Saiga as a BoB, SHTF, GOoD rifle

[ahamrick6 0]

Hey all, this is my first post and I've been amazed by the wealth of knowledge this forum offers. Thanks!

 

I've a new Saiga .308/7.62x51 with original non-adjustable plastic furniture, 8-round mag, cleaning rod and kit. I have ordered 2 x 25-round mags with bolt-open feature and a tri-rail forearm, and they're on there way! I also ordered a very cheap scope mount. I'd like to get either a collapsible butt stock or shorter solid butt stock that allows cleaning kit storage. I have my tried-and-true bi-pod and sling ready to attach when the forearm comes in.

 

My question to you is this: If you had to leave home ASAP with only yourself, Bug-out Bag (SHTF bag), rifle, and whatever is on your body (web gear, pistol, mags, etc.): What types of mags would you pack for your rifle, and how many? What accessories (realistically) would you have attached and ready to go? Especially, what type of site/optic set up would you have? Where I live (West Virginia, U.S.A) there wouldn't be much use for shots taken beyond 200-250m.

 

Also, what kind of butt stock configuration do you all think would be best?

 

I know, a lot of questions. This is my first semi-auto/self-feeding rifle beyond a .22. Before now, my SHTF rifle was an old m1903 Springfield in .30-06 made in 1907 and re-barreled in 1918, but it's a tack-driver!

 

Thanks for all your comments and Ideas in advance, send my way! I've re-posted this is the .308 area, as well.

 

AdamH.

[BallzFast 4]

please be aware that as soon as you change the mag or the front handguard you are not 922r compliant.as far as the gear to put on your weapon,it is personal preferrane.some just go with a scope and bi-pod, others add the laser,flashlightand verticle grip. all this adds weight and can be a pain to carry.i went simple ,just the scope and bi-pod. the stock,pistol gripand forarm guard are all tapco. the scope mount is a utg quick release.i made my 308 compliant without doing the conversion at first. later i did the conversion.

 

here is a before pic some like the look and some do not. i personally did not like how the trigger felt.

 

i hope this answers some of your questions.

Edited March 15, 2011 by byron

[elvis christ 451]

The forearm won't affect 922r, the magazines will though.

 

Personally, I would want something with steel mags or surplus mags for a bug out rifle, more durable than the consumer grade stuff.

[volkov 318]

The .308 is a bit heavier then the others. Reality is if TSHTF or whatever I'd probably carry a lighter rifle, simular to the one in the foreground of the attached pic but in 7.62 without the PK-A.

 

 

BUT if we're gonna play the what if with the .308 and I'm gonna haul the heavy clusmy thing around I'd probably dress it up like my current loadout to at least take advantage of the thing.

 

For optics I'd go with a PoSP or PSO for sure. Love my POSP. Built for the gun, works great

I hate the "bolt hold open mags" that don't actually hold the bolt open when removed, have a couple but I prefer uinta's new mags.. 20 rounds, lightweight, and tough. csspecs(sp?) steel mags look cool as well but havn't tried them.

 

For the stock I'm running a mako (or israeli weapons website, same thing) recoil reducing stock. Seems solid. I'd recommend it.

 

For bipod I like the winchester wally world one- have it on two rifles and it's simple and durable.

 

I like this tri rail http://www.mississippiautoarms.com/surefire-saiga-12-trirail-forearm-generation-2-p-170.html

Durable and comfortable on the non railed area. I've trimmed my down to allow a standard AK gas tube and upper handguard (for cosmetics, no real practical gain)

 

Finaly if your talking SHTF I guess you'll be wanting to put a flashider on it, so I'd look into that.

 

And a sling that doesnt bug you, I have a simple one from walmart- works for me.

 

Anyway heres a pic of my setup- (the bigger one in the back obviously). Older pic.. mako stock isn't on it in that one.

Edited March 15, 2011 by volkov

[Mephis 82]

Well the 16" is pretty light. Loaded out with optics on the saiga 308, it feels pretty similar to my AR15 in weight.

 

The PSL might be a little heavy but that's one I don't think you could tear up if you drove your truck over the mags. I hope the Uinta mags are durable enough for SHTF confidence.

[BallzFast 4]

The .308 is a bit heavier then the others. Reality is if TSHTF or whatever I'd probably carry a lighter rifle, simular to the one in the foreground of the attached pic but in 7.62 without the PK-A.

 

 

BUT if we're gonna play the what if with the .308 and I'm gonna haul the heavy clusmy thing around I'd probably dress it up like my current loadout to at least take advantage of the thing.

 

For optics I'd go with a PoSP or PSO for sure. Love my POSP. Built for the gun, works great

I hate the "bolt hold open mags" that don't actually hold the bolt open when removed, have a couple but I prefer uinta's new mags.. 20 rounds, lightweight, and tough. csspecs(sp?) steel mags look cool as well but havn't tried them.

 

For the stock I'm running a mako (or israeli weapons website, same thing) recoil reducing stock. Seems solid. I'd recommend it.

 

For bipod I like the winchester wally world one- have it on two rifles and it's simple and durable.

 

I like this tri rail http://www.mississip...on-2-p-170.html

Durable and comfortable on the non railed area. I've trimmed my down to allow a standard AK gas tube and upper handguard (for cosmetics, no real practical gain)

 

Finaly if your talking SHTF I guess you'll be wanting to put a flashider on it, so I'd look into that.

 

And a sling that doesnt bug you, I have a simple one from walmart- works for me.

 

Anyway heres a pic of my setup- (the bigger one in the back obviously). Older pic.. mako stock isn't on it in that one.

 

 

nice.i bought the ak black front furniture and ak gas tube. now just waiting on css to make some lower guard pieces for the 308.

[volkov 318]

Well the 16" is pretty light. Loaded out with optics on the saiga 308, it feels pretty similar to my AR15 in weight.

 

The PSL might be a little heavy but that's one I don't think you could tear up if you drove your truck over the mags. I hope the Uinta mags are durable enough for SHTF confidence.

 

 

also the ammo is heavier so you'd likely carry less.

 

As far as uinta's I don't plan on driving a truck over them. My .308 isn't set up for the end of the world but I guess if whatever happened I think the Uinta mags would be fine. I don't think I'd be throwing them on concrete or anything.. Falling out of a tree onto dirt seems like the worst case scenario for them. Maybe falling in a creek. If I get the courage/money maybe I'll do a stress test anyway- they seem real solid.

 

I'm in agreement that the strongest mag possible is a good idea but it's not enough of a consideration that I'd use a different gun simply because Uinta's arn't metal. I prefer the .308 to the PSL, especially in a 100+ degree climate where the PSL's heat issues are a serious problem so I'd rather have a .308 with uinta mags. If saiga made a 54r that'd be the best of both worlds. Maybe the csspsecs mags remedy your concerns, I'm not lucky enough to own one.

 

As I've said before, if the world ended or something I wouldn't grab a PSL or a .308 anyway.

[volkov 318]

nice.i bought the ak black front furniture and ak gas tube. now just waiting on css to make some lower guard pieces for the 308.

 

 

If your talking about standard lower AK handguards just get one and modify it, not that difficult. People do it for the s12 all the time. The retainer would be a bit more dificult but doable. If you need either there are plenty of business members who are good at it, maybe start a WTB thread and see if someone will help you.

Edited March 15, 2011 by volkov

[Mephis 82]

Well the 16" is pretty light. Loaded out with optics on the saiga 308, it feels pretty similar to my AR15 in weight.

 

The PSL might be a little heavy but that's one I don't think you could tear up if you drove your truck over the mags. I hope the Uinta mags are durable enough for SHTF confidence.

 

 

also the ammo is heavier so you'd likely carry less.

 

As far as uinta's I don't plan on driving a truck over them. My .308 isn't set up for the end of the world but I guess if whatever happened I think the Uinta mags would be fine. I don't think I'd be throwing them on concrete or anything.. Falling out of a tree onto dirt seems like the worst case scenario for them. Maybe falling in a creek. If I get the courage/money maybe I'll do a stress test anyway- they seem real solid.

 

I'm in agreement that the strongest mag possible is a good idea but it's not enough of a consideration that I'd use a different gun simply because Uinta's arn't metal. I prefer the .308 to the PSL, especially in a 100+ degree climate where the PSL's heat issues are a serious problem so I'd rather have a .308 with uinta mags. If saiga made a 54r that'd be the best of both worlds. Maybe the csspsecs mags remedy your concerns, I'm not lucky enough to own one.

 

As I've said before, if the world ended or something I wouldn't grab a PSL or a .308 anyway.

 

 

All PSLs are different. Some have major issues with heat, mine doesn't.

 

I really doubt you're going to be doing any extended rapid fire with guns of these caliber anyway, unless you want to give your position away and get killed when you run out of ammo. When you can pop something 700-800 yards off with acceptable accuracy, there's not a whole lot of need for extended rapid fire.

Edited March 15, 2011 by Tombs

[headshot 52]

My 16-inch S308 is the lightest semi-auto .308 I have owned.

[Dandiesel 16]

so Just curious... In what kind of situation ( that you are likely to encounter) would It be acceptable for you to decide that at 200-300 meters, someone is a threat worthy of your bullets? when is it ok for you to be offensive beyond the range at which you are in immediate danger?

 

gun forum conversation we've all heard when I heard the phrase "bug out bag" it just reminded me of these videos on the forum

[jhansjr 8]

so Just curious... In what kind of situation ( that you are likely to encounter) would It be acceptable for you to decide that at 200-300 meters, someone is a threat worthy of your bullets? when is it ok for you to be offensive beyond the range at which you are in immediate danger?

 

gun forum conversation we've all heard when I heard the phrase "bug out bag" it just reminded me of these videos on the forum

 

My S-308 will work just fine up close as well as reach-out-and-touch-someone.

[ahamrick6 0]

so Just curious... In what kind of situation ( that you are likely to encounter) would It be acceptable for you to decide that at 200-300 meters, someone is a threat worthy of your bullets? when is it ok for you to be offensive beyond the range at which you are in immediate danger?

 

gun forum conversation we've all heard when I heard the phrase "bug out bag" it just reminded me of these videos on the forum

 

 

In a SHTF I would try to stay low and concealed in all I do and not chase after some trouble. Only if I found no way out (my back to a wall) or I had to cover someone (friend/family or personnel on my side) or something (like trying to get to a lightly guarded enemy vehicle) would I fire at that distance. I'm thinking that if the SHTF anytime soon and no new regs or laws that remove gun rights in WV, there will be a surplus of firearms around. I would assume that if there was an extended SHTF that there would be many guerrilla/ambush tactics in place where distance shooting (even if it was to iritate/drop morale of the enemy) could be of use and a .308 would be better suited for this task. I'm sure small, independent militia-like groups would likely be active in rural/sub-rural WV and use these menacing attacks after the foolhardy, frontal attack acting were seen cut-down.

Edited March 16, 2011 by ahamrick6

[ahamrick6 0]

It's impossible to fully predict the situations we would find ourselves in and the emotions that would govern some of our actions. Who knows, I may turn out to be of the fools or one of the survivors. I like the idea of having the more powerful .308 in my rifle, but the weight could turn out to hinder my effectiveness. Also, the caliber and bullet type (FMJ, JHP, frangible) would play a big part.

 

Another weight comment:If there was only a 25 grain weight difference say 140-165 gr. bullet weight in your ammo choice, that 25 weight gain would mean a difference of 1-lb per 280 rounds (if I did my math right)

 

Just some thoughts.

 

Thanks.

[volkov 318]

1lb in the projectile.. yes.. In the actual round it would be more.

[Mephis 82]

I just got my Uinta mags today, I think I'd be as concerned about tearing them up as I would be about tearing up magpuls.

 

Also, wow, 20 rounds worth of 308 is a lot of heft.

Edited March 16, 2011 by Tombs

[Nick White 5]

I'd bring my u308 magazine, cause it's light and it seems pretty durable.

 

I'd take off my scope because it just adds unessisary weight and attach a laser for quick shots. The iron sights work just fine.

 

I'd stick with my factory set up, i have the best control like that

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

If I were forced to carry only one? Against my ethics, it would be tough to make a choice between them, each has its job.

 

It really depends on the situation, not all SHTF are equal. If stealth and concealment were the issue it wouldn't be the Saigas, if firepower then you best have more than one rifle in more than one set of hands. Its like asking do you take the wife OR the kids OR the dogs it's just not gonna happen.

[timy 1,185]

If I were forced to carry only one? Against my ethics, it would be tough to make a choice between them, each has its job.

 

It really depends on the situation, not all SHTF are equal. If stealth and concealment were the issue it wouldn't be the Saigas, if firepower then you best have more than one rifle in more than one set of hands. Its like asking do you take the wife OR the kids OR the dogs it's just not gonna happen.

 

Pretty much feel the same. I have a 12 for in and near the house. The 223 would cover the block nicely and the 308 would be basically for long range/cover/vehicle usage. If I had to leave (on foot) I wouldn't even conside the 12 or 308. The ammo would just weigh too much. In fact I'd be torn between the 223 and my Ruger 10/22. With transportation, pretty much everything would be along for the ride.

[topmaul 42]

Living in the Pacific Northwest, if I have to evacuate it would most likely be by vehicle until I'd have to abandon it due to traffic bottlenecks. So at that point I'd be on foot. My bugout gun is a Beretta CX4 Storm Carbine with a Russian PK-01 Red Dot site on it in 9mm. It's the lightest rifle I have and I'd also most likely have my Beretta 92FS with me.

 

My bag has cash, credit cards, first aid kit, warm clothing, matches, a few full mags. No .308 or shotgun stuff