Thumbhole compliant

[Fett 0]

Part 1

I'm new to this site, but I found it very informative. I have seen some conflicting info reguarding Thumbhole stocks though. I have seen that a Thumbhole stock is not considered a pistol grip, but I have also read on here that it is. Could someone more knowlegeable then me confirm one way or the other?

 

Part 2

As you may have guessed, I recently bought a Saiga 223M with the thumbhole stock. I love the way it feels and looks. Now, with 922r in mind, what is the best way to come into compliance without changing the look of the rifle? I have 2 Surefire 30 round mags that I really would like to put in. I realize that counts as 3 922r parts, but I have concern on weither I need one more US part or two. (See part 1) What would be best in either case?

 

Thanks!

[Nailbomb 10,221]

Part 1

I'm new to this site, but I found it very informative. I have seen some conflicting info reguarding Thumbhole stocks though. I have seen that a Thumbhole stock is not considered a pistol grip, but I have also read on here that it is. Could someone more knowlegeable then me confirm one way or the other?

 

Part 2

As you may have guessed, I recently bought a Saiga 223M with the thumbhole stock. I love the way it feels and looks. Now, with 922r in mind, what is the best way to come into compliance without changing the look of the rifle? I have 2 Surefire 30 round mags that I really would like to put in. I realize that counts as 3 922r parts, but I have concern on weither I need one more US part or two. (See part 1) What would be best in either case?

 

Thanks!

I've pretty much beaten this to death already. First we would need to know where your coming from mon this? IE: where do you reside? I know in NY which had a basic duplicate of the AWB a thumbhole stock is a grey area. See while the national AWB was going on certain thumbhole stocks were considered pistol grips, but this was done on a name by name basis. All rulings were done by either executive order(bill clinton-on import) or by the ATF. Now with the national gun ban sun setting theres no way to determine a thumbhole stock a pistol grip unless otherwise stated in your state laws.

 

The only other oddball spot is in the "spirit" of the law which might mean that the state law was made to reflect the national one, and all rulings thereof. So if you had a thumbhole stock very much like one of the ones banned, it could be interprited by a LEO as being a pistol grip, and the resulting court case would get absoloutly stupid for all parties involved, and it would wind up being up to the arbetrary ruling of a judge.

 

If I made a mistake here someone please correct me.

Edited December 12, 2008 by Nailbomb

[Nailbomb 10,221]

As far as 922r compliance that information is easily looked up using the search feature.

 

I wouldn't recomend using mags for your compliance parts anyway. Stimulate the economy and get some US made parts.

[Fett 0]

I currently live in Oregon. They are pretty good here. I believe what I'm seeing is that to be on the safe side, I just need to get two US 922r parts. The problem is that most of the parts I see are related to relocating the trigger for use of a PG. I don't want to do that. I want to keep it "Stock looking". I believe the Gas piston would be one part that wouldn't change the appearance, but what would be the best part for the other? I don't care about using the Clip for 3 of the parts as I don't use it all that much. (Just for fun)

 

Thanks for the response.

 

P.S. I did do a search on thumbholes, but I got conflicting info.

[WardenWolf 6]

First, if the rifle was imported that way, you do NOT need to change anything to be in compliance unless you intend to use high-capacity magazines. 922® only applies to rifles that would not be importable in their current configuration under section 925. Basically, since it was allowed to be imported that way, it's legal as long as you're using standard mags.

 

The ATF has, before, stated that the Saiga skeleton stock is not a pistol grip because the grip does not come down from the receiver, but from the stock itself behind the receiver. Basically it is unsupported vertically by the receiver. However, they also consider the Dragunov and Romak-3 stock to be a pistol grip. This is highly contradictory, even more so since the Saiga skeleton is simply a modified Dragunov stock.

 

The ATF has not ruled on the Saiga M thumbhole stock. It could either be considered 1 or 2 compliance parts. Most likely, though, it is considered 1 because it is not ambidextrous so is not a true pistol grip (unlike a skeleton thumbhole that is both). But to be safe, you should consider it 2. This means you should consider the rifle as having 15 foreign parts as imported.

 

You probably want to keep your existing furniture. So beyond that, you should consider replacing the magazine, gas piston, and one other part. Or you could just replace the trigger group and the magazine.

[Nailbomb 10,221]

P.S. I did do a search on thumbholes, but I got conflicting info.

I'm terribly sorry if this is what you thought i was refering to. I'm well aware of the frustration looking up thumbhole stocks can be. I was only refering to the use of the search function for the 922r compliance. That has been quite well covered with little conflict on this board.

[Fett 0]

Thank you guys for your assistance. I am thinking about replacing the trigger group as you suggested. My concern is can I get a "Stock replacement" group made in the USA? From what I've seen, most are for relocating the trigger forward to install a PG. If I can do a replacement that leaves the trigger in the same location, does anyone know where I can get the kit?

 

Thanks again!

[ML Roak 0]

Fett,

You can get a Tapco G2, cut the trigger protrusion off the bottom and file it flush (replicate your factory FCG), use the G2 hammer and sear and you are at 3 parts. A gas piston is a fairly easy swap as well.

[Fett 0]

Thanks to all for your help!

 

Do we have any Business members here who carry the Tapco unit and want a sale?

 

Fett