Failure to fire every other round with my 7.62

[Mateusz 4]

Ok, so I took everyone's advice, and did the restoration for my 7.62, added a stock/grip, moved the trigger group forward, etc. But when I took it to fire, I noticed a problem. I inserted a magazine, pulled back the bolt, fired, no problem. Then I pulled the trigger again, and nothing. I chalked it up to crappy ammo, pulled back the handle, ejected the round, pulled the trigger, and it fired. Again, it spit out the spent cartridge, chambered a new round, but failed to fire.

 

Here's where it gets stranger. I noticed that A ) It happened every other round. That is, it'd fire when I pulled back the handle and cycle, but the new round just wouldn't fire. Every singe time (almost. It did fire once or twice on the second round, but this was rare). And B ) The rounds that weren't being fired had dented primers. The dents were small, but noticeable.

 

So... any ideas from those who know far more than I do about Saigas? I'm guessing something wrong with the bolt, or the pin, since it is striking the primer, but without enough force. I took it apart, cleaned and oiled everything, and put it back together. I'll be shooting again next Saturday to see if that helped, but any other ideas what I could look for would help. Thanks all for any advice.

Edited February 21, 2010 by Mateusz

[Lone Star Arms 2,047]

Ok, so I took everyone's advice, and did the restoration for my 7.62, added a stock/grip, moved the trigger group forward, etc. But when I took it to fire, I noticed a problem. I inserted a magazine, pulled back the bolt, fired, no problem. Then I pulled the trigger again, and nothing. I chalked it up to crappy ammo, pulled back the handle, ejected the round, pulled the trigger, and it fired. Again, it spit out the spent cartridge, chambered a new round, but failed to fire.

 

Here's where it gets stranger. I noticed that A ) It happened every other round. That is, it'd fire when I pulled back the handle and cycle, but the new round just wouldn't fire. Every singe time (almost. It did fire once or twice on the second round, but this was rare). And B ) The rounds that weren't being fired had dented primers. The dents were small, but noticeable.

 

So... any ideas from those who know far more than I do about Saigas? I'm guessing something wrong with the bolt, or the pin, since it is striking the primer, but without enough force. I took it apart, cleaned and oiled everything, and put it back together. I'll be shooting again next Saturday to see if that helped, but any other ideas what I could look for would help. Thanks all for any advice.

 

Is the hammer in backwards?

[Mateusz 4]

Nope. I did recheck, since I made the mistake when putting it in the first time, but the hammer faces the right direction.

[bigcec1 72]

Did you change the hammer spring out with an after market one ?

[thehopping1 105]

Did it work before you converted it?

[Mateusz 4]

It did work before I converted, and I kept the original spring. I don't think there is an issue with the hammer, as it fires the first round, but I could be completely mistake. I was wondering if maybe putting the bolt in the wrong way, or messing up the carrier would cause the problem. I don't know if it's happened to anyone else, or if I just have an unnatural talent for screwing up mechanical equipment >_>

[Paulry 50]

Did you install a bullet guide?

 

Change out the Gas Piston?

 

Was this with the factory Mag?

 

Re-install the Bolt Hold Open Lever?

 

What did you use for a Pin Retainer?

[Mateusz 4]

I haven't yet installed a bullet guide, and I was using the factory mag (the bullet guide thing is my next project).

 

It was the factory gas piston (I don't know if the piston could have a problem, but it might).

 

I left the bolt hold open leaver for the future, and left it out for now.

 

And I used the Tapco retaining plate. I'm 90% sure I put it in correctly, and nothing seems loose, but I could be wrong, at least with the pin holding the hammer in place).

[thehopping1 105]

Did you use the Tromix FCG that is ground down for the BHO, or the standard one that is not ground for the BHO? If you used the Tromix and did not install the BHO there would be a gap and that might cause your problem.

[Mateusz 4]

Thanks everyone for all the help. It looks like this is one of those really annoying problems.

 

I got the Tapco Single Hook G2 Trigger Group , which should be the non-ground version.

[Paulry 50]

Do you notice any resistance to the trigger? (sticking)

 

The action on a new conversion can be stiff as it works over the hammer. (is yours?)

 

If you pull the top cover and remove the recoil spring assembly out of the rifle and work the action back and forth, is it smooth? (it should stick slightly over the new hammer)

 

Can you take photos of the FCG?

Edited February 23, 2010 by Fluid Power

[Mateusz 4]

Here are the pictures of the FCG

 

 

 

The trigger doesn't stick, and the bolt is a little sticky when it moves over the hammer.

 

Yesterday, I took it out to the dessert to shoot, and a few times, it ran through almost an entire 10 round magazine without a feed problem, while other times it didn't. And a few times (maybe once or twice), it actually shot two rounds with a single trigger. From what I could feel, it seemed as though every time I pulled the trigger, it seemed that it was almost always doing that (firing the first round, kicking out the spent cartridge, stripping a new one from the mag, chambering it, reseting the pin, and then striking it again, all in one pull of the trigger), just that usually, the second round wasn't struck hard enough to fire it except in a few rare instances. I could be way off (I'm just guessing this was happening), but maybe it's a disconnector problem?

[Spartacus 1,619]

The G2 kit doesn't come with the disconnector spring, did you use the old one?

 

Sounds like it could be a problem with the disconnector, try this test:

 

Make sure the gun is UNloaded!

Rack the bolt.

Pull the trigger and keep it pulled.

Still holding the trigger back, rack the bolt again.

 

Then release the trigger, you should hear a click as the disconnector lets go of the hammer.

Then without racking again, pull the trigger, the hammer should hit the firing pin as normal.

 

You should also be able to see this behavior in the action with the dust cover off.

[Mateusz 4]

Actually, I didn't use the old one... though I have now. It was not fun to get out of the old FCG, but easy to install.

 

I ran that drill, and it worked, like you said. I pulled the trigger, worked the bolt, released, and it made that click. Then, trigger pulled again worked as it should.

 

Many thanks for the suggestion. I think it should have fixed the issue. Not sure though, until I take it out to fire.

 

The G2 kit doesn't come with the disconnector spring, did you use the old one?

 

Sounds like it could be a problem with the disconnector, try this test:

 

Make sure the gun is UNloaded!

Rack the bolt.

Pull the trigger and keep it pulled.

Still holding the trigger back, rack the bolt again.

 

Then release the trigger, you should hear a click as the disconnector lets go of the hammer.

Then without racking again, pull the trigger, the hammer should hit the firing pin as normal.

 

You should also be able to see this behavior in the action with the dust cover off.

[Nobama 0]

So what happened....does it work now?