s2thalayer 13 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 ok so i have a pretty serious problem. im a shooter and i love long range competition. I just finished my saiga conversion a couple days ago and loved everything about it until zeroing in my aimpoint. i wanted to throw my rifle down and run it over with my truck. (not that it would have mattered...its an ak) First off the zeroing in didnt happen easily as i planned it would and as it did with my M4. second, when i mounted it to the bipod, after about 5 rounds the damn lower handguard busted off. Its a tapco intrafuse and i love me some tapco so im not blaming them. The retainer actually slid forward. i pushed it back, tightened it as tight as i could with a flathead screwdriver, but took the bipod off. Is this going to continue to be a problem? is there any way to fix it? i bought my retainer as a bolt on retainer from Carolina Shooters. help would be appreciated. If this doesnt get resolved ill never recommend a hanguard conversion to ANYONE EVER. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 s2thalayer. You need to 'carefully' notch your barrel on top (like a 'V' ) and the lower HG screw will then BITE into that notch and prevent slipping forward. There should be a mark on the barrel from the screw scratching at the point where you need to 'notch' it. Confirm where the screw is and mark the barrel.. using a flat file or dremel... carefully do a small notch. You may also want to try a non-modded screw thru the retainer to insure a TIGHT fit. CSS I thought had instructions on there site on how to install that lower HG. I also used a small 'dab' of Quik-Steel on my 'screw' where it rests on that 'notch'. Since its gray and good to 550' I feel safer.. Its also HIDDEN by the Gas Tube and its dark Gray... Ran 300 rounds thru mine and no problems. If its the Tapco HG with integrated HG retainer.. some drill a small hole in the bottom of the retainer metal part and dimple the bottom of the barrel and insert a small 'set-screw'. Accomplishes the same as above. Keeps the thing from moving/shifting forward. Hope that helps, Al Quote Link to post Share on other sites
David Mark 2,452 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 Dinzag makes a beautifully machined lower hand guard retainer. Yes it is expensive but you get what you pay for in the USA. I have had zero issues with both of my 7.62's and would recommend Dinzags retainer to anyone. Just my 2 cents. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jimdigriz 580 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 (edited) Dinzag makes a beautifully machined lower hand guard retainer. Yes it is expensive but you get what you pay for in the USA. I have had zero issues with both of my 7.62's and would recommend Dinzags retainer to anyone. Just my 2 cents. My Dinzag retainer slipped forward, causing the handguard to fall off. I ended up selling it; maybe someone else could make it work better than I could. Edited June 22, 2010 by Jim Digriz Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 Jim.. I think imrangemaster did the 'drill the bottom and dimple the bbl trick' on dinzag's as well. (as noted above) Thats where I heard it from I think last year. He has had alot with wood and poly handguards on his rifles. I got the basic mil-spec Bulgy lower handguard retainer and modded it like Klassy was doing last year.. CSS now carry's that type.. Al Quote Link to post Share on other sites
s2thalayer 13 Posted June 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 s2thalayer. You need to 'carefully' notch your barrel on top (like a 'V' ) and the lower HG screw will then BITE into that notch and prevent slipping forward. There should be a mark on the barrel from the screw scratching at the point where you need to 'notch' it. Confirm where the screw is and mark the barrel.. using a flat file or dremel... carefully do a small notch. You may also want to try a non-modded screw thru the retainer to insure a TIGHT fit. CSS I thought had instructions on there site on how to install that lower HG. I also used a small 'dab' of Quik-Steel on my 'screw' where it rests on that 'notch'. Since its gray and good to 550' I feel safer.. Its also HIDDEN by the Gas Tube and its dark Gray... Ran 300 rounds thru mine and no problems. If its the Tapco HG with integrated HG retainer.. some drill a small hole in the bottom of the retainer metal part and dimple the bottom of the barrel and insert a small 'set-screw'. Accomplishes the same as above. Keeps the thing from moving/shifting forward. Hope that helps, Al Really? i was under the impression mine didnt require that? i bought a CSS one that is identicle to Dinzag's. The screw has the notch cut out of it so it fit around the barrel perfectly. should i try loctite? im pretty sure i followed his instructions. thanks for the help though, if the loctite doesnt work ill do that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jimdigriz 580 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 I think imrangemaster did the 'drill the bottom and dimple the bbl trick' on dinzag's as well. (as noted above) Interesting. I bought a Tapco Galil handguard and retainer that he did that trick to. I drilled the dimple into the barrel, and have had no problems thus far. It would be good if it worked with the Dinzag retainer too, because then I could use a standard AK handguard. On the other hand, I'm considering trying Classy's retainer again, now that he has improved them somewhat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 If yours is like this You need to 'notch' the TOP of the bbl a HAIR where the screw goes 'across' the barrel. Military bbl's are notched for the little swing-lug that has been removed for the screw WE have.. Tighten and RED locktite it.. then wiggle the gun violently by holding just the handguard (unloaded). If it holds well that way. do the small dab of quik steel (over the screw threads showing)and be EXTRA sure.. You should not SEE the Quik Steel from the SIDEs at all.. Only if you remove the gas tube. Al 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 'The screw has the notch cut out of it so it fit around the barrel perfectly"... The problem is the barrel is ROUND so that notched screw just slides.. If you notch the barrel and turn the screw 1/2 way to lock into the notched barrel.. voila.. no slide. The Quik Steel holds the little f'er in 'rotated' place also.. Jim, Copes has the Bulgy lower HG (un modded) for $17.. 2 cuts and a 8-32 by 1" screw is all you need. Maybe a small extra relief cut so the thing EXPANDS to fit onto the barrel also.. :-) Al Quote Link to post Share on other sites
s2thalayer 13 Posted June 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 (edited) 'The screw has the notch cut out of it so it fit around the barrel perfectly"... The problem is the barrel is ROUND so that notched screw just slides.. If you notch the barrel and turn the screw 1/2 way to lock into the notched barrel.. voila.. no slide. The Quik Steel holds the little f'er in 'rotated' place also.. Jim, Copes has the Bulgy lower HG (un modded) for $17.. 2 cuts and a 8-32 by 1" screw is all you need. Maybe a small extra relief cut so the thing EXPANDS to fit onto the barrel also.. :-) Al +1 you definitely know your stuff. Edited June 22, 2010 by s2thalayer Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 Thanks s.. Heres a pic of the QuikSteel.. Just a thumb or so.. go over top the exposed threads only and a smidge on the barrel fore and aft. This will setup in 5 minutes and dry in 24 rock solid.. its not a moving part and good to 550 deg. This will keep the screw from 'rotating' out of the notch.. I'm not switching the wood off my Saiga 47 anytime... I got Poly furniture on the S-74.. best of both worlds. IMHO.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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