My Saiga has some serious issue's going........Need Gunsmith help

[piwo 3]

I completed my Pistol Grip conversion this week and it was relatively easy. The darn BHO spring and Shepherds Crook caused a few expletives: that Crook wouldn’t snap onto the rear pin and kept coming off. Once I did it once it was a snap. The pistol grip needed some filing to get it to snug up right but it was no big thing. A perplexing part then (and still now) was the safety installation. Now the BHO plate didn’t move, and the safety holes didn’t move, so why must I install it prior to setting the BHO into place. I dunno, but it won’t go in any other way. Once in it operates smoothly, doesn’t rub anywhere and functions flawlessly. I polished the bolt where it contacts the carrier recess). I tested out all the functions, everything sets, trigger pull good, loads from the magazine (manually fed) and all’s good.

 

Nope. What I wish I had done BEFORE doing the upgrade was a serious inspection of all the internal parts. After running the mag through with shells manually I noticed that the shells were being “cut” on the side in one spot, about ¾” from the top. So this started my visual inspection with the drug store reading glasses and I found several gotchya’s. Now mind you I’ve not fired it, so I can’t believe that just racking the slide a bunch of times would do what I see, but dunno. I’d have to believe that this was happening from when I first fired it but don’t know for certain. Here are some of the issues. Perhaps one of the gunsmiths that follow the forum can offer some insight, and tell me whether this is something that will need to be sent off to get fixed. Of course since I did the pistol grip conversion, I believe the Warranty is now voided (if I read correctly). Here's some pictures, and little explanations.

 

Left side of receiver, trouble spots circled

 

Left side with marking agent

 

View from the breach with Marking agent (notice the plastic shell slivers)

 

Bolt issues

 

Bolt with marking agent

 

So, the bolt face is striking the shell guide (for lack of appropriate term) on the left side of the receiver, the bolt head rail is striking the frame (pictures 1 and 2), and the shotgun shells are being cut by the lower extractor recess. Things are out of kilter!

 

If you've seen or encountered any of these issues let me know. If you're a gunsmith and you have suggestions as to remedy I'd love to hear it. Likely I'll need to send it out but am very interested if this is something someone's encountered before, and what is likely causing it.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Hit those sharp corners with some sand paper, some 120grit. Put a little drop of oil on your paper to make it more effeicent and last longer. The try again. your propblem should clear up. It may require some delicate file work, but read your guides on polishing the bolt and make sure you know what to take off where. I don't see this as being a serious issue. Perhaps include some pictures of the shells so we can see how significant the damage to the shells is.

[piwo 3]

This is a good representation. The shell on the left is where the marking agent "marked it" at the lower extractor recess. Some of the cuts are quite deep. I don't know if it was doing that before or not.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Mine did it too when it was new, about that bad. I took the file and emmory cloth to it and it solved the problem.

[piwo 3]

Hmmmmm, interesting. It is quite sharp to the touch. I don't know if it's the extractor's chipping away at the metal trying to get their "final" depth, or what. The edge of the bolt face chipping away at the shell "guide" is still disturbing. I'd love to see others that are similar, and still "ok"......

 

I'd liek to shoot it this weekend having made the conversion, but don't want to muck it up if I'd be doing harm........

 

thanks for your insights.....

[BlackNet 10]

This looks almost like mine, I well documented the problems and how to fix it.

[piwo 3]

This looks almost like mine, I well documented the problems and how to fix it.

 

I'd be interested in reading that........thanks!

[romad7 75]

Is the BHO modified with the notch to allow the safety to go in?

[piwo 3]

Is the BHO modified with the notch to allow the safety to go in?

 

I filed a bit, but obviously not enough. The dremel should fix that. Thanks for reminding me. so many little fires to put out that one slipped by.....

Edited May 19, 2012 by piwo

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

Keep this in mind, you already converted, so warranty is a moot point. And sanding those sharp edges isn't going to hurt anything, at all. So it'll either fix it, or you'll have to go further, but by all means research and make sure you know what to take off where. But dulling down some machined edges on an new gun isn't going to hurt anything..other than a little paint.

[BlackNet 10]

This looks almost like mine, I well documented the problems and how to fix it.

 

I'd be interested in reading that........thanks!

 

Here. http://forum.saiga-1...y-new-saiga-12/

 

 

Is the BHO modified with the notch to allow the safety to go in?

 

Yes

 

 

Keep this in mind, you already converted, so warranty is a moot point. And sanding those sharp edges isn't going to hurt anything, at all. So it'll either fix it, or you'll have to go further, but by all means research and make sure you know what to take off where. But dulling down some machined edges on an new gun isn't going to hurt anything..other than a little paint.

 

Warranty? Seriously? Considering they are not properly cleaned up when they leave the manufacture and they need extensive work to make them run reliably I would have to say if you are concerned about warranty's then you should be buying something like remington, bernelli, etc.

[piwo 3]

Keep this in mind, you already converted, so warranty is a moot point. And sanding those sharp edges isn't going to hurt anything, at all. So it'll either fix it, or you'll have to go further, but by all means research and make sure you know what to take off where. But dulling down some machined edges on an new gun isn't going to hurt anything..other than a little paint.

 

Ya, I referenced that in my first post: warranty is no more. I'm researching it, little here little there. Have file, will travel.

 

Not concerned about the warranty, and it's precisely why I went ahead and started the project. My error was not doing a detailed inspection of the parts before I started: if for no reason other to have the benchmark known.

Edited May 19, 2012 by piwo

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

And yea I understand about warranty thats why I said MOOT POINT as in seriously moot.

 

I took a moment to break down my S12 so I could highlight the areas that had given me trouble. I think They are the same as whats causing the issue with your, as my shells had similar damage before I cleaned her up.

 

 

This gun has about 2,000 rounds down range..and no signs of increased damage since I smoothed out those edges...I think you've got a run-in issue nothing more. But this is just ONE GUN.

Edited May 19, 2012 by poolingmyignorance

[piwo 3]

Great pics, thanks for all the help and insight. I'm going to look at some other potential pinch spots having looked at your pics.

 

An observation on my first picture. The rail that the carrier rides ends towards the chamber, and then the "extension" of that (for lack of knowing what it's called) has the first smashed edge. If you where they join, they are on different planes. I wonder if that's the way it's supposed to be, or if that's WHY it's smashed at the edge, and smashing the bolt head "fin" (picture 4). Interesting...

 

Thanks fella's!

[piwo 3]

Shot again today after my conversion and smoothing out some of the rough spots. This time I shot only low brass stuff and had no FTE's or failure to loads. However I did have mainspring issues where the trigger wouldn't rest without me clicking it forward. I bent that damn spring every which way but loose but couldn't get it to reliably function every time. It was darn hot without shade and I surrendered after an hour or so of messing with it. Going back out Monday for another go at it. Spent hulls were't marred up like the others so the tips paid off: much thanks!

 

BTW: I was @ 70% hitting clay birds! We have throwers at the club that can be managed by one person, and it was pretty fun.

[poolingmyignorance 2,191]

If your trigger isn't resetting after each pull, you might want to look at your BHO. Check and make sure it, moves smoothly. You might need to sanda little on your hammer to relieve the pressure and free up the action.

[G O B 3,516]

Make sure the trigger is not binding where the hook goes thru the receiver. This is a common source of 'sticky trigger'.

[piwo 3]

I'll check both of those before I head out. My trigger was sticking ever so lightly on the forward most part of the trigger cutout. I had filed the trigger unit at that spot with a file to relieve it but finally removed the entire FCG, took it to a fine grinding stone and slowly removed enough material so it didn't bind. Tapco FCG had a "bur" or raised machine mark that was binding as well. It's clear now. As for the Hammer, I did remove a bit of material before I even shot it. I'm going to look harder at the BHO, and that DAMN SPRING...Going out Monday morning before the sun is overly oppressive and see how it shakes out.

 

I was really, really amazed at the success I was having shooting clay birds. I've only done that once or twice in my life and with the short barreled shotgun I had no high expectations. I was nailing them! That could be great fun going forward.

 

I'll let ya know how the next session turns out. Almost there I think, just a little more tinkering, then a paint job!

[piwo 3]

Circumstances dictated that I would have to shoot today so I did so this afternoon. Saiga 12 ran flawlessly (using the factory spring). I never did get the JTE spring bent right where it would stay. I was shooting 1oz and 1 1/8 oz winchester birdshot. Also shot the snot out of a bunch of clay birds as well!

 

Next stop: a camo paint job for hunting! I am very please with how it's handling with the new FCG and pistol grip. .............