kmoore 3 Posted January 12, 2006 Report Share Posted January 12, 2006 Why would you need a mag well? Don't these hicaps all fit and lock into place with current mag wall and mag release? Gonepostal asked this in Kevin's thread. That got me thinking. My assumptions were that "magwell" and "pushbutton release" and "straight insert loading" were all the same thing. I realize that I don't know if there could be a magwell and STILL need to rock and lock the mag into place? I've answered his question with a "for faster loads and unloads. No more rock and lock. " Another response has it as a guide during loading. I'll go as far as saying that if it were only a guide, I doubt I'd want it. I know my way around the magwell, if I fumble I've likely not caught the front lip in the shotty all the way, tho that's a rare occurence. I'd guess I'd find the magwell in the way. Saiga reloads are still just too slow (IMO). Needing to align the mag, catch the front lip and "rock" the mag in (raise the rear while keeping front jammed into reciever) keeps a mag fed shotgun from reaching it's potential speed. I'm hoping a magwell means straight insert loading with single button release (the stock rear catch?) Looking at the Fin's work, and the factor magwell, I hope I'm not off base. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AegisDei 2 Posted January 12, 2006 Report Share Posted January 12, 2006 Originally when I set out to try and design a mag-well I was focusing on a mag-guide. Basically a big box that tapered down to align the magazine perfectly for a rock and lock load. It would hold the magazine in the proper lateral position and make it so all you had to do was snap it into place. As you say, it is the reload that slows down the speedy potential of the Saiga so if you could fix any alignment issues with a guide that ensured perfect magazine/receiver positioning, you'd be golden. But in working out the intricacies of this design, it would seem that it'd be a huge headache, really ugly, and not as effective as strait-feed, so I've abandoned the guide-goal in pursuit of a strait-feed. Obviously, a strait feed mag-well is going to be quicker, but it will be a bit more difficult to make and require modification to the magazines. I'm still wondering how the Finns did it and make it look so simple. When the front nub on the magazine is removed, the recoil of the gun causes the magazine to be rejected. I've come up with a few possible solutions for how they fixed this, but won't go into mentioning all my crazy projections here. If Jamshot/JuumiKula or one of the other Finns would care to share the secret, that'd be awesome as it'd save a lot of headache in us redesigning their wheel, but that might be a secret they'd like to keep to themselves and I can't blaim them. For now, I've decided to focus on planning a strait-feed design and am waiting for the domestic magazines to come out before investing in a prototype. Obviously, anything we come up with for the Russian 5/8rnd mags might not work perfectly for the new domestics, but as soon as we get the new magazines, the rest of the mods will follow close behind. If anyone has any ideas on how to keep the magazine in properly without a front nub, please let me know. For now I'm thinking the easiest, though not best, solution might be another locking tab like the current mag-release. However, this extra locking mechanism would be one more moving part that could mis-function, would cost more, and would take away from the overall ergonomic appeal. Any other ideas? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ForGreatJustice 1 Posted January 13, 2006 Report Share Posted January 13, 2006 What's the availability of the factory magwell? If I remember right ruseller (Andrei) had at least two up on Gunbroker a while back. If he can get a constant (even if small) supply of them, it'll probably meet the demand. If you bought one, you could certainly reverse engineer it. $200 for the prototype isn't bad...right? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AegisDei 2 Posted January 13, 2006 Report Share Posted January 13, 2006 $200 for a prototype is cheaper than anything I'd make...I have just been under the impression that the swat magazine and bolt carrier were somehow different than a normal Saiga. So even if we got our hands on one, it still might not workout. Might be worth investing $200 though to find out and if nothing else perhaps it'll provide insight about whatever design aspect I'm overlooking. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MikeD 541 Posted January 19, 2006 Report Share Posted January 19, 2006 Push button drop and straight feed would be great. Then all we would need is a last shot hold open. There is a company that makes an attachment for an ak and you replace the mag follower. Maybe they could design something for the saiga. Maybe all they would have to design would be a new follower!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TacticalResponse 0 Posted January 19, 2006 Report Share Posted January 19, 2006 Push button drop and straight feed would be great. Then all we would need is a last shot hold open. There is a company that makes an attachment for an ak and you replace the mag follower. Maybe they could design something for the saiga. Maybe all they would have to design would be a new follower!! I would guess that their just waiting for the new mags to come out, and then they will make a Last round bolt hold open. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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