Nathanb 5 Posted August 24, 2012 Report Share Posted August 24, 2012 Hello everyone new user here and of course I need some help. I recently converted my Saiga 12 over to a pistol grip setup utililzing parts from CSS and Im now running into failure to eject issues. Prior to the conversion I shot 10 rounds through it to make sure that there was nothing that needed looking into before I converted it over and it cycled 10 rounds flawlessly. After the conversion using 2 3/4 00 buckshot 2, 5 or 2 different 10 round mags I could not get back to back rounds to cycle. When it did cycle the next round it would not fire. most of the time I get a wicked stove pipe. It appears to be put back together correctly. Its not exactly a ton of pieces but what I have noticed is that the hammer seems to drag on the bottom of the bolt. Almost to the point if i slowly pull the charging handle back it feels like it may actually stop the bolt. Also the gas setting does not matter if its on 1 or 2. it gives the same result. This is the kit i used http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-807/Saiga-12-Conversion-Kit/Detail as well as a chaos warthog brake. Thanks for the help! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vulcan16 971 Posted August 24, 2012 Report Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) The bolt carrier may be dragging on the retaining plate, hammer, or both. What retaining plate are you using? Tapco hammers are higher then factory and benefit greatly from a re-profile, as well as the bolt carrier. Edited August 24, 2012 by Jetmech Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2012 this is the retaining plate im using. From what I can see its the hammer thats causing the issues. http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-270/Saiga-Axis-Pin-Retaining/Detail Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vulcan16 971 Posted August 24, 2012 Report Share Posted August 24, 2012 Does the hammer move freely by hand without the bolt carrier installed? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2012 I have no issues with a full function check with the fire control group. Hammer drops can reset the hammer. has full range of motion. I do have issues reseating the bolt and piston after a field strip. It seems like it needs to be just perfect or else it will not ride on the rails. If I pull the charging handle back slowly it feels like it hangs up when the bolt head passes the hammer and then back again. Im not sure if I polish the hammer if it will make that much of a difference. I guess its a cheap part if i screw it up. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vulcan16 971 Posted August 25, 2012 Report Share Posted August 25, 2012 Post up some pics and get a shot of the retainer plate with the bolt carrier. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2012 here you go this is the retaining plate doesnt look like its getting any drag. there are no drag marks on the retaining plate. now there is where the carrier is making contact with the hammer. seems very low to me the action is far from smooth right now. I actually had a couple times where I would pull the charging handle all the way to the rear and it seemed like it was locked back. Which is impossible since there is no bolt hold in it anymore. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poolingmyignorance 2,191 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Round the angled edges off your hammer and try it again. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poolingmyignorance 2,191 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Round the angled edges off your hammer and try it again. It is a little curious that the nose of your carrier had been hitting something from the looks of it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 Round the angled edges off your hammer and try it again. It is a little curious that the nose of your carrier had been hitting something from the looks of it. Its hitting the hammer. I actually took a pic.of the bottom side od the carrier too Definitely alot of contact there. Im just not familiar with this platform yet. It seems like way too much to me though Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poolingmyignorance 2,191 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 It's supposed to. The carrier is what resets the hammer after each shot. That contact is normal, it just needs cleaned up a little cause the parts are much larger than a regular AK. Read the stickies on polishint the bolt. It will help clarify things. Good luck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 26, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 thanks kinda confirmed my thoughts but I dont want to take a grinder or anything to it befoe confiming. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vulcan16 971 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 (edited) If you have a high speed use a burnishing pad to remove the angles. Blue works best for polishing & removing angles. Edited August 26, 2012 by Jetmech 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lead Poison 2 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 The bolt carrier may be dragging on the retaining plate, hammer, or both. What retaining plate are you using? Tapco hammers are higher then factory and benefit greatly from a re-profile, as well as the bolt carrier. Is the reprofiling actually grinding the hammer or simply polishing for less friction? How do you know if you have removed too much? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poolingmyignorance 2,191 Posted August 26, 2012 Report Share Posted August 26, 2012 reprofiling means literally changing the profile of the hammer and sometimes (if you know what your doing) the bolt carrier too. I recommend just polishing the hammer, the carrier the bolt and the rails as well as the extractor face. Please read the sticky notes in the tech section add this how to had been covered COUNTLESS times already. This is the cheapest and most simple fix for slightly under gassed guns. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 27, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2012 I hit the hammer up today and vey minor underside of the bolt. I think thats going to fix my issue. I still need to do some fine touches on it but it makes a world of difference right now. im realizing there isnt much to fear when doing this stuff so ill hopefully be finishing it up and getting it back out shortly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 28, 2012 Just wanted to come back and say thank you to those that helped me with my issue. I finished polishing up my trigger and the bottom of the bolt carrier and that looks like It will fix my issue as all the resistance feels like its gone. Ill get it out on friday to chekc it out for sure. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) well I no longer get failures to eject however the disconnect does not catch the trigger so it will not reset unless done manually. When it rains it pours. Ill be ordering a tromix one now. im not sure if it ever reset before i attempted to polish it or not so we shall see when the new trigger arrives. Edited August 30, 2012 by Nathanb Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poolingmyignorance 2,191 Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 Sounds like (without seeing it) you took a little too much off the hammer face, and hopefully not the bolt carrier. Can you post some pics of your work? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) yeah Ill get them later. I didnt touch the part of the hammer that makes contact with the disconnector though. just where the ridges were on the hammer. unless i knicked it and didnt realize it. I dont think I ever checked to see if the disconnector would engage before taking it out though so what happens is this. pull and hold trigger. hammer drops. manually reset hammer with trigger held and it just barely grazes the disconnector and hammer wont reset. pics and a vid are uploading now. Edited August 30, 2012 by Nathanb Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 http://youtu.be/dswkEVdSyBA Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vulcan16 971 Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 Dumb question......is your safety all the way down? The trigger could also be catching on the front cutout. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 not a dumb question at all. I had to go look and yes it was. same issue with the safety all the way down. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vulcan16 971 Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 (edited) See if the trigger is hitting the receiver when you pull it though full travel. Manually move it fore & aft to see if you can find the binding. I've recently had a couple of Tapcos make contact with the receiver which limited trigger movement. You may want to to remove the FCG & reinstall it to see what the problem is. Edited August 30, 2012 by Jetmech 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 im going to pull the trigger out tomorrow and see whats up with it. i also ordered a tromix trigger today so if i botched it up i can just replace it. at least it cycles now Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vulcan16 971 Posted August 30, 2012 Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 Having a spare trigger lying around is always a good idea. I'm sure once the trigger is out, you will see the problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2012 lets hope so. i wanted to scream when i got it out today and couldnt fire consecutive rounds. im sure its sonething stupid im over looking Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poolingmyignorance 2,191 Posted August 31, 2012 Report Share Posted August 31, 2012 I think jetmech is on the right track. You need to pull that trigger out, and clean all that grinding dust outta your receiver. If that grit has worked its way inside your trigger axis sleeve, and axis pin it could be causing the drag your exepriencing. Pull all your FCG out and flush all the crap out with some oil, then see if your problem persist. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted September 6, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 6, 2012 well tore it down today. cleaned it out and swapped in the tromix. disconnect engages and full functionality has returned. I must have boned up the hammer when I polished it. gonna take it out and run it in a few hours and see what happens. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nathanb 5 Posted September 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2012 got it out today and it ran perfect. Even ate up some winchester bird shot I had with no issues. Thanks agian for the help those of you who gave me the advice! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.