SkiesofDeepestGrey 0 Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 Hey everyone, I just recently bought a Saiga 7.62x39 and love it so far, but have been frustrated by the lack, and high price of, factory magazines for the rifle. I'm considering doing the AK mag conversion. Since I live in NY unfortunately I can't legally do a full-on AK conversion nor use magazines over 10 rounds (I'm looking to get out of NY ASAP but that's another story). Not only that but alot of online retailers are simply not shipping magazines to NY, even if they're only 10 round tops so I'm stuck big time. So, due to the easy local availability of standard AK mags (5 and 10 round only unfortunately) I've decided I'm gonna do the AK mag conversion, only problem is, I don't know if 922r would come into play in doing that, if so, I'll order a gas piston plus the bullet guide and ONLY use US magazines until I leave NY, so for the time being I'll be in compliance (once out of NY I do plan to do it up). Will the simple AK mag mod cause a 922r issue if only using 10 round mags tops? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dashowdy 141 Posted March 5, 2014 Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 I would leave it as is and just not buy many of them and wait, it is hard to get 922r on an unconverted rifle, you would be using tapco mags and have to replace 1 more part as I believe they are 14 parts total. I could be wrong but as soon as it accepts standard magazines it is no longer considered a sporting rifle Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SkiesofDeepestGrey 0 Posted March 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2014 I would leave it as is and just not buy many of them and wait, it is hard to get 922r on an unconverted rifle, you would be using tapco mags and have to replace 1 more part as I believe they are 14 parts total. I could be wrong but as soon as it accepts standard magazines it is no longer considered a sporting rifle That's what I was curious about, if I do the mod and only use US made magazines (they consider them 3 parts already, picked up a Pro-mag one locally for reference) and change out the gas piston to a Tapco USA made one then I should be good if 922r applies in this case. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dashowdy 141 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 yes you would be set but I would change the handguard before the gas piston, tapcos intrafuse handguards are not bad. The piston is a real russian gas piston swapping it only serves to degrade the reliability of the rifle, just my .02 I just like to keep as much russian moving parts as possible for reliability sakes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Billybobf 50 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Handguard first, hammer second. Piston is more of a smith item IMO. Changing out the piston could damage your bolt carrier if done wrong. A hammer could cause fun things to happen if totally off but is easy enough to change back if needed. I honestly wish tapco would make "saiga" triggers both in linkage and .308 style. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LuPiN8oR 333 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Im pretty sure im right about this, but modifying the rifle to accept "regular" 10 round ak mags would not trigger 922r compliance. However, if you are in possession of an ak mag in excess of 10 rounds you have to meet compliance. Id put the bullet guide in, snag some tapco 10 rounders, and call it good till i left NY. If you're super paranoid, swap the stock and handguard and only use us made mags--thats 5 us parts. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
calsaiga7 0 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Someone please explain what I'm missing. If you convert to using standard AK mags, why does this effect 922r? 922r is a count of US parts right? The original Saiga mag is not US made, so why would you have to use a US made AK mag? I don't know about NY but here in CA, if you owned a 30rd AK mag before it was illegal, you could then use it in the saiga correct?? You would then own a non bullet button rifle that could legally use 30 round mags (in California). Right?? I've been planning on doing this because I have several old AK mags but I had to sell my AK back when money was needed. Now if I purchase an AK pattern rifle it will come with a bullet button. Bullet button equiped rifles in CA can not use any magazine larger then 10 rd capacity. So my plan was to purchase an un-modified saiga 7.62x39 which doesn't need a bullet button, then with the bullet guide installed I could legally use my old 30 rounders. Correct?? I may post this question elsewhere as well, Thank you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Billybobf 50 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Putting a high cap mag in an import weapon is federal law. You might want to contact an attorney about using a pre-ban mag in a semi auto weapon without a bullet button. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
calsaiga7 0 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 what do you mean about the "high cap mag in an import being federal law" ? It is still legal in most states to use a 30 round magazine in an AK. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Billybobf 50 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 I believe that is in a 922r compliant, or pre 922r AK of which a stock saiga is not! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Billybobf 50 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 What I have found is that attaching anything over 10rds to a semi auto increases its sodium content (sodium being "a salt") Cali law might be unclear on this, as a 30rd would make it require a bullet button to use the mag! Federal 922r law says you must have 10 or less foreign parts if "non-sporting" and 30rd mags are non sporting. By attaching a 30rd mag in Cali, you require a bullet button. The same, attaching that to an import gun violates 922r. Double whammy! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
calsaiga7 0 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Thanks for the help. after a frustratingly long search it sounds like I have the answer to most of my questions. It comes down to if installing the bullet guide changes anything. Near as I can find, 922r only has to do with foreign made parts count. So, if the bullet guide is foreign made and the rifle already has the limit number of foreign parts, then I guess that could be an issue. Magazine capacity has nothing to do with assualt rifle status. Only if it is detachable or fixed (bullet button). So as long as the magazine is legally owned (mine are - had them a long time before it was an issue) they can be used in a featureless rifle with no bullet button (like a saiga). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Billybobf 50 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Bullet guide is not parts if the counts! Search harder! Find a 922r parts list! And federal law adding high cap DOES make it a "non sporting" weapon. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Billybobf 50 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 https://home.comcast.net/~navy87guy/home/922r.html Has parts that are included! It's about removing foreign parts not adding USA parts! Explains what makes your weapon "not for sporting". Most around here try not to use the salty word! All my sporting weapons use USA high cap mags and hammers, my shotty has a USA puck as well. Feel like I am thread jacking bad as I'm not sure about the OP's topic Quote Link to post Share on other sites
calsaiga7 0 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Okay, I get what your saying (I think). I was referring to an AW as a flat out illegal weapon (which is what a bullet button equiped rifle with a 30 round mag is - and so on...) Non-sporting is another catagory. Yes, a rifle with a mag over 10 round capacity IS considered a NON-sporting rifle. Non-sporting means that then it has to comply with 922r. However like I said, magazine capacity does not have anything to do with being an illegal AW. I did find out that the bullet guides are US made, but like you said, that doesn't matter. So, I can use the legally owned 30 rounders in a non-sporterized (featureless) rifle, but it then has to be 922r compliant. What I didn't understand was that only NON-sporter rifles had to be 922r compliant. I thought all rifles had to be compliant. So I assumed that the Saiga at the local gun store was 922r compliant. In conclusion, It will be legal to use my old 30 rounders in a NON bullet button featureless Saiga, assuming it is 922r compliant. So I need to find out if I need to replace any parts and/or how many parts, so I can use the 30 rounders. Thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Billybobf 50 Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Something like that yes. As far as legally sticking that 30 round mag in a gun, it needs to be compliant. A us hand guard, and a modified FCG would work, but nobody makes a 922r "saiga" trigger pack, but shouldn't be too hard to cut the trigger off a tapco FCG and then make your own trigger. To be safe you could swap the piston out as well. Lots of work, I've though about hacking up a few FCG to make sporting sets, but its a slim market. Like Cali. And all semi auto shotties must have bullet button in Cali Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Think1st 2 Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) I have an unconverted IZ-132 that I bought when I lived in Kaliforniastan, and I wanted to keep my rifle completely unmodified in order to avoid running afoul of the law. In order to save money, I converted some Tapco 10-rounders because they were a lot cheaper than the SGM tactical ones that were specifically for Saigas. In the attached pictures, you will see where I built up the front of the magazines with JB Weld, so that they have the same profile as a regular OEM Saiga magazine. I then filed down the tab in back so that they would lock in. They work just as well as the original magazines. Just make sure to thoroughly rough up the areas where the JB Weld will touch the magazine. It actually grips, and a rough surface improves that. If you don't, you might have your built up front come off. Edited March 15, 2014 by Think1st Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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