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hawk78
Tracy Ingle: Another Drug War Outrage
Wednesday, May 7th, 2008

About a month ago I got a call from a reporter for the Arkansas Times inquiring about my research into paramilitary drug raids. He’d been reporting on a raid in North Little Rock involving a 40-year-old man named Tracy Ingle. When he told me the story over the phone, I was floored, even given all the abuses and mistakes I’ve reported and read about over the last few years. What makes the case especially egregious is not that the police may have gotten the wrong home, that they shot a man, or that they were covering it up or going silent. We’ve seen all that before. What’s mind-blowing about this one is that they’ve continued abusing the poorTracy Ingle's door. guy, even after it should have been clear for some time now that they made a mistake.

From the outset, it should be noted that Tracy Ingle has had some trouble with the law in the past, though nothing violent, and nothing drug-related. He has had a couple of DWI’s, and a citation for failing to appear in court. He apparently also agreed to do some repair work on a friend’s car that later turned out to be stolen.

That said, what’s happened to him over the last few months is pretty outrageous.

Here’s the Arkansas Times piece, which I’d encourage you to read in full. And here’s a follow-up interview with North Little Rock Police Chief Danny Bradley about SWAT tactics.

I’ve since spoken again to the reporter and to Tracy Ingle’s sister, Tiffney Forrester, who herself is a former sheriff’s deputy. I’ve also had a chance to review the warrants and return sheets (pdf).

The North Little Rock Police Department wouldn’t discuss the case with me.

Here’s a quick rundown:

• On January 7, 2008 a paramilitary police unit in North Little Rock, Arkansas conducted a drug raid on Tracy Ingle’s home. Ingle says he had fallen asleep for several hours, and was asleep when the raid happened. He awoke when the police took a battering ram to his door. Another team of officers approached form the outside of the house, and shattered the window to his bedroom.

• When he awoke, Ingle says he thought his home was being invaded by armed robbers. He reached for a broken gun, a pretty clear indication that he had no intention of killing anyone, but rather was trying to scare away the intruders. When he grabbed the gun, an officer inside the house fired his weapon. The bullet hit Ingle just above the knee, shattered his thigh bone, and nearly severed his lower leg. When the outside officers heard the shot, they opened up on Ingle, hitting him four more times. According to Ingle’s sister, one bullet still rests just above Ingle’s heart, and can’t be removed.

• Ingle was taken to the hospital, and spent a week-and-a-half in intensive care. He was then removed from intensive care—still in his hospital pajamas—and taken to the North Little Rock police department, where he was questioned for five hours. He was not told he was suspected of a crime, and his family wasn’t allowed to speak with him. After the interrogation, he was arrested and transferred to the county jail.

• Ingle spent the next four days in jail. He says he was never given his pain medication or his antibiotics. Though hospital nurses told him to change his bandages and clean his wounds every 4-6 hours, Ingle told the Arkansas Times that jail officials changed them only twice in four days. Ingle’s wounds became infected during the time he was in jail.

• Police found no illegal drugs in Ingle’s home. They did find a scale, which Ingle’s sister tells me she was an extra she was given when she worked at a medical testing facility for use in her jewelry-making hobby. They also found a bunch of small plastic bags. Again, Ingle’s sister says these were part of her business. "I was leaving the country for a while, and I stored a lot of my stuff at his house," she told me. "The scales and bags were mine, and are both common things to have for anyone who makes jewelry." Police also found the broken gun and a broken police scanner.

• From those items, the police charged Ingle with running a drug enterprise. They also charged him with assault, for pointing his broken gun at the police officers who had just barged into his home. The judge set Ingle’s bail at $250,000, explaining that it had to be set high because Ingle had engaged in a shootout with police—never mind that Ingle didn’t fire a shot. Ingle was able to sell his car to pay a bail bondsman. But with no car, his injuries render him basically immobile. He had to walk two miles on crutches and an infected leg to his hearing last week.

• The police obtained a no-knock warrant for Ingle’s home about three weeks prior to the raid. The warrant itself (pdf) reads like boilerplate, with no specific references to Ingle (other than his address), or why he specifically posed a risk to police safety, or of disposing of drugs before coming to answer the door. It mentions no controlled buys. It doesn’t even mention an informant. In fact, someone scratched out "crack cocaine" and hand-wrote in "methamphetamine" on the type-written warrant, suggesting a cut, plug, and paste job. The Supreme Court has ruled that police must show case-specific evidence of exigent circumstances in order to be issued a no-knock warrant. The mere fact that it’s a drug case isn’t enough. The warrant for Ingle’s home contains no such specific information.

Many times, information specific to the investigation is contained in the affidavit the investigating officer files for the search warrant, not in the warrant itself. Forrester says she has called the North Little Rock Police Department more than 20 times in an effort to obtain a copy of the affidavits. She says they at first refused to return her phone calls. When she was finally able to speak with a lieutenant, he became angry when she told she had contacted the media. She then says he told her to "dream on" when she asked for copies of the affidavits.

• According to Forrester, Ingle’s neighbor had a direct line of sight into the bedroom, and saw the entire raid. His account initially matched Ingle’s. But that changed. "We have a witness, a next door neighbor that saw the entire incident," Forrester told me. "He came forward on his own to give a statement to the family. Police never questioned him until a month or so after the shooting, at my insistence. They kept this neighbor in his home, and questioned him for at least four hours, refusing to let the man’s wife come home, of for other people to see him. When the police finished intimidating the man, they told him specifically that ‘he did not see what he thought he saw.’ The neighbor is now afraid to talk to the media." I have not yet been able to speak with the neighbor.

• Ingle’s family was able to put up $1,000 to retain an attorney, but can’t afford the extra $6,000 the attorney has asked to represent Ingle. Ingle is therefore still looking for representation. He has no health insurance, and no money to pay for medication, or to continue treatment of his injuries.

• Last week, after the Arkansas Times article appeared, the judge in the case issued a gag order, preventing Ingle and any future attorney he may have from talking to the media about what happened to him. This is puzzling. Before today there had been exactly two articles about this case—not exactly a media circus. It’s hard to understand why a gag order was necessary. It’s only real purpose is to prevent more people from learning about what’s increasingly looking like a railroading. And it’s only effect is to lend more support to the possibility that it is, in fact, a cover-up and railroading.

As noted, the police aren’t talking. And the prosecutor is now bound by the gag order. Perhaps there’s some piece of information damning to Ingle I’m not yet aware of—though it’s hard to imagine what that might be.

Barring that, what’s happening to Tracy Ingle is pretty outrageous.

UPDATE: The Arkansas Times reports that the gag order in Ingle’s case was withdrawn late yesterday. I don’t know that this will make the police or prosecutors any more likely to talk about the case, but if I have time this afternoon, I’ll try again to give them a call.


The official site to donate to the Tracy Ingle cause and learn more about what's happening is http://www.justicefortracy.com/
ClickClickD'oh
I'm sorry, but the story is mighty fishy. I've never met a jewler that uses scales and baggies. I've met a couple dealers who did though.

And everyone should know that pointing a gun at the police, broken or not, is in fact assault.. and will get you shot.
Azrial
QUOTE
He apparently also agreed to do some repair work on a friend’s car that later turned out to be stolen.

Yeah, He's a real stand up guy! What kind of "repair" work? A quick paint job? The removal of some expensive parts. Or maybe some pesky VIN tabs?
hawk78
QUOTE (ClickClickD'oh @ May 8 2008, 11:35 PM) *
I'm sorry, but the story is mighty fishy. I've never met a jewler that uses scales and baggies. I've met a couple dealers who did though.

And everyone should know that pointing a gun at the police, broken or not, is in fact assault.. and will get you shot.



That is bullshit. Are scales and baggies contraband now? Maybe you should update me on that. Do my reloading scales and sandwich baggies make me a drug dealer?
jhereg
QUOTE (ClickClickD'oh @ May 8 2008, 11:35 PM) *
I'm sorry, but the story is mighty fishy. I've never met a jewler that uses scales and baggies. I've met a couple dealers who did though.



I've done a lot of silversmithing, and when I was doing it I had *lots* of small plastic bags to hold small parts and stones. I didn't have scales, but we did have them in my classes. They were used for weighing out silver when students bought them from the instructor, so both items are possible in my experience.

taurussvt
I agree about having the bags and scale for jewelry work. That doesn't mean that his sister isn't just trying to cover his ass, but it is possible. I'd like to know what if anything was found in his house. If he was making meth he might not have had any, but surely he'd have the chemicals around to do it. Also, making meth is a big frickin mess and there had to have been residual chemicals around. Assuming the warrant was right the first time around and he was making crack, did they find and blow? How about test tubes, pots, sifters, ammonia, etc? I'd like to know what if anything drug related they found. I've never made/sold drugs and have never had any small baggies in my house. I did however work in an automotive machine shop for quite a while and when I left I took my triple beam scale(drug scale) with me. I used the thing all the time when doing engine balancing. The thing was great for smaller parts like pistons and valve train parts.
hogdog
I'm not saying that the story is false, but we should all know that you can't believe everything you read. Having only one, obviously biased, side of the story does not provide all the details needed to make an informed judgment. Moreover, some of the details given really strain credulity.
Will
[quote name='hawk78' date='May 8 2008, 10:45 PM' post='230122']
Tracy Ingle: Another Drug War Outrage

• On January 7, 2008 a paramilitary police unit in North Little Rock, Arkansas conducted a drug raid on Tracy Ingle’s home.

[quote]

Why can't they just say SWAT team?












ClickClickD'oh
QUOTE (hawk78 @ May 9 2008, 07:33 AM) *
That is bullshit. Are scales and baggies contraband now?
Contraband? Well not in and of themselves no. But in conjunction with a drug related search warrant they do end up being narcotics paraphenillia unless you can come up with a spiffy reason to have them. Such as, I have scales for reloading. They happen to be with my powder and primer stores. It's pretty obvious what they are for. If this guy had jewlery making stuff hanging around it would hake his story more plausible.

QUOTE (jhereg)
I've done a lot of silversmithing, and when I was doing it I had *lots* of small plastic bags to hold small parts and stones. I didn't have scales, but we did have them in my classes. They were used for weighing out silver when students bought them from the instructor, so both items are possible in my experience.
Learn something new everyday.
acer_saiga308
Okay, I don't consider myself a vigilante or anything, but how far are we gonna let this go? At some point we have to just call it too far, and get medieval on their asses, whether they're "just doing their job" or not. It's just like in England, no one of the small steps that led up to the outright gun ban seemed "revolt-worthy", but when you add them all up, it's a big jump into police state territory. I've seen way too many stories of people's rights being stomped on to see them as isolated cases. This isn't a call for everyone to grab their guns and hit the streets, but consider how many "little" issues you're willing to concede. Even if (God forbid) Hillary or Obama get elected, they're not just gonna introduce a bill that just outright bans firearms, at least at first. They're gonna pave the way with smaller, more innocent-looking ones. How long are we gonna let them set up their game plan?

I sure hope this doesn't get me a visit from the alphabet paramilitary gang. unsure.gif
Acer
Twinsen
~The baggies and scale are definately jewelers items, my basement is full of them. I guess that means I'm a drug dealer because my parents used to cut gems 30 years ago.

~Was this in America? Come the fuck on, now. They had no proof he did anything wrong, they had no reason to bust into his house, their getting a gun pointed at them is their own fault for illegally breaking and entering (so says the laws they broke), their shooting him is attempted murder (jail, fucking JAIL), and not allowing him medical care is definately a crime in this country. It seems to me that like 10 people in "crime prevention" here need to be sent to jail for 5-20 years based on their offenses. How many of them are getting away with serious felonies that would end the lives of any of us? None of the things they did could even be considerd misdemeanors, they're fucking hardcore life sentence felonies.

~They also raised false charges, false arrest, false imprisonment, illegal search, wow. This just goes to prove that once cops do something illegal, they are willing to drop a shitstorm on the scapegoat to cover their asses. Break into an innoccent mans house, then shoot him. Oh quick, we might get in trouble for this. Raise false charges and arrest him so that he looks like a criminal and can't get a foothold in our criminal justice system. Don't give him the opportunity to raise a case against the cops, take everything he owns so he can't hire a lawyer. Raise more false charges, do whatever you can to cover your ass, and everybody else in the system such as DA's and even prison workers will side with the cops and nothing will ever come of it.

I think it's funny that we'll have 19 rodney king pieces of shit getting beat up by cops on the news, but coverups like this get no airtime because the victim wasn't lucky enough to get something on tape, and is hobbling around on a rotting leg without a dollar to his name, unable to defend himself from the crooked shitstorm our government is fucking him with.

Fuck.
waltham_41
I do not do illegal drugs, nor do I make or sell them. But I do have a small electronic scale and many small plastic bags.

I buy, sell and collect ancient coins, and they are shipped in the small plastic bags for protection, and most ancient coins are weighed as this is part of the identification and also a way to tell actual ancient coins from ancient and modern counterfeits.

Dont know if the guy is innocent or guilty, but there are legitimate reasons to have a scale and baggies.
Will
Again people want to pile on the the SWAT guys for this whole thing.

All SWAT does is make these entries in support of the various units that request them.

There was a briefing before the operation where all the gathered intel was gone over and the entry planned.

If it were me and it was the wrong guy/wrong house, I'd be in the face of whoever gathered the intel.

And if it is proven that they knew, should have known, ignored info, or fabricated it then I'd be stomping their asses into next year!



But then, it is SO easy to sit on the sidelines and monday-morning-quarterback these situations and events.







ClickClickD'oh
QUOTE (Twinsen)
They had no proof he did anything wrong, they had no reason to bust into his house..

Again, we are only being told one half of the story by a very slanted source.
QUOTE (Twinsen)
and not allowing him medical care is definately a crime in this country.
See above.
QUOTE (Twinsen)
They also raised false charges, false arrest, false imprisonment, illegal search, wow
As for the assault charge, he most certainly did do that, by the admission of the article.

As for the drug charges, we will have to see how the case plays out on that won't we. If you think the prosecution is going to release evidence for public review before the trial, you are sadly mistaken about how our justice system works.
Jeaux E
The Arkansas Times is by far and away the most liberal bleeding-ass rag of a newspaper imaginable............
..........verrrrry little circulation outside of the City of North Little Rock. So liberal that the very sight of it in a paperbox pisses me off.................


The NLRPD has never had the most sterling reputation, but anything you see in the Arkansas Times is suspect on the face of it..........
taurussvt
Are you trying to tell me that grabbing a gun after hearing someone break in to your house and drawing it on them is assault just because the intruder is a police officer? If that's the case, I hope I never wind up in that situation. If I hear a window breaking, door being knocked down, etc in my house and it woke me out of bed, you can bet your ass I'm gonna have a pistol drawn at the first person I see. I honestly believe that the majority of the people here would do the same exact thing.
1911
With the internet and youtube it has become in vogue to jump on officers across the land. Some deserve it IMO; like shooting an unarmed guy 50 times before his wedding in NYC. Also IMO most don't deserve it.
1911
Will
Grabbing a gun when they are all yelling "Police officer!" And "Search Warrant!"?







Jeaux E
QUOTE (taurussvt @ May 9 2008, 03:21 PM) *
Are you trying to tell me that grabbing a gun after hearing someone break in to your house and drawing it on them is assault just because the intruder is a police officer? If that's the case, I hope I never wind up in that situation.


First of all, there wouldn't be any "drawing" of the weapon.........think "curtain of lead". Anyone breaking in my door is paid for in my world. I would only hope it would never be a mistaken "paramilitary raid" by police, because the outcome would still be the same......... I have no illusions of surviving such an encounter, but ultimately there would have to be a review of decisions made as to staging such a raid...........
Will
QUOTE (Jeaux E @ May 9 2008, 03:38 PM) *
I have no illusions of surviving such an encounter, but ultimately there would have to be a review of decisions made as to staging such a raid...........



Well you get what you ask for.....

You and I see eye to eye on a lot but not this!

Although you do make the best point of all at the end of your post.
And this is the one the media and the rest of the anti-cop mentalities out there never seem to get to:
A review of the decisions leading up to such a raid!


chevymann
QUOTE (taurussvt @ May 9 2008, 04:21 PM) *
Are you trying to tell me that grabbing a gun after hearing someone break in to your house and drawing it on them is assault just because the intruder is a police officer? If that's the case, I hope I never wind up in that situation. If I hear a window breaking, door being knocked down, etc in my house and it woke me out of bed, you can bet your ass I'm gonna have a pistol drawn at the first person I see. I honestly believe that the majority of the people here would do the same exact thing.


I agree... Who knows, it may be the "Mall Ninja" that advertises his over-loaded AR on gunbroker with his SWAT mask and gloves on with a couple of buddies...
We already hear of people being assaulted by getting pulled over by fake Cops. What's to stop them from acquiring deceptive clothing. Many gang members also have been in the military and have enough training to bluff it pretty well I'm sure.

I am a honest, law-biding citizen. If ever I hear my dogs bark and it is followed by any type of breaking sound, you can sure bet that I am armed and will respond to uninvited guests.

Just my opinion, but unless the police know 100% that the occupant has possession of a large amount of drugs and/or illeagal weapons, whats the harm in a knock on the door? Then take aggressive action. If they are worried that the drugs may be flushed, then he's small time and didn't have enough drugs to warrant a "no knock" warrant.
Jeaux E
I get what I ask for??? What does that mean??
Someone crashes through my door...........am I supposed to politely inquire as to intention?? Ask for ID ??

What is my recourse in the event of a mistaken address or identity in such a case ????
Myself and my house shot up in a case of mistaken target ???
Hesitation in the event of a real home invasion by criminals??
Come through my door at your own risk, in any case.......................

How is it that we are in disagreement on this issue, Will ??
I am by no stretch of the imagination anti-cop !!

It would seem to me that before initiation of such a no-knock warrant that there should be a verification of the target address by the enforcement agency.........would you not agree ???
Are you proposing that in the instance of a botched address the resident should not protect himself as he would in any other instance of invasion of his home ???

How do we disagree???

jhereg
QUOTE (Will @ May 9 2008, 03:36 PM) *
Grabbing a gun when they are all yelling "Police officer!" And "Search Warrant!"?


Anyone can yell Police or Search Warrant. I don't hang out w/ anyone who has a reason for a no knock warrant on their home. I don't ever expect one on my home. If the police ever wanted me they could get me by knocking on the door & identifying themself. If I'm asleep & someone kicks my door in, I'm going work on the principle that it's a criminal and respond accordingly. If it's the police I shouldn't have time to respond. If I have time to get one ready then it's either the most inept SWAT team in the world, or some stupid TANGOs impersonating the police.
Will
QUOTE (chevymann @ May 9 2008, 03:55 PM) *
Just my opinion, but unless the police know 100% that the occupant has possession of a large amount of drugs and/or illeagal weapons, whats the harm in a knock on the door? Then take aggressive action. If they are worried that the drugs may be flushed, then he's small time and didn't have enough drugs to warrant a "no knock" warrant.



This is how the vast majority of these are handled.

But these don't make for good tv ratings!





Jeaux E
bump


.............waitin' on it, Will..................
AllJacks
Not knocking the swat team (pun intended) tactics, but guys if this had been your home it would probably not be scales, baggies and a non-working hand gun. It would read drug raid nets huge arsenal of assult weapons and ammo enough to arm a small army!! And Nancy Grace would want to know why you were able to do buy all these assult weapons in the first place and demand to know why you were let out on bail.
From my sideline QBing, what I've seen even while being filmed even without a no knock warrant its not knock-knock police we have a warrant, knock knock. Its knock knock crash bam, then its "police" and maybe "we have a warrant".

Just my 2cents
WS6_Keith
Where's the ACLU on this one?
acer_saiga308
QUOTE (WS6_Keith @ May 9 2008, 05:57 PM) *
Where's the ACLU on this one?

He's a white male, that's why.
AllJacks
QUOTE (acer_saiga308 @ May 9 2008, 07:39 PM) *
QUOTE (WS6_Keith @ May 9 2008, 05:57 PM) *
Where's the ACLU on this one?

He's a white male, that's why.



YA THINK?
Will
QUOTE (Jeaux E @ May 9 2008, 04:05 PM) *
bump


.............waitin' on it, Will..................




Sorry, I was at the movies....
Don't waste your money on Speed Racer!



You said "I have no illusions of surviving such an encounter, "; and with that attitude, you will certainly get what you wish.
Yes, anyone could yell police and search warrant, but I've never heard of it.

Do cops make mistakes?
Plenty and sometimes people get hurt or die.
When that happens, someone's ass needs to but hung up!
Often excuses are made and cover ups do happen sometimes.

But let's take the assumption that it the wrong house.
Your house.

Someone with either too little street time or too much desk time has ID'd you as the suspect.
They do their feeble attempt at research and find you are a gun collector, AND you are on some internet forums saying that if they come into your house ".........think "curtain of lead".".
Now they will tell the entry team that you are "armed and dangerous" and the dominos begin to fall on what will turn into a tragedy.

All because some REMF or what ever you choose to call them made a misidentification, and was too lazy or ignorant to double check his facts.

Or, when the door crashes in and they are yelling search warrant and what have you, you don't think curtain of lead.
You wake up and hear them yelling police and search warrant, as I am sure half your neighborhood!
The same mistakes leading up to the entry on the wrong house and person will occur, but no one dies.
And you will sue the crap out of the local government!

Look, all I am saying is this, people need to knock off the talk about shooting back if the cops kick their door.
They will identify themselves.
If not, then it is ON THEM and they are responsible for everything that follows!

And people need to quit blaming the SWAT/Alphabet/Paramilitary team for what happens.

There are people to blame, but sometimes they may be on both sides of the situation!
Jeaux E
............then we are not in disagreement, Will.

Announce in advance of entry, and I'll happily open my door to police officers..........wrong address or not.
I am not espousing shooting at police officers, in any way.............. I am decidedly pro-cop."Look, all I am saying is this, people need to knock off the talk about shooting back if the cops kick their door.
They will identify themselves.
If not, then it is ON THEM and they are responsible for everything that follows!"


.............it's the "if not" that is my concern. It does me no good whatsoever to be in the right if I'm dead.
Coming through a door without advance ID is a surefire way to get blown up.
ClickClickD'oh
QUOTE (AllJacks)
From my sideline QBing, what I've seen even while being filmed even without a no knock warrant its not knock-knock police we have a warrant, knock knock. Its knock knock crash bam, then its "police" and maybe "we have a warrant".
Well then, we've got some different experiences with the matter then.

Right off the bat, if there is a "crash" that means a dynamic entry.. which means it was a no knock affair to start with.

I'll tell you though, all the dynamic entry raids I ever worked on they tended to sound a lot more like this: POO LEASE!! *CRUMP* POO LEASE!!GEDOWN!!*stompstompstompstomp*POOLEASE!! GEDOWN!!POOLEASE!!GEDOWN!!*stompstompstompstomp*POOGEDOWN!!LEASE!!POOLEASE!!GEDOWN!!GEDOWN!!HANDS!!POOLEASE!!*stompstompstompstomp*DOHNMOVE!!POOLEASE!!POOLEASE!!DOHNMOVE!!POOLEASE!!

All the non-dynamic ones seemed to sound more like this:

*maglight knocking on the door* Police officers, anybody home? *random offending radio chatter that gets quickly silenced by adjusting radio volume* *maglight knocking on the door* Police officers *mumbling heard through door* Police officers ma'am, could you open the door please. *sound of twenty doors locks being opened or closed randomly before door opens* Good afternoon ma'am, does Mr. NAMELISTEDONWARRANT live at this address?
Will
QUOTE (Jeaux E @ May 9 2008, 11:09 PM) *
.............it's the "if not" that is my concern. It does me no good whatsoever to be in the right if I'm dead.



I realize that.
But SHOULD some such tragedy occur, I can assure you that there are people out there that won't ever let it rest until justice is served!


...Now I gotta go back to the action!

AllJacks
QUOTE (ClickClickD'oh @ May 9 2008, 11:11 PM) *
QUOTE (AllJacks)
From my sideline QBing, what I've seen even while being filmed even without a no knock warrant its not knock-knock police we have a warrant, knock knock. Its knock knock crash bam, then its "police" and maybe "we have a warrant".
Well then, we've got some different experiences with the matter then.

Right off the bat, if there is a "crash" that means a dynamic entry.. which means it was a no knock affair to start with.

I'll tell you though, all the dynamic entry raids I ever worked on they tended to sound a lot more like this: POO LEASE!! *CRUMP* POO LEASE!!GEDOWN!!*stompstompstompstomp*POOLEASE!! GEDOWN!!POOLEASE!!GEDOWN!!*stompstompstompstomp*POOGEDOWN!!LEASE!!POOLEASE!!GEDOWN!!GEDOWN!!HANDS!!POOLEASE!!*stompstompstompstomp*DOHNMOVE!!POOLEASE!!POOLEASE!!DOHNMOVE!!POOLEASE!!

All the non-dynamic ones seemed to sound more like this:

*maglight knocking on the door* Police officers, anybody home? *random offending radio chatter that gets quickly silenced by adjusting radio volume* *maglight knocking on the door* Police officers *mumbling heard through door* Police officers ma'am, could you open the door please. *sound of twenty doors locks being opened or closed randomly before door opens* Good afternoon ma'am, does Mr. NAMELISTEDONWARRANT live at this address?



I'll go with "POO LEASE!! *CRUMP*" Sounds like you have the real OJT.
Good luck and be safe.
Thermonuclear
QUOTE (Will @ May 9 2008, 10:38 PM) *
QUOTE (Jeaux E @ May 9 2008, 04:05 PM) *
bump


.............waitin' on it, Will..................




Sorry, I was at the movies....
Don't waste your money on Speed Racer!



You said "I have no illusions of surviving such an encounter, "; and with that attitude, you will certainly get what you wish.
Yes, anyone could yell police and search warrant, but I've never heard of it.

Do cops make mistakes?
Plenty and sometimes people get hurt or die.
When that happens, someone's ass needs to but hung up!
Often excuses are made and cover ups do happen sometimes.

But let's take the assumption that it the wrong house.
Your house.

Someone with either too little street time or too much desk time has ID'd you as the suspect.
They do their feeble attempt at research and find you are a gun collector, AND you are on some internet forums saying that if they come into your house ".........think "curtain of lead".".
Now they will tell the entry team that you are "armed and dangerous" and the dominos begin to fall on what will turn into a tragedy.

All because some REMF or what ever you choose to call them made a misidentification, and was too lazy or ignorant to double check his facts.

Or, when the door crashes in and they are yelling search warrant and what have you, you don't think curtain of lead.
You wake up and hear them yelling police and search warrant, as I am sure half your neighborhood!
The same mistakes leading up to the entry on the wrong house and person will occur, but no one dies.
And you will sue the crap out of the local government!

Look, all I am saying is this, people need to knock off the talk about shooting back if the cops kick their door.
They will identify themselves.
If not, then it is ON THEM and they are responsible for everything that follows!

And people need to quit blaming the SWAT/Alphabet/Paramilitary team for what happens.

There are people to blame, but sometimes they may be on both sides of the situation!


I have a postal scale. Little baggies are used in coin collecting too.
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