Gunfixr
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Posts posted by Gunfixr
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Nope, you don't have to have a stock. As long as your shotgun's barrel is at least 18" long and the overall length of the gun is 26" long, you're GTG.
Personally, though, I think shotguns without some sort of stock, a folder at least, are pretty useless.
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I'd just tweak it. It happens.
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I alwasy liked Federal hulls, but then again I was loading blackpowder. It would burn holes through AA hulls right away. Federal hulls were good for 3 or 4 loadings. The STS hulls were good for 5 loadings, but are highly prized and snatched up quick.
Then I went to brass shells, and never looked back, till I switched to 10ga.
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I've shot paper shells. Had some 9mm rimfire shotshells for an old Winchester 34 I got. Got some new Federal paper shells, they were still loading them about 2 yrs ago. Cowboy shooters use them.
I got a MEC JR., works great, I don't know how many people have owned it. Don't use it too much anymore since I haven't shot cowboy in a couple years now. It's in 10ga. I used to load 10 ga. blackpowder shells for an 1887 Winchester lever action shotgun I used for CAS. It was made in 1892.
I loaded 1 3/8 oz. of shot over 95-100 gr. of 2f powder. Them plates was goin' down !!!!!
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You need to do a function check. Since you say when you manually cycle the bolt, it cocks the hammer, it has something to do with the disconnector.
Take the dust cover off. While looking down into the mechanism at the hammer, cycle the bolt. The hammer should be cocked. Pull the trigger and hold it. The hammer should fall. While holding the trigger, cycle the bolt again. Watch to see what the hammer does. If it's held, release the trigger. The hammer should come out from under the disconnector and be caught by the trigger hook.
Both legs of the hammer spring should be on both sides of the rear end of the trigger.
Of course, no ammo or even a magazine should be in the gun.
It is always possible that the rear ledge of the hammer, and/or the disconnector hook may have a rough spot on them, and not allow the trigger to reset. If this is the case, you can't tell when firing because when you manually cycle the bolt, the hammer is depressed, and will come out from under the disconnector.
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As for trying to fire a weapon with an open bolt and empty chamber, every one I've used has a noticeably different feel to the recoil on the last shot when the bolt locks open. To me, that's the "your gun is empty" indicator.
As for round counting, I forget most of the time in 3-gun comp, I can only imagine trying to do it under fire.
I have a drum now, so I'm working on an easy way to load w/ bolt closed, as it's follower isn't likely to work with a LRBHO. My mag fence helped greatly with loading on a closed bolt, but won't work with a drum either. I have a couple guns with a forward mag catch, might play with that. It allows a reverse rock, inserting the rear end of the mag first, and rocking up the front end, pushing the top cartridge straight down instead of camming it the way normal rocking works. The sahpe of the bolt will probably not even matter with a reverse rock.
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I buy the triple frames and mod them myself. I also buy the rears. I get them from a couple places, but it comes out much cheaper than buying them already done, especially since I have to install them and get a little markup on them.
I weld them. I saw a guy at a 3-gun comp with a soldered or expoxied on one, and it came off right away. One of the first ones I welded came off when I dressed the weld a little too far.
I'm not sure if Tony runs into this or not, but often there is just enough distortion after welding that the gas plug won't quite thread in. I have to run a tap in and clean it up a little. Could be my welder, as it's a scratch arc. I'm fixing to get a pedal control machine, and will be able to use much less heat to get the same results.
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I can do one in about 3-4 months.
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Yeah, I got one. Wasn't going to start a thread about it, just sent a pm to one of the mods, Juggernaut, I think.
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For those who doubt, here's the pics.
In the "safe" position
In the "fire" position
Inside, the "safe" position
Inside, the "fire" position
Outside view showing the trigger guard
The modified trigger
The trigger w/ detent spring
Another view of the trigger w/ detent spring
And yes, it fits with everything else in there. It's tight, but it all fits.
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I'm not Bob, and he may well answer as well. The factory ports are angled, and ports drilled by all the rest of us are angled as well. The shotgun isn't exactly like a rifle, which has a hard-sided projectile. The shot column is encased in a plastic wad, which fits rather tightly in the bore, especially being pushed from the rear like it is. The hole entering the bore directly perpendicular, will cause a sliver of the plastic wad to be shaved off into the port hole as it goes by. Angling the holes down into the bore towards the muzzle reduces this greatly, to almost non-existent, depending on the port size.
When drilling new ports, or enlarging old ones, be sure to deburr the holes in the bore, as this will make a big difference in how much plastic goes into the gas block.
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I would add that when I did the 8" S12, I moved the gas block back approx. 3 1/4". This was because at that point I could totally remove the bolt carrier extension rod, bore out the threaded socket, and weld in a very short extension. It also allowed me to remove the fluted portion of the gas tube, and simply reinstall it. I used a basic factory 4 port pattern, drilled at a an angle very close to, or just a bit more than factory, the same sized as factory (.073). It worked fine with the low brass light game loads. The extension on the rear of the gas tube, where the cover goes in was added. Also, a shim was added inside the cover to keep the carrier in line, since, as mentioned, it does come clear of the gas tube.
At the time, I was thinking that the bolt carrier was cut, and a short extension added, meaning it would be cut through the clearance section, the thin part. I didn't want to do this, although I thought it was what Tony was doing. Today, reading this thread, seeing how the gas block entrance hole is bored out for the carrier, tells me that this isn't so, and the end of the carrier is what will contact the puck directly.
Based on this, I may do the next one at 4" shorter, instead of 3 1/4". Also, it's a real bear to get the bolt carrier set up in the lathe for the machining work. Without a fixture, it would be a real bear to set it up in a mill also.
I didn't much like the blast from the real short barrel, either. Plus, without a VFG, it would seem easy to get your hand in front of the muzzle during rapid fire. I think if it were for me, I would want a 12"-14" barrel. I seem to remember reading somewhere that the Coast Guard armorers had conducted testing on barrel length for their 870 pumps, as the tight confines of boats and ships made for tough boarding with a shotgun. They cut off an inch at a time and tested, and got the best velocity from a 14" barrel. Since shotguns use pistol speed powders, this is supported. So, if you want a shorty with good terminal performance, and absolute compactness isn't the issue, a 12"-14" barrel is about optimum.
Just my .02.
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PICS OR LIES GunFixr!
Lies my ass. Like I'd do that on an internet forum where I'm a business member.
I was at home yesterday, off, and at home today, off. I'll be in the shop tomorrow, where the gun is, and I'll get a couple pics. They should be up here tomorrow night. It's the same gun with the FAL charging handle on the left side.
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Oh, I figured it works, or it wouldn't have seen daylight.
I didn't know how many had been made, just seen that one pic in the thread in Tonys section.
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Hope she gets better, and everything turns out alright.
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I have done an 8" gun (S12), and I moved the gas block back 3 1/4". I would imagine Tony moves his back somewhere close to that.
The ports was a 4 hole pattern, pretty much like stock, of the older guns at least, and it would cycle low brass shells on setting 2.
The gun can be made to work that short. Tony has made at least one 6" gun, and I'm supposing it works, too, or he wouldn't have showed it off. I haven't tried one that short.
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I don't have any pics yet, it'll be a few days before I can get any.
For info, it's a sliding safety similar to that in a Garand or M1A. It sits in the middle of the split trigger guard in front of the trigger. Using your trigger finger, pushing forward takes it off safe, and then pulling back will fire the gun. Reaching outside the trigger guard with the trigger finger and pulling back will put the gun on safe.
Same operation with either hand. Totally ambidextrous.
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I came up with a third use for the double hook trigger.
Cut the second hook off, leave a nub, and use it for my new ambi safety.
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If Ernestmayhand doesn't find his, I suppose I could make you one.
Wouldn't be the first.
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I've been seeing a lot of that regret also.
Still haven't figured out if it'll be a good thing or bad thing.
It's great to sell guns and ammo like they're going out of style, but not because everybody's afraid.
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Based on the posted description, if it's the truth, they sound like the real deal. There are a lot of militias springing up lately, as the movement has seen a resurgence. People are fed up, quite simply.
Anyway, after the late 80s and 90s seeing a huge militia movement, the feds take them seriously, and infiltrate any groups they think might be a threat. There are plenty of whacko groups calling themselves militias these days, as there was before. You don't want any part of these, as just ends up being invited to a midnight door crashing party.
The Constitution provides that all able bodied males are a part of the unorganized militia, a semi-official group that answers mainly to the people. That is to mean that they provide for the defense of the people and the nation, and, in the instance of a tyrannical gov't, for the restructuring of that tyrannical gov't back to the one framed by the Constitution. The gov't can make use of the militias, but they are mainly seperated from the federal gov't, as the framers felt that large standing armies were a bad idea.
You need to be sure that this is what any potential militia you are thinking of joining is about. Not some group of anarchists, or supremacists. Just a group of people who are wanting to help their communities through any emergency, not just ones that would require weapons. All communications must be very cautious, and meetings also. It should be rather clear as to why this is.
Just my .02
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With the BHO in its all the way down position, scribe a line along the bottom of the receiver. Push the BHO up as far as it will go, and scribe another line along the bottom of the receiver.
Take out the BHO. You should see 2 lines, one about 1/8" or so up from the bottom, and the second another 1/8" or so above that. Grind, cut, file, etc. close to the first line, but not quite to it. Leave about 1/32". At the muzzle end side, cut at the second line down to the first line, leaving about 1/8" or a little more flat at the bottom. Round off this flat, and the corner at the top, and deburr the edges. What you'll end up with, once the BHO is reinstalled, is a tab that sicks out about 3/16", angling up and forward at roughly a 45 degree angle, ending at the receiver. This angle makes it clear your trigger finger, but the tab can easily be pushed up to lock the bolt carrier, but will go right to flush. It won't go in far enough to get stuck.
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You can do the dogleg thing, or you can just move it back about an inch, or a little less. I've done this when installing a Galil style handle on a standard AK rifle, so that there's clearance for the rear sight. The cutout in the dustcover has to be extended to clear the handle coming farther back, but that's all that's necessary.
Just another option.
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As previously mentioned, the industrial hard chrome used to line barrels is much tougher than regular bumper chrome. Well done, it has a very good bond to the base metal, and generally won't flake. However, nothing is impossible to screw up.
The best methods to cut any chrome lined barrel is to cut it long, and then finish it back, being careful not to put pressure towards the bore from the outside. This lessens the chance of "pushing off" the chrome at the muzzle, and starting it to flaking. Either cut from the inside out, like KingArmory mentioned, using a sharp carbide bit, or it can be finished straight towards the breech, like a muzzle crowning tool, but using an abrasive tool, such a grinding type bit, being careful to go slow, to not generate too much heat, and to let the tool do its job.
The problem with using a standard muzzle facing tool is that most are High Speed Steel, and the chrome lining is very close to being as hard as the tool is. If it's a cheaply made tool, the chrome will be harder than the tool, and you're essentially breaking the chrome out, not cutting it.
Muzzle velocity versus barrel length
in Saiga-12
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For that particular ammo? I don't know, but in general, shotgun powders are very much like pistol powders, and many are interchangeable. They burn rapidly, much more rapidly than rifle powders.
I read somewhere that the US Coast Guard wanted to shorten their 870s' barrels, as the 18" barrels were making sweeping the boats when boarding difficult, due to the tight quarters in boats. They were worried about losing performance by shortening the barrel. So a test was done. They took an 18" barreled 870 and fired it over a chronograph, and cut off 1 inch, fired it again, and so on. The highest velocity recorded was at approx. 14" of barrel. A little over and a little under were almost the same velocity, albeit slower than at 14", with the velocity dropping off as it got longer or shorter. Of course, this was with the particular load they used in an 870 pump shotgun.
The Saiga gas operated semiautomatic will probably be different. However, it's probably not going to be much different between a 19" or a 24" barrel, unless this load uses a much slower powder than usual. It probably achieves its highest velocity a bit earlier, as some gas is being bled off to operate the action, reducing the velocity slightly earlier.