Saiga on a budget

[Kim@d-dfarmranch.com 0]

Howdy from Texas (again)!

 

I really appreciate all of the great info on this site on scopes, mounts, stocks, conversions etc! You all helped me make my decisions. I hope this article will help another "Newbie" make some affordable additions to their fine Saiga rifle.

 

Since I decided to buy the Saiga .223 to save $$ (AK reliability notwithstanding), I decided not to do the trigger or magazine conversions. But I found an affordable way to create a great hog, coyote (or intruder) weapon without breaking the bank. The result is an outstanding rifle that will do lots of things for under $800:

 

Saiga .223 (approx $400) Robertson's Trading Post (GREAT PEOPLE!)

 

UTG Saiga Quick Detach Picatinny Rail Mount with side rail (approx $40) Gilberts Guns

 

Nikon Prostaff 2-7x Matte Riflescope (approx $150) Great optics on a budget. Sportsman's Guide. Returned a Barska illuminated compact tactical scope that was reflecting red light in the tube.

 

Sure Fire 15 and 20 round magazines ($35-$40 ea.) Gilberts Guns

 

Tapco Saiga T6 Collapsible Stock (approx $55) Cheaper than Dirt

 

SAIGA 223 7.62x39 GALIL STYLE HANDGUARD (approx $50) Carolina Shooters Supply

 

Cheap laser sight just for fun! ($20-$60) Academy, CTD, SportsmansGuide

 

Silent nylon sling (approx $10) Academy

 

Rear Buffer (made from old leather rifle sling (approx $0) Works great. May not last as long as synthetic, but I have about 4' of rifle sling left!

 

Auto door trim with 1/4" weatherstip attached to reduce brass dents and slinging (approx $0). Had some left from Jeep restoration.

 

All of the companies above are great to work with. Midway USA is also a great source. Sportsman's Guide has 100% satisfaction guarantee and will send you a pre-paid return shipping label. They are slower in shipping. CTD is FAST on shipping. Gilbert's has Surefire mags in stock. Carolina Shooters has lots of neat stuff in stock.

 

My gun was very "nose heavy" with the scope on it because of the sporter stock. I had to reach a bit for the scope sight picture. The Tapco T6 stock was an affordable fix and I have no problems with cheek weld with the UTG scope mount. I can store stuff like batteries and the Saiga tool kit in the pistol grip and it helped balance the gun due to the shorter length. I didn't move the trigger forward, but it has much better balance than before. I did polish the trigger/hammer contact patch to smooth the pull a bit. My trigger was actually pretty crisp from the factory. I didn't replace the rear sight, but opened it up slightly with a square file. The sight picture is now very slightly "V" shaped. I can pick up the front sight picture quicker than before. I'm going to use the scope mostly. I got the quick disconnect scope mount for use in case my batteries died on an illuminated scope. After reading much, and after applying the "KISS" principle, I opted for good quality optics with no batteries and returned the other one. Heck, if I get "tactical" and have to quick disconnect a 2x-7x scope, things will be within .45ACP vs hog range. If I haven't won by then, I'm retreating. If I have to pack into the hills, I'll carry the scope in a bag or something. The rifle is pretty heavy with all the stuff attached, but still about the same as a typical bolt action with scope. The Galil handguard hasn't arrived yet. I'm afraid it won't be as pretty around the gas tube, but it should be lighter and offer a more secure grip. I'm afraid I'll have to grind off the ugly pin that secured the factory foregrip. Where can you find a cool looking, affordable tactical shooter for under $800?

 

PS Academy has Monarch steel cased ammo in stock for $6.50 per $20. Shoots fine unless you are a bench shooter. Brass cased is $9.50. Shoots fine too. I don't own a finicky AR! the Saiga is built to shoot the steel cased! Sportsman's had some brass Ultramax 55 gr. JSP on sale at about $.35 per round. Good reviews and should be great vs hogs. I nabbed it because I can't find .223 dies or components anywhere. Not to mention primers~!~

 

I'll take pictures and do a range report ASAP.

 

Mad Rat, USAF (Ret.)

Republic of Texas

"Come and Take It!"

[Pun1sher 7]

Howdy from Texas (again)!

 

I really appreciate all of the great info on this site on scopes, mounts, stocks, conversions etc! You all helped me make my decisions. I hope this article will help another "Newbie" make some affordable additions to their fine Saiga rifle.

 

Since I decided to buy the Saiga .223 to save $$ (AK reliability notwithstanding), I decided not to do the trigger or magazine conversions. But I found an affordable way to create a great hog, coyote (or intruder) weapon without breaking the bank. The result is an outstanding rifle that will do lots of things for under $800:

 

Saiga .223 (approx $400) Robertson's Trading Post (GREAT PEOPLE!)

 

UTG Saiga Quick Detach Picatinny Rail Mount with side rail (approx $40) Gilberts Guns

 

Nikon Prostaff 2-7x Matte Riflescope (approx $150) Great optics on a budget. Sportsman's Guide. Returned a Barska illuminated compact tactical scope that was reflecting red light in the tube.

 

Sure Fire 15 and 20 round magazines ($35-$40 ea.) Gilberts Guns

 

Tapco Saiga T6 Collapsible Stock (approx $55) Cheaper than Dirt

 

SAIGA 223 7.62x39 GALIL STYLE HANDGUARD (approx $50) Carolina Shooters Supply

 

Cheap laser sight just for fun! ($20-$60) Academy, CTD, SportsmansGuide

 

Silent nylon sling (approx $10) Academy

 

Rear Buffer (made from old leather rifle sling (approx $0) Works great. May not last as long as synthetic, but I have about 4' of rifle sling left!

 

Auto door trim with 1/4" weatherstip attached to reduce brass dents and slinging (approx $0). Had some left from Jeep restoration.

 

All of the companies above are great to work with. Midway USA is also a great source. Sportsman's Guide has 100% satisfaction guarantee and will send you a pre-paid return shipping label. They are slower in shipping. CTD is FAST on shipping. Gilbert's has Surefire mags in stock. Carolina Shooters has lots of neat stuff in stock.

 

My gun was very "nose heavy" with the scope on it because of the sporter stock. I had to reach a bit for the scope sight picture. The Tapco T6 stock was an affordable fix and I have no problems with cheek weld with the UTG scope mount. I can store stuff like batteries and the Saiga tool kit in the pistol grip and it helped balance the gun due to the shorter length. I didn't move the trigger forward, but it has much better balance than before. I did polish the trigger/hammer contact patch to smooth the pull a bit. My trigger was actually pretty crisp from the factory. I didn't replace the rear sight, but opened it up slightly with a square file. The sight picture is now very slightly "V" shaped. I can pick up the front sight picture quicker than before. I'm going to use the scope mostly. I got the quick disconnect scope mount for use in case my batteries died on an illuminated scope. After reading much, and after applying the "KISS" principle, I opted for good quality optics with no batteries and returned the other one. Heck, if I get "tactical" and have to quick disconnect a 2x-7x scope, things will be within .45ACP vs hog range. If I haven't won by then, I'm retreating. If I have to pack into the hills, I'll carry the scope in a bag or something. The rifle is pretty heavy with all the stuff attached, but still about the same as a typical bolt action with scope. The Galil handguard hasn't arrived yet. I'm afraid it won't be as pretty around the gas tube, but it should be lighter and offer a more secure grip. I'm afraid I'll have to grind off the ugly pin that secured the factory foregrip. Where can you find a cool looking, affordable tactical shooter for under $800?

 

PS Academy has Monarch steel cased ammo in stock for $6.50 per $20. Shoots fine unless you are a bench shooter. Brass cased is $9.50. Shoots fine too. I don't own a finicky AR! the Saiga is built to shoot the steel cased! Sportsman's had some brass Ultramax 55 gr. JSP on sale at about $.35 per round. Good reviews and should be great vs hogs. I nabbed it because I can't find .223 dies or components anywhere. Not to mention primers~!~

 

I'll take pictures and do a range report ASAP.

 

Mad Rat, USAF (Ret.)

Republic of Texas

"Come and Take It!"

 

Good to see that you have discovered all these things as well. I'm getting a galil handguard, picatinny rail and scope combo dust cover, pistol grip + stock, and probably a red laser. Later on down the road ill do a conversion.

[justinmcmillion 77]

Auto door trim with 1/4" weatherstip attached to reduce brass dents and slinging (approx $0). Had some left from Jeep restoration.

 

HuH?

[Azrial 1,091]

...Since I decided to buy the Saiga .223 to save $$ (AK reliability notwithstanding), I decided not to do the trigger or magazine conversions. But I found an affordable way to create a great hog, coyote (or intruder) weapon without breaking the bank. The result is an outstanding rifle that will do lots of things for under $800:...

Good write-up, but let me get this straight.

So you believe that the $32 you saved by not buying a Tapco FCG was instrumental in your coming in under your $800 budget?

[lakedweller 10]

Here is how I built a budget Saiga 223...

 

Saiga 223 $499 looked for months for one and this is the only one I could find.

Tapco G2 trigger group $27.95 3-922r

Tapco Gas piston $12.99 1-922r

Tapco Folding stock $29.99 1-922r

Tapco Saw Pistol grip $7.00

DPH Phantom flash hider $44.95

Surefire 30 Rnd magazine $37.95 3-922r

AK side scope mount $16.00

Cheap red dot scope $22.00

Russian green sling $8.00

 

Gunsmith $50.00

 

Next AR mag adapter either $120 or $159

 

Have my 7.62 into the Gunsmith to get converted.

Only paid $429.00 for it with a Surefire 30 Rnd Magazine @ $37 to $40 brings it down to about $390. The conversion parts were more (not so many on sale).

Will add a Bullet guide (Ordered from Dinzag) So I can use AK mags.

Edited May 31, 2009 by Lakedweller

[vintagedude88 16]

Here is how I built a budget Saiga 223...

 

Saiga 223 $499 looked for months for one and this is the only one I could find.

Tapco G2 trigger group $27.95 3-922r

Tapco Gas piston $12.99 1-922r

Tapco Folding stock $29.99 1-922r

Tapco Saw Pistol grip $7.00

DPH Phantom flash hider $44.95

Surefire 30 Rnd magazine $37.95 3-922r

AK side scope mount $16.00

Cheap red dot scope $22.00

Russian green sling $8.00

 

Gunsmith $50.00

 

Next AR mag adapter either $120 or $159

 

Have my 7.62 into the Gunsmith to get converted.

Only paid $429.00 for it with a Surefire 30 Rnd Magazine @ $37 to $40 brings it down to about $390. The conversion parts were more (not so many on sale).

Will add a Bullet guide (Ordered from Dinzag) So I can use AK mags.

 

What "folding" stock is there that can be had for $29.99? The Tapco AK original style stock is $29.99 but no way you can get a folder for the same price.

 

Tapco Saw pistol grip for $7.00?? Where?

 

AK side scope mount $16.00??? Must be some of the Ebay cheap Chinese airsoft krap. You Will regret your purchase.

 

Cheap red dot scope $22.00 - This can be a hit or miss. While I've seen cheap airsoft krap out there for that price. I was also able to get a BSA(name brand) RGB dot for $20 on sale at my local sporting goods store.

 

Gunsmith $50 - What for?? Do the conversion yourself. Besides I doubt you can find a gunsmith that will do a conversion for just $50

 

Also DD's Ranch has the S223 for $399.

 

If I was going with the MSA adapter, which I will, I'd do it first and start getting PMags from the get go instead of wasting any money on any Saiga mags which will be useless to me once the conversion is done.

[Kim@d-dfarmranch.com 0]

Here's some pictures of the finished "Saiga on a budget"

 

The laser has since been moved from the side rail where it was too exposed to punishment. My little fun laser was for a .22, so I moved it close to the scope by mounting a Weaver .22 scope ring and then mounting the laser to that. Works good so far and rugged! Look out hogs at sunrise!!

 

One reader said, "Huh?" about the using the auto door trim to mitigate the dents in brass from the receiver. A photo below shows the trim used.

 

Ultramax ammo arrived yesterday. Wally World has Federal FMJ for $.40 per round in boxes of 100 rds. Going to the range this week!! Will provide report on dent mitigation and brass search radius!

 

PS I decided not to change out the trigger group at this time. I don't need to justify my decision. I can't use the Saiga factory 10 rd magazine without converting the base plate, or follower. However, I can return my rifle to 'vanilla' in 10 minutes. The handy 922r guide that IndyArms provided is a great tool! Highly recommended for newbies! Here's his link: 922® checklist for Saiga

 

 

Bottom Line: Have Fun!!

[Kim@d-dfarmranch.com 0]

 

Range Report: FUN!! 50 yd target with open sights and then 2-7 Nikon ProStaff scope. 55 grain FMJ and SP ammo. Open sights were off 6" to the right and 6" low. I had the supplied tool to lower the front sight, but I forgot my "hammer" to move the sight right as per the instruction manual! Guess I need to spring for the front sight tool next.

 

The Academy Brand "Monarch", steel cased ammo (Russia) did not shoot very tight groups, as expected. It also had the most "flyers". The Brass cased Monarch (Serbia) was about 20% tighter with less flyers. In all fairness, I was breaking in a new gun, so some of the flyers or looser groups could have been from the newness of the rifling.

 

The Ultramax SP ammo grouped even tighter, but 4" lower. I would suspect a lighter load of powder? For that reason, I wouldn't recommend the Ultramax if you are going to shoot mixed brands. I purchased 500 rds, so I just adjusted the scope because the Ultramax is brass cased, affordable, and of good quality.

 

For control purposes, I shot 20 rds of 5.56 surplus military ammo at the end. It was effortless to shoot 2" groups with this ammo. Next trip will be a bit more self-control on my part at the 100yd line!

 

Auto Trim results: I was pleasantly surprised that none of the brass casings had the "AK Kiss" in the middle! Some of the necks of the casings had slight dents. This may have been caused by the casings bouncing off the metal screen that the range has separating the shooter positions. It could also be the bolt carrier handle. None of the rounds I shot in the pasture before had dents on the neck, but all had the "kiss". Anyone else have dents in the neck?

 

The UTG (Leapers) quick-disconnect scope mount works great. It returns to zero well if you remove the scope for cleaning or to use open sights.

 

I had great fun with the Saiga! It worked flawlessly. My groups were consistent even with the barrel heating up. I think the Galil hand guard allowed better cooling over the longer, stock hand guard. Plus, it looks sexy. Everyone nearby stopped to take a look and ask questions. I think the guy next door with the $1,500 AR-15 was a bit jealous when he found out I only had $800 invested and a sexier gun to boot! His groups weren't any tighter, either. However, I think he was shooting Wolf or some other steel cased ammo.

 

The WWII M1 .30 carbine shot 2-3" groups with an ADCO Mirage red dot sight with almost no effort. Thinking of trying this scope on the Saiga too. ADCO Mirage

 

The .30 carbine is a great rifle out to 100 yds and affordable if you purchase one from the Civilian Marksmanship Program (CMP). Don't mess with the rear sight mount replacement for scopes. I highly recommend an aluminum hand guard replacement from Ultimak. You can return the rifle to stock in 5 minutes. Besides, it looks great!

 

Ultimak has great stuff for AKs and Saiga Shotguns too! Ultimak

 

Hope this info has helped other "newbies" to the Saiga .223.

 

God Bless,

Mad Rat