Saiga in California?

[neoxyooj 0]

Sadly, i am one of many who happens to live in the "state" of California and is interested in buying a 7.62x39 Saiga. From one source to another, I feel like I've been on a wild goose chase trying to find the real answer if the Saiga rifles are LEGAL in my "state". Some people say it's legal, others says it's illegal... personally, im confused! For those who live in CA (or any CA gun law experts out there who knows ANYTHING!), please let me know.

 

This question's probably been asked a million times, but imma have to add one more to it.

 

Thanks!

[mstranglr 9]

Saiga (except the shotguns) are legal in California. The DOJ tried to scare people into not buying them for the past couple years, but it did not work and now they are for sale everywhere.

 

Some gun shops, especially the ones ran by non-internet savy indiividuals, think everything is illegal because they have not kept current on recent developments in California law. I have a local shop that still claims SKS rifles are illegal. When I tried to explain to him that only a few specific ones are illegal he refuses to listen and tells people they will go to jail if they own one, he says the same thing about saigas and ARs. I just go down to the other 2 stores in town that sell them. I would rather spend a little more money and support a pro 2nd ammendment store, than give money to a store who falls for the DOJ fear tactics and spreads false info on what is legal just because he does not sell it. Brave California store owners, like ten percent firearms, are the ones that stood up and challenged the DOJ's gustapo-like tactics and paved the way for other stores to do the same - We OWE these store owners our business IMO. Many of them did it to establish our right to own these guns, not for profit, and had to live with the DOJ constantly looking for reasons to close their stores.

 

Remember though, Only 10 round mags. Google Monsterman grips and bullet buttons, because you will need one of them to legaly convert your rifle.

 

Go to calguns.net if you are still confused, as there are many in the law profession over there that can give you the details.

[DS12 1]

move

[JeffMerr 0]

If you're in northern California I have an FFL that can get you a Saiga, PM me. I got mine from him from DD's ranch + $50 transfer fee. If you're in Southern California then I wish you the best of luck.

[mstranglr 9]

+1 for DD's Ranch in NY. They shipped my GSG to my kalifornia FFL.

[neoxyooj 0]

Saiga (except the shotguns) are legal in California. The DOJ tried to scare people into not buying them for the past couple years, but it did not work and now they are for sale everywhere.

 

Some gun shops, especially the ones ran by non-internet savy indiividuals, think everything is illegal because they have not kept current on recent developments in California law. I have a local shop that still claims SKS rifles are illegal. When I tried to explain to him that only a few specific ones are illegal he refuses to listen and tells people they will go to jail if they own one, he says the same thing about saigas and ARs. I just go down to the other 2 stores in town that sell them. I would rather spend a little more money and support a pro 2nd ammendment store, than give money to a store who falls for the DOJ fear tactics and spreads false info on what is legal just because he does not sell it. Brave California store owners, like ten percent firearms, are the ones that stood up and challenged the DOJ's gustapo-like tactics and paved the way for other stores to do the same - We OWE these store owners our business IMO. Many of them did it to establish our right to own these guns, not for profit, and had to live with the DOJ constantly looking for reasons to close their stores.

 

Remember though, Only 10 round mags. Google Monsterman grips and bullet buttons, because you will need one of them to legaly convert your rifle.

 

Go to calguns.net if you are still confused, as there are many in the law profession over there that can give you the details.

 

 

desert dog,

 

thanks for all your info. this has definitely brighten up my confusion with the "assault" weapon ban here in california. and yes, i do live in northern cali, (the capital) and was looking to buy from dd's ranch.com, but it seems they are out-of-stock!! well, imma have to look around a little more i guess........

 

looking at the prices that I see available, they seem to be around $300-500. does anyone know a site (besides dd's ranch) where i can get deal?!?

 

one more question:

 

would you go for a 7.62x39 or a .308?

[saigaboy 0]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

 

I was born and raised in the SF bay area and all my family still live there. If you ever leave the PRK it is truly eye opening about what freedoms you are missing out on.

 

As for the big question 308 vs. 7.62 x 39? You will probably end up buying both so you might as well get em now before prices keep going up.

 

If you only had one to choose from however, get the 308 since you are limited by 10 rounds max.

 

Then when the $$$$ comes in buy the 7.62 x 39.

[fleegman 0]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

 

I was born and raised in the SF bay area and all my family still live there. If you ever leave the PRK it is truly eye opening about what freedoms you are missing out on.

 

As for the big question 308 vs. 7.62 x 39? You will probably end up buying both so you might as well get em now before prices keep going up.

 

If you only had one to choose from however, get the 308 since you are limited by 10 rounds max.

 

Then when the $$$$ comes in buy the 7.62 x 39.

 

PLEASE PEOPLE! We in Kalifornia ARE NOT automatically limited to 10 round mags. I live in the LA area and this is my perfectly legal Saiga conversion with a 30 round magazine. This is legal because it lacks all "evil" features (pistol grip, forward pistol grip, flash hider, etc)

[Soundwave 0]

does anyone know a site (besides dd's ranch) where i can get deal?!?

neox...if you go to the calguns forum, check out the "Commercial Sales & Good Deals" forum. Look for a member named AlohaRover where he is offering some saiga rifles in .223 and x39. IIRC, he is a FFL in CO and is willing to ship to CA. Also, I believe BudsGunShop has the x39 for $309 shipped.

 

Good Luck in your search.

[neoxyooj 0]

does anyone know a site (besides dd's ranch) where i can get deal?!?

neox...if you go to the calguns forum, check out the "Commercial Sales & Good Deals" forum. Look for a member named AlohaRover where he is offering some saiga rifles in .223 and x39. IIRC, he is a FFL in CO and is willing to ship to CA. Also, I believe BudsGunShop has the x39 for $309 shipped.

 

Good Luck in your search.

 

thanks soundwave! budsgunshop is, so far, the cheapest deal i've found. i will get one probably next week or so when more fundings are available. thanks again for the GREAT information!

Edited August 27, 2008 by neox

[neoxyooj 0]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

 

I was born and raised in the SF bay area and all my family still live there. If you ever leave the PRK it is truly eye opening about what freedoms you are missing out on.

 

As for the big question 308 vs. 7.62 x 39? You will probably end up buying both so you might as well get em now before prices keep going up.

 

If you only had one to choose from however, get the 308 since you are limited by 10 rounds max.

 

Then when the $$$$ comes in buy the 7.62 x 39.

 

PLEASE PEOPLE! We in Kalifornia ARE NOT automatically limited to 10 round mags. I live in the LA area and this is my perfectly legal Saiga conversion with a 30 round magazine. This is legal because it lacks all "evil" features (pistol grip, forward pistol grip, flash hider, etc)

 

i thought we are only allowed 10 round max in CA? can anyone confirm this?

 

Nice gun by the way!

[hepcat85 0]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

 

I was born and raised in the SF bay area and all my family still live there. If you ever leave the PRK it is truly eye opening about what freedoms you are missing out on.

 

As for the big question 308 vs. 7.62 x 39? You will probably end up buying both so you might as well get em now before prices keep going up.

 

If you only had one to choose from however, get the 308 since you are limited by 10 rounds max.

 

Then when the $$$$ comes in buy the 7.62 x 39.

 

PLEASE PEOPLE! We in Kalifornia ARE NOT automatically limited to 10 round mags. I live in the LA area and this is my perfectly legal Saiga conversion with a 30 round magazine. This is legal because it lacks all "evil" features (pistol grip, forward pistol grip, flash hider, etc)

 

i thought we are only allowed 10 round max in CA? can anyone confirm this?

 

Nice gun by the way!

 

+1 on confirmation. I thought it was 10 rounds as well.

[hepcat85 0]

Pretty useful.

 

http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf

[Soundwave 0]

i thought we are only allowed 10 round max in CA? can anyone confirm this?

If you were a resident in CA and owned hi-capacity (> 10 rds) mags before the year 2000, you can still use them. If you want to use them in a converted saiga, then you have to play the 922r game.

[JeffMerr 0]

i thought we are only allowed 10 round max in CA? can anyone confirm this?

If you were a resident in CA and owned hi-capacity (> 10 rds) mags before the year 2000, you can still use them. If you want to use them in a converted saiga, then you have to play the 922r game.

 

Lets say that I don't have any mags that are before the year 2000, how do I get them?

[Soundwave 0]

i thought we are only allowed 10 round max in CA? can anyone confirm this?

If you were a resident in CA and owned hi-capacity (> 10 rds) mags before the year 2000, you can still use them. If you want to use them in a converted saiga, then you have to play the 922r game.

 

Lets say that I don't have any mags that are before the year 2000, how do I get them?

You cannot legally import NEW hi-cap magazines into CA. There are exceptions for LEOs, but for the regular Joe, this is the law. You can, however, order mag parts to repair your legally-owned mags (owned prior to Y2K).

 

From the CA DoJ website:

Effective January 1, 2000, SB 23 generally prohibits, the manufacture, import, sale, giving or lending of large capacity magazines (defined as any ammunition feeding device with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds, but does not include .22 caliber tube ammunition feeding devices).

[takezo 0]

Lets say that I don't have any mags that are before the year 2000, how do I get them?

 

 

 

You can't anymore... you had to have owned them before the ban in 2000--else zip! You can't even transfer the ones you own, or purchase new ones. You can however purchase parts to fix the ones you own, and that includes the body!

 

You can't even go to Nevada to purchase them--no NV dealer will sell to PRK residents anymore, they request a NV license from all who purchase hi-cap mags. UT and AZ are different stories if you know what I mean, but bringning them back into the state is a big felony.

 

FYI if you go to an AZ and NV gun shows, the ATF routinely monitors the California plates that park in the lot. They foward the numbers to the CHP, who will routinely stop and seach vehicles coming back into the state. Also the CHP profiles vehicles entering the PRK--if you got a Glock or NRA sticker or something akin to those on your window or bumber, expect to be pulled over. It's up to you whether you obey your own states laws, but just be advised, do not get caught bringing in hi-cap mags.

 

As for the Saiga being legal in the PRK--I own one and we had to register them with the DOJ years back. But perhaps the laws are changed now. I see several dealers selling PRK AKM's at the gun shows (AK without hand-grips). So if these guys can do it, certainly a Saiga would be legal. But I haven't seen any of these in the shops for nearly ten years. I purchase mine from Turner's for $165.00 back in the day.

 

Yeah I own a stack of 30 rnd hi-caps, but these were left over from a Mak90 I did not like, then sold off. So I can use these in my Saiga, but I need to do a bullet ramp conversion (see Dinzag). I've got a Dinzag ramp already that's waiting to be installed.

 

 

MY QUESTION TO THE GUY WHO CONVERTED HIS SAIGA ABOVE.... hey, can I put a JTac muzzel break on the Saiga? Can I bet threadedon? Or do I have to tack weld it in place? Google Jtac on their video and their web-site, and get back to me please. And hey dady-oo, what is that coo-coo rail system you got on the bottom of that slayer? Where can I get one also?

 

PS: I dig your conversion.

Edited August 27, 2008 by fiveringstakezo

[bigj480 203]

i thought we are only allowed 10 round max in CA? can anyone confirm this?

If you were a resident in CA and owned hi-capacity (> 10 rds) mags before the year 2000, you can still use them. If you want to use them in a converted saiga, then you have to play the 922r game.

 

Lets say that I don't have any mags that are before the year 2000, how do I get them?

 

Get in your magical telephone booth, go back to 1999 and buy some? I'm sure some have bought them after the fact and claim they had them before 2000 but that would be illegal. You wouldn't want to do that, would ya? I bet they bought them from cali residents that no longer wanted them or had them shipped in by friends that live outside of cali. They would have had to make sure that the mags couldn't be proven to have made after 2000. They also would probably have to keep in mind that there was a federal AWB that prevented civilian purchase of these mags in the '90s. The earlier the mag was made the better, for them. I know nothing of California's laws, just a guess.

[SJgunguy 5]

OK here's the skinny people. If said standard capacity mags were obtained before 12/31/99 they are LEGAL to use in any FEATURELESS RIFLE(no pistol grip,no forward pistol grip,no flash hider,no folding/retactable stock) Saigas in the stock configuration can be used with standard capacity mags. Now if you want a pistol grip you HAVE TO INSTALL A MAG LOCKING DEVICE! Go to calguns.net all the info you will need is there.

[fleegman 0]

Edited August 27, 2008 by fleegman

[takezo 0]

Yeah, I think I registered it when I didn't have to... I got the Izmash type. Damn!!!

 

Anyways I got the profiling info from an ILA and Cal-guns contact. They are profiling people. They are stopping people, especaily after gun-shows in Las Vegas and Pheonix AZ.... ATF passes off liscense numbers to CHP who wait in Needles or the hill before you get to Baker. And yes you should never consent to a search of your vehicle. And no, I haven't heard of a hi-cap prosecution.

 

As for your converted saiga.... who makes those forward grips? Does the top grip come without a rail?

[mstranglr 9]

Neox,

 

If Budsgunshop is out, try tenpercentfirearms.com . The have some in stock and will ship to your FFL. They are located in Taft California.

 

The older saigas, marked Kalashnikov or EAA, are not legal. Just the RAA saigas - which is what you are buying.

 

Enjoy you new toy!

[fleegman 0]

Yeah, I think I registered it when I didn't have to... I got the Izmash type. Damn!!!

 

Anyways I got the profiling info from an ILA and Cal-guns contact. They are profiling people. They are stopping people, especaily after gun-shows in Las Vegas and Pheonix AZ.... ATF passes off liscense numbers to CHP who wait in Needles or the hill before you get to Baker. And yes you should never consent to a search of your vehicle. And no, I haven't heard of a hi-cap prosecution.

 

As for your converted saiga.... who makes those forward grips? Does the top grip come without a rail?

Here is a link for the grip. It is "rail-less". It is intended as a light holder, it needs to be long light like the Surefire Nitrolon G3. The grip has no effect on 922®.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/17980-1.html

 

And yes, the police will certainly "profile" you, they do it all the time, and is good police work. They may profile you AND stop you, but they still DO NOT have probable cause to search you or your vehicle, and don't let them fool you or intimidate you. DO NOT ACCIDENTALLY GIVE CONSENT! When they ask "You wouldn't mind if we search your vehicle", that isn't an innocent hypothetical question. If you say you don't mind, you have just waived your rights and consented to a search. People foolishly do this all the time. The only answer to any questions/comments about "searching" or "looking around" is "I do not consent to a search of my vehicle". If the cop says "Hey, if you've got nothing to hide, why do you have a problem with me searching your car?", respond with "Respectfully officer, I have already answered your question, I do not consent to a search of my vehicle, and I DO HAVE A PROBLEM with someone insisting I waive my fourth amendment rights under the US Constitution." That should end the matter right there. I should add, make all these statements calmly and respectfully, with no undue attitude. Keep a friendly demeanor at all times. The cop isn't your enemy, and you don't want to make him one.

Edited August 27, 2008 by fleegman

[neoxyooj 0]

Neox,

 

If Budsgunshop is out, try tenpercentfirearms.com . The have some in stock and will ship to your FFL. They are located in Taft California.

 

The older saigas, marked Kalashnikov or EAA, are not legal. Just the RAA saigas - which is what you are buying.

 

Enjoy you new toy!

 

thanks for your kind advice desert dog. until i can find a better deal than budsgunshop.com, im sticking with them (unless they don't ship to CA, then imma have to go with tenpercent.com or somewhere else....).

 

Yup, getting the 7.62x39 caliber (RAA) saiga. can't wait to get it. probably won't do too much to customize it; however, im thinking about adding a scope (or red dot) and having the handguard customized and drilled to have air vents like most of the saigas i've seen here (they are TRULY works of art!). other than that, im probably sticking with the standard factory stock. i might buy a skeleton stock (no pistol grip) later on just for show and tell, but other than that, that's it.

 

any advice for what to do next or to add on to my list of customizations?

[hawk81 2]

Cold war shooters in Highland Ca. carry saigas, also Ammo Brothers in Lakewood Ca. carry saigas. Hope this helps. Also Cold War Shooters carry Ar-15 lowers, Ar rifles, sig 556, Ak style rifles and other evil California weapons.

[Res 0]

+1 on Saiga's being perfectly legal in Cali. Neox, I live in Sacramento as well. I work closely with DOC, CHP, and Sac Sheriffs. I've taken my modified Saiga with 30,40 round mags and shot at many dept ranges in and around Sac and West Sac. Not only did i not have any problems, I got at least 2 leo to buy one.

 

When you are able to find a dealer, check out FFL Bob Snellings to do the transfer. Cheapest prices around ($50 total: 25 transfer, 25 dros)

 

-Dusty

[Bongos 0]

What if you own a Saiga 7.62x39 that was made to accept high cap mags (which you also already own from the 1980's)... do you still have to mod it US parts to comply to 922R or is it exempt?

[SJgunguy 5]

What if you own a Saiga 7.62x39 that was made to accept high cap mags (which you also already own from the 1980's)... do you still have to mod it US parts to comply to 922R or is it exempt?

 

 

Yes 922r applys. If you want to use hi-caps the rifle must be a "Featureless" rifle, no pistol grip,no folding/telescoping stock,no forward pistol grip,or flash suppresor/granade launcher. You have to be careful using hi-caps though, some dickhead DA with a hard on for political asperations might want to say that your rifle was "modified to accecpt" the "EVIL HI-CAP" mag and the streets will run red with the blood of kittens and puppys if your not in jail. If your rifle is in the relm of "Black Rifle Evilness" than you can't ues any mag that holds more than 10 rnd. and you need to have a mag lock installed.

[Bongos 0]

What if you own a Saiga 7.62x39 that was made to accept high cap mags (which you also already own from the 1980's)... do you still have to mod it US parts to comply to 922R or is it exempt?

 

 

Yes 922r applys. If you want to use hi-caps the rifle must be a "Featureless" rifle, no pistol grip,no folding/telescoping stock,no forward pistol grip,or flash suppresor/granade launcher. You have to be careful using hi-caps though, some dickhead DA with a hard on for political asperations might want to say that your rifle was "modified to accecpt" the "EVIL HI-CAP" mag and the streets will run red with the blood of kittens and puppys if your not in jail. If your rifle is in the relm of "Black Rifle Evilness" than you can't ues any mag that holds more than 10 rnd. and you need to have a mag lock installed.

That's just it, my Saiga has no evil features, it just happens to accept hicap mags, it was made that way from the manufacturer, no mods were done to it... do you still need to put the US parts in?

[SJgunguy 5]

Yes the parts count needs to be under 10. When i'm talkin' about DA with boner i'm saying that the rifle has to be modified to accept the Hi-cap mags. While not being illegal, if you piss off the wrong person or somebody at a range isn't up to date on current law the bullet guide could cost you $$$$$ in lawyer fees. It's kind of like an SKS. If you mess with it just a little you have to go all the way in order to be legal with CA and Fed law. Remember the douche bags who pass the laws don't care. They will just pay for the proper permits,while John Q Public gets fukd left and right.

 

If you do the full conversion make sure you install a mag lock. The CA DOJ never has given it's "Official" opinion on mag locks or monster man grips. These compliance parts have been designed to the letter of the law and DOJ won't say yes or no.