Reloading silver bear 410 shells

[mossyshooter 7]

Hey guys. Back again with yet another project. I have a ton of spent silver bear slug shell casings. I noticed that They do not have the standard 209 primer and are crimped in somehow. So I drilled the old primer and primer pocket out and then countersunk it to fit a 209 primer. Worked perfectly. I also noticed that I was having trouble loading anything more than 11/16 oz in my standard 3 inch winchester HS hulls. Even the 3/4oz winchester factory loads only contain about .7oz to .72oz of shot. Since the steel case is so much thinner and doesn't require a space robbing crimp it has a lot more internal volume. I am starting with a relatively modest load of 12 grains of H110. Since a standard wad is a loose fit i the shell due to the thinner case, I used a .45 hole punch to make a cut out of that plastic cardboard like material to use as an over powder wad. Then came a WAA410HS wad. Followed by 3/4oz of copper plated #7.5 shot. I still had a lot of room in the shell so I gradually added buffer and shook the shell until all the buffer settled between all the pellets then a little more buffer to top off the shell. Then finally a thin cardboard wad as an overshot card and using the finishing crimp stage in my mec 600 which rolls the end of the shell over very slightly like the factory loading to finish it off. Going to make a few and get them pressure tested and start pattern testing if everything else checks out. I suspect however, that due to the larger internal volume that the peak pressure will be a bit lower then what the plastic hulls generally run. We shall see. If everything checks out, I probably will start work on a 410 turkey load using these hulls. Heres a pic of the finished hull with a win 209 primer installed.

[mossyshooter 7]

One thing to note. To reload these shells I am going to need a dedicated resizing tool as the one in a standard press just isn't cutting it. These cases expand quite a bit when fired and the steel case doesn't have the elastic memory of a plastic case, sometimes a the reloaded rounds don't want to chamber. On the plus side everything checked out with them and they exhibited no bad tendencies. I do have to work on a better gas seal though as a single cardboard over powder wad bellow a WAA410HS wad isn't getting a good gas seal and the wad showed visible signs of gas blow by. Also recoil was far lighter than the winchester 3/4oz load. I also think they need a better crimp than just an OS card and the lip of the case slightly rolled over. I don't think they are building pressure like they should. I didn't have an opportunity to check patterns cause I forgot my full choke and all I had was a cylinder bore so all brands shot very wide patterns. Once I find a way to get a good gas seal without sacrificing case capacity, and a better crimping method, I will commence pattern testing.

[psl sniper 963]

very cool. no see what you can do with the silver bear 12 ga shells.

[Cobra 76 two 2,677]

Staying tuned here...thanks for posting this. I have been saving Barnaul steel hulls for years hoping to find a way to reload them someday. (same as Silver Bears) Also have some of the Golden Bears I've saved. Until now the Berdan primers have been the main problem. I like your solution to that. Need to get a conversion kit for my MEC 700 Jr (I think that's what this old thing is...) Glad to hear that can also be used for the roll crimp.

[mossyshooter 7]

No prob. For those that don't have a precision set of drill bits, a 15/64 seems to work just fine. Use a small drill bit about the diameter of your primer indent maybe a little bigger. Once you get the center drilled out work your way up to the 15/64 size using 2 progressively larger bits. Once you start to drill with the 15/64 bit it will probably grab and twist loose whats left of the old primer out. You then can finish drilling out the pocket. Use a larger bit to countersink it for the 209 primer so it fits flush. When thats al done I like to roll up a small piece of very fine sandpaper and spin that with a hand drill to smooth out the new primer pocket a bit. The new 209 primer should fit just as easily as any other plastic hull shell. You are going to need a regular resizing tool as the press just doesn't cut it. I would imagine the mec super sizer tool would work just fine. You are going to have to build your own wad column as factory 410 wads are too loose in the shell due to the thinner walls and even with the addition of an OP wad, I can still see signs of gas blowby. I am still working out the kink with that one. I really would like to find a way to get a good gas seal without sacrificing the payload of the shell. Like i said before, this is the only hull I have found that will very comfortably hold a heavy 3/4 oz buffered load of shot.

[rd99fxdl 17]

I' watching the progress here too.

I have been saving the silver bears in 410 and 12 gg and have been wondering about a way to reload them as well.

 

What if you were to punch out a piece of plastic to use for the inner wad a bit oversized by a few thousandths,would it be able to get past the little left over crimp or would it just shear in there?

[mossyshooter 7]

It would probably just be squeezed down just like when your shot goes through the forcing cone and through a choke tube. I tried real dense cardboard, and I also tried a plastic type material similar in construction to cardboard using an old shell with the end flared slightly and the edge polished and sharpened for a hole punch. I still see signs of blow by as the recoil is very light and the recovered wads don't look like they sealed at all. I also think I need to find a stronger overshot card and find a way to roll the edge of the shell over more so I get a better pressure buildup. I think whats happening is that the primer is pushing the payload forward a bit before the pressure builds enough and the resulting low pressure isn't sealing the bore like it should. Look at what happens to a Remington Hypersonic Steel load. It uses a small powder charge in the wad to push the payload forward a bit before the main charge ignites. The resulting increased combustion area lowers the pressure. Thats how they can get 1 3/8oz of shot up to 1700 fps and remain with pressure specs of a 3 inch shell. Also I think that due to the thinner case walls, there is also an increased combustion area, resulting in even lower pressures. Even when loaded to the same specs as the winchester 3/4 oz loads, the resulting pressures were significantly less. I started with 12g of H110 and am going to very slowly start working my way up until maybe it works or I start seeing pressure signs as soon as I get a resizing tool. That very may well clear up the problem if I bump the pressure up enough to expand the base of the wad like it should. Or it just makes it worse and randomly sprays the shot everywhere like confetti. One way or another something will happen and then we can go from there to determine what to do.

[turbo1889 1]