couple of Snickers bars in NY prisons. The Phone home program is set up on a prepaid account. No money from home, no phone calls. They can still frank 5 letters per month by proving indigence, and mail to lawyers is on the taxpayers.

 

As far as controlling the cost... We had a metal furniture factory. It was closed two years ago due to schools, etc. being able to buy their student furniture at better prices from robotized factories in the private sector. There are no savings from the prison industry. 

Edited May 10, 2016 by YOT

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

 

 

Can you cite which manufactures use prison labor? I'm aware of the fact the states use prison labor to make license plates to control the cost, also prisons use felons labor to grow food to feed the felons. Along with giving the felons (found guilty of committing a felony) a few dollars to spend at the commissary, I believe the work allows the felons to purchase items, instead of stealing from fellow felons.

Telephone calls for the most part are made collect to the party contacted by the felon. I'm not soft on crime...

Maybe take a long and in-depth look at your position. Society functions due to the majority of people abiding by established laws, not anarchy... Just an old man's view about the world we live in.

Soap and other cleaning products are made at our prison, for use in State agencies only. Ingredients are bought from Dial and other manufacturing suppliers, by taxpayers. The highest paid inmates at our facility earn 15¢ for 30 hours per week. Most make a dime. They start at 7 1/2¢. Wages are on taxpayers. $9 will buy a pack of Newports and a couple of Snickers bars in NY prisons. The Phone home program is set up on a prepaid account. No money from home, no phone calls. They can still frank 5 letters per month by proving indigence, and mail to lawyers is on the taxpayers.

 

As far as controlling the cost... We had a metal furniture factory. It was closed two years ago due to schools, etc. being able to but their student furniture at better prices from robotized factories in the private sector. There are no savings from the prison industry.

The only profits I know of are in the privatized that get paid by the gov per head housed. There have been a few judges that have been busted giving out max sentences for every crime, and receiving kick backs.

http://nypost.com/2014/02/23/film-details-teens-struggles-in-state-detention-in-payoff-scandal/

[YOT 3,742]

 

 

Can you cite which manufactures use prison labor? I'm aware of the fact the states use prison labor to make license plates to control the cost, also prisons use felons labor to grow food to feed the felons. Along with giving the felons (found guilty of committing a felony) a few dollars to spend at the commissary, I believe the work allows the felons to purchase items, instead of stealing from fellow felons.

Telephone calls for the most part are made collect to the party contacted by the felon. I'm not soft on crime...

Maybe take a long and in-depth look at your position. Society functions due to the majority of people abiding by established laws, not anarchy... Just an old man's view about the world we live in.

Soap and other cleaning products are made at our prison, for use in State agencies only. Ingredients are bought from Dial and other manufacturing suppliers, by taxpayers. The highest paid inmates at our facility earn 15¢ for 30 hours per week. Most make a dime. They start at 7 1/2¢. Wages are on taxpayers. $9 will buy a pack of Newports and a couple of Snickers bars in NY prisons. The Phone home program is set up on a prepaid account. No money from home, no phone calls. They can still frank 5 letters per month by proving indigence, and mail to lawyers is on the taxpayers.

 

As far as controlling the cost... We had a metal furniture factory. It was closed two years ago due to schools, etc. being able to but their student furniture at better prices from robotized factories in the private sector. There are no savings from the prison industry.

The only profits I know of are in the privatized that get paid by the gov per head housed. There have been a few judges that have been busted giving out max sentences for every crime, and receiving kick backs.

http://nypost.com/2014/02/23/film-details-teens-struggles-in-state-detention-in-payoff-scandal/

 

 

#juvenile #notinnewyorkbutinnypost #dontbelieveeverythingyouread

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

 

 

 

 

Can you cite which manufactures use prison labor? I'm aware of the fact the states use prison labor to make license plates to control the cost, also prisons use felons labor to grow food to feed the felons. Along with giving the felons (found guilty of committing a felony) a few dollars to spend at the commissary, I believe the work allows the felons to purchase items, instead of stealing from fellow felons.

Telephone calls for the most part are made collect to the party contacted by the felon. I'm not soft on crime...

Maybe take a long and in-depth look at your position. Society functions due to the majority of people abiding by established laws, not anarchy... Just an old man's view about the world we live in.

Soap and other cleaning products are made at our prison, for use in State agencies only. Ingredients are bought from Dial and other manufacturing suppliers, by taxpayers. The highest paid inmates at our facility earn 15¢ for 30 hours per week. Most make a dime. They start at 7 1/2¢. Wages are on taxpayers. $9 will buy a pack of Newports and a couple of Snickers bars in NY prisons. The Phone home program is set up on a prepaid account. No money from home, no phone calls. They can still frank 5 letters per month by proving indigence, and mail to lawyers is on the taxpayers.

 

As far as controlling the cost... We had a metal furniture factory. It was closed two years ago due to schools, etc. being able to but their student furniture at better prices from robotized factories in the private sector. There are no savings from the prison industry.

The only profits I know of are in the privatized that get paid by the gov per head housed. There have been a few judges that have been busted giving out max sentences for every crime, and receiving kick backs.

http://nypost.com/2014/02/23/film-details-teens-struggles-in-state-detention-in-payoff-scandal/

#juvenile #notinnewyorkbutinnypost #dontbelieveeverythingyouread

Hmm

http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/08/12/pennsylvania.judge.sentenced/

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/aug/11/kids-for-cash-judge-pennsylvania

 

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/08/11/pennsylvania-judge-gets-28-years-in-kids-for-cash-case.html

 

Sorry, but crooks sit on both sides of the bench.

[jerry52 893]

 

 

 

 

So, I read a lot of these posts and keep seeing the phrase "victimless crime". Can you please explain what this is for me?

You're not very bright, asking that question on a gun board. How about the guy who owns a firearm with a barrel 0.1" shorter than some arbitrary number, who gets sentenced to a lengthy term in prison even though he never used it to commit a crime or acted irresponsibly with it. Who is the "victim" if someone merely owns a firearm that fails to meet certain arbitrarily-defined unconstitutional criteria?

Nowhere in the definition of "crime" does it say there has to be a victim. Perhaps that is something you wish was in there. It's not.http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/crime

Further:http://www.thefreedictionary.com/crime

If there is no victim them you're not supporting a system that is designed to implement justice, but instead creating legal pitfalls to take advantage of the unwary. This is predatoey behavior and when citzens take part in it we call it "extortion " and THAT is a crime with a victim.

A steady stream of nonviolent, non harmful people keeps the prisoners coming in. That keeps the beds full so everyone from the manufacturers using free labor to the prison telecoms that charge $6 a minute for calls. Keep making that money. And of course the corrections officers keep their jobs as well. Prison is a business and no company likes downsizing.

You obviously have never worked with Felons to any degree

[YOT 3,742]

 

Sorry, but crooks sit on both sides of the bench.

 

 

Sure they do. I just watched gleefully as Sheldon Silver was handed a 12 year sentence for corruption. Oh that's right, he was a lawyer, with immense political clout, sitting in office for an entire career. The corruption runs deep, everywhere.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

 

 

Sorry, but crooks sit on both sides of the bench.

 

Sure they do. I just watched gleefully as Sheldon Silver was handed a 12 year sentence for corruption. Oh that's right, he was a lawyer, with immense political clout, sitting in office for an entire career. The corruption runs deep, everywhere.

Just a few thousand reasons I don't have much faith in the system.

 

http://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/Scores-of-cases-affected-after-HPD-Crime-Lab-5562835.php

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/massachusetts-lab-tech-arrested-for-alleged-improper-handling-of-drug-tests/

 

I also personally know two guys falsely accused of rape. One never got charged before the accuser admitted she was lying. But not before everybody she knew beat his ass.

The other did 5 years, despite having three witnesses and video showing him at work at the time. The prosecution claimed there was a window of elapsed time that he could have committed it in and returned to work... so the jury convicted. The accuser was his ex wife, she later recanted and was put on probation.

 

So I don't have 100% support for anything.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Ignorant children

 

And some wonder how we have come to this place

So please, tell me other than social acceptance and a lost war against alcohol

How is it different?

I present to you schedule 1 narcotics legal definition :

 

Schedule I drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with no currently accepted medical use and a high potential for abuse. Schedule I drugs are the most dangerous drugsof all the drug schedules with potentially severe psychological or physical dependence. (www.dea.gov › druginfo)

 

"Drinking too much can harm your health. Excessive alcohol use led to approximately 88,000 deaths and 2.5 million years of potential life lost (YPLL) each year in the United States from 2006 – 2010, shortening the lives of those who died by an average of 30 years.Feb 29, 2016

 

CDC - Fact Sheets-Alcohol Use And Health - Alcohol

 

www.cdc.gov › alcohol › alcohol-use"

88,000 deaths a year from alcohol alone and another 2.5 million relate accidents resulting in serious injury.

 

Vs 47,000 from ALL OTHER DRUGS COMBINED.

 

http://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2015/p1218-drug-overdose.html

 

So please tell me, you ignorant child, how is it different other than the fact YOU consume one and not the others?

[james lambert 3,059]