IndyArms 10,186 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Lets say I *KNOW* the address of an FFL holder out of state to do a transfer through... Lets say I KNOW that his FFL is CURRENT and VALID... Do I LEGALLY *HAVE* to have a copy of his FFL, before I can ship a firearm to him??? Or can I just ship it to him, KNOWING that the address is VALID, his FFL is VALID, and it is going to be the same regardless of the sheet of paper or not?!?!? I mean you can look up and verify valid FFL's on the internet... so how would that be any different than just shipping direct??? I mean, lets say for EXAMPLE... ( hypothetical example) That I want to ship a firearm to Tromix, and I live in NY... if I KNOW the address do I HAVE to have his FFL in hand before I can ship to him? Or could I just address the box and send it on its merry way, as we ALL *KNOW* Tromix's FFL is current and valid?!?!? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 As in unlicensed individual, you only need to be 100% sure they have a valid FFL. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rangerdavid 6 Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Yo, Indy, you selling one of your guns???/ or something I should be aware of????????? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zone1935 5 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 I don't know about you, but, I would not take any chances knowing an unelected BScrat might get to decide my fate. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted June 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Lets just say there is a deal... and the gun is coming TO ME... and I KNOW the FFL holder is genuine, 100% SURE.... as I use his services FREQUENTLY! Like, just a few WEEKS ago as a matter of fact... As long as the firearm ships to HIM, from someone that does indeed trust that I am telling them the ffl addy is VALID, there would be NO PROBLEM, as that FFL holders address CAN BE LOOKED UP AND VERIFIED ON THE INTERNET! At least you USED to be able to verify an FFL holders FFL was current at some FBI or ATF website... I dont know the one, now, though... Thats all I am asking... you dont REALLY *NEED* the copy if you know the addy is valid... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Indy - here is the EZ check website link: https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/ paper in hand sometimes may be required when places refuse to ship the gun, based on liberal democratic ignorance, like Ive encountered this week at both local post offices..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted June 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 That is indeed the site!! thanks Ben!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RockHoundTX 10 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 As long as you can verify that the recipient is a legal FFL, then ship away. Of the guns I have purchased over the years from out-of-state individuals, I would say that about 20% ship based on EZ Check, about 60% want to have either a fax or scanned electronic copy, and the final 20% are completely anal and want a sign-in-ink copy from the FFL. I guess that some folks just either don't know the law or are just trying to do a CYA. Make sure to post pictures once your firearm arrives back from where-ever it is going Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 As long as you can verify that the recipient is a legal FFL, then ship away. Of the guns I have purchased over the years from out-of-state individuals, I would say that about 20% ship based on EZ Check, about 60% want to have either a fax or scanned electronic copy, and the final 20% are completely anal and want a sign-in-ink copy from the FFL. I guess that some folks just either don't know the law or are just trying to do a CYA. Make sure to post pictures once your firearm arrives back from where-ever it is going I don't think the above group is "anal", I think it's (old) people for whom the internet and fax machine is acknowledged in theory, but not in fact (which group also tends to be 'ignorant of the law' since going to the library to peruse a 300lb law book is not on most folks' 'pleasant things to do list') Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 I don't think the above group is "anal", I think it's (old) people for whom the internet and fax machine is acknowledged in theory, but not in fact (which group also tends to be 'ignorant of the law' since going to the library to peruse a 300lb law book is not on most folks' 'pleasant things to do list') Actually, I think Indy's sender is having an issue with local workers at the post office and UPS with them not knowing their laws, and company policy, and the sender I believe wants the paper to shove in their face to force them to comply. The liberal gun grabbing shitheads are EVERYWHERE it seems...... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
22_Shooter 1,560 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Maybe an obvious question, but why not just get the papers to squash out any doubt for the other parties involved? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 (edited) Maybe an obvious question, but why not just get the papers to squash out any doubt for the other parties involved? 22_shooter: Hey nalioth, i see you have a fine NYS-safe fancy-rifle for sale. I agree with the price and would like to pay you via paypal. My FFL is Mr So-N-So and his license numbers are 12345-xxx-xxxxx-xxxx-678. nalioth: ok, lemme look it up. [Nalioth goes to the EZ-Check site and finds the FFL holder is legit] nalioth: ok, let 'er rip [22_shooter pokes paypal] [Nalioth receives payment within 5 minutes and ships fancy-rifle first thing the next morning] Edited: Also: "papers" can be counterfeit. I always check any FFLs with EZ-Check regardless. Edited some more: For more ideas on why the above method works best, just visit the for sale section and read my 'conditions of sale'. I had a buyer go nuts because "I'd stolen his money", when his FFL was tardy in the sending of his license to me ( lots of FFLs won't tell you their numbers via phone or email, but will happily send you an ink signed copy of their license ). No verifiable FFL holder, no shipping of firearms. Edited June 20, 2008 by nalioth Quote Link to post Share on other sites
22_Shooter 1,560 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Maybe an obvious question, but why not just get the papers to squash out any doubt for the other parties involved? 22_shooter: Hey nalioth, i see you have a fine NYS-safe fancy-rifle for sale. I agree with the price and would like to pay you via paypal. My FFL is Mr So-N-So and his license numbers are 12345-xxx-xxxxx-xxxx-678. nalioth: ok, lemme look it up. [Nalioth goes to the EZ-Check site and finds the FFL holder is legit] nalioth: ok, let 'er rip [22_shooter pokes paypal] [Nalioth receives payment within 5 minutes and ships fancy-rifle first thing the next morning] Edited: Also: "papers" can be counterfeit. I always check any FFLs with EZ-Check regardless. Edited some more: For more ideas on why the above method works best, just visit the for sale section and read my 'conditions of sale'. I had a buyer go nuts because "I'd stolen his money", when his FFL was tardy in the sending of his license to me ( lots of FFLs won't tell you their numbers via phone or email, but will happily send you an ink signed copy of their license ). No verifiable FFL holder, no shipping of firearms. Guess I never thought of it like that. When I had my Stag lower shipped to my FFL, it took forever. The shop is old-school and had to mail their license to the online vendor I bought from. On top of that, the shop owner wasn't gonna be in the shop 'til halfway through the week, and apparently he was the only one who could handle it for me. It woulda been really easy for the vendor to just look up the info online. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 It woulda been really easy for the vendor to just look up the info online. Except for that small little fact I mentioned earlier in this thread... FFL holder (C&R and full grown licensees) must have faxed, scanned or signed-in-ink license in hand before dealing with other FFL holders. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
22_Shooter 1,560 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 It woulda been really easy for the vendor to just look up the info online. Except for that small little fact I mentioned earlier in this thread... FFL holder (C&R and full grown licensees) must have faxed, scanned or signed-in-ink license in hand before dealing with other FFL holders. Ah, gotcha. I just wish I had more FFL's in my area. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 It woulda been really easy for the vendor to just look up the info online. Except for that small little fact I mentioned earlier in this thread... FFL holder (C&R and full grown licensees) must have faxed, scanned or signed-in-ink license in hand before dealing with other FFL holders. and an inked or officially transmitted copy must be filed within 24 hours, as well, with the receiving FFL holder. I think thats why Indy wants to know the specifics. Hell, he lives in NY.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted June 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Maybe an obvious question, but why not just get the papers to squash out any doubt for the other parties involved? Because the first FFL never arrived at the destination, after almost 2 weeks... either on the end of the sender, which I doubt... or lost in the mail... possible... and I wanted to get this done sooner than later... instead of having a second FFL sent... That was why... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
22_Shooter 1,560 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 (edited) Maybe an obvious question, but why not just get the papers to squash out any doubt for the other parties involved? Because the first FFL never arrived at the destination, after almost 2 weeks... either on the end of the sender, which I doubt... or lost in the mail... possible... and I wanted to get this done sooner than later... instead of having a second FFL sent... That was why... Gotcha. So what are ya snagging up this time around, man? ETA: How's that GSG-5? Edited June 20, 2008 by 22_Shooter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted June 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 I have another PSL on the way... The GSG-5 kicks ass!!!! it is one of my favorite little guns, so far!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
22_Shooter 1,560 Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 The GSG-5 kicks ass!!!! it is one of my favorite little guns, so far!!! Nice. I used to think "I don't want another .22", but now I'm starting to want a GSG! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted June 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Yeah. Its costing me big money, though... $432.00 for the GSG - 5 $25.00 for the claw mount $120.00 for the optic $70.00 for the case $65.00 spare mags... TOTAL for GSG - 5... $652.00 I guess, though... when I price one out on GB... I really am not that far behind... and have tons more goodies... The case is the PERFECT case for this rifle, too... http://www.natchezss.com/Category.cfm?cont...FTOKEN=10070053 Only 37" long... so it holds it without TONS of extra wasted space... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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