RoughRider666 47 Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 (edited) i know this subject has been more than likely beaten to death on this forum, and your probably thinking: not another "IS IT CA LEGAL" thread, so i apologize in advance if this has been covered in the past, as i am totally new to this forum. my question is this: Is it legal to have a traditional AK fixed mounted butt stock on a Saiga as long as its not a folding or telescoping stock and there is no pistol grip? Basically, i would like to have the trigger left in the stock Saiga location, but use the traditional AK Butt Stock, and Upper and lower handguards, thus being able to actually USE/MOUNT my cleaning Rod to the gun, and be able to put the tool tube in the stock, so i could have them with me at all times. Basically looking like a true AK in every way with the exception of not having a Pistol Grip. Also, Is it possible to do a trigger job on a Saiga to lighten the pull with the trigger in the stock location? if so, what parts do i need? and can all this be done and still be 922r compliant if U.S. parts are used? thanX in Advance, -RoughRider666 Edited January 8, 2009 by RoughRider666 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Vigilante 0 Posted January 11, 2009 Report Share Posted January 11, 2009 i know this subject has been more than likely beaten to death on this forum, and your probably thinking: not another "IS IT CA LEGAL" thread, so i apologize in advance if this has been covered in the past, as i am totally new to this forum. my question is this: Is it legal to have a traditional AK fixed mounted butt stock on a Saiga as long as its not a folding or telescoping stock and there is no pistol grip? Basically, i would like to have the trigger left in the stock Saiga location, but use the traditional AK Butt Stock, and Upper and lower handguards, thus being able to actually USE/MOUNT my cleaning Rod to the gun, and be able to put the tool tube in the stock, so i could have them with me at all times. Basically looking like a true AK in every way with the exception of not having a Pistol Grip. Also, Is it possible to do a trigger job on a Saiga to lighten the pull with the trigger in the stock location? if so, what parts do i need? and can all this be done and still be 922r compliant if U.S. parts are used? thanX in Advance, -RoughRider666 If you change out the original stock for an AK style stock, but do not use a pistol grip, then you would be CA legal. However, I think that you would have to play the 922r parts game a that point. If I were you, I would check out www.calguns.net for a better answer to this question. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SanSacto 1 Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 i know this subject has been more than likely beaten to death on this forum, and your probably thinking: not another "IS IT CA LEGAL" thread, so i apologize in advance if this has been covered in the past, as i am totally new to this forum. my question is this: Is it legal to have a traditional AK fixed mounted butt stock on a Saiga as long as its not a folding or telescoping stock and there is no pistol grip? Basically, i would like to have the trigger left in the stock Saiga location, but use the traditional AK Butt Stock, and Upper and lower handguards, thus being able to actually USE/MOUNT my cleaning Rod to the gun, and be able to put the tool tube in the stock, so i could have them with me at all times. Basically looking like a true AK in every way with the exception of not having a Pistol Grip. Also, Is it possible to do a trigger job on a Saiga to lighten the pull with the trigger in the stock location? if so, what parts do i need? and can all this be done and still be 922r compliant if U.S. parts are used? thanX in Advance, -RoughRider666 Yes, just swapping the Saiga buttstock for a traditional AK buttstock is okay if there is no pistol grip or other "evil features" attatched. You would be California compliant, but I do not think you would be 922r compliant. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wheel 0 Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 might be uncomfortable to shoot... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mstranglr 9 Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 Just convert it and drop in a new trigger group. I have been using the Monsterman Grip alot and I am realy getting used to it. Ive tried the factory config with a Dinzag non-converted trigger group and still was not happy with the smoothness and the LOP. Bullet buttons make mag changes a PITA, and bassically ruin the rifles utility as a defensive weapon. Some Cali and fed legal full conversions with MM grips; Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SJgunguy 5 Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 These are my Russian twin girls. 100% legal in California. The MMG is a pretty good trade off for the use of a detachable mag. Desert dog, you have some nice looking girls yourself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
takezo 0 Posted February 24, 2009 Report Share Posted February 24, 2009 (edited) I think you can go full AK conversion with the Saiga. Even add a pistol grip--but to do this you have to loose the mag-catch, and install a bullet button or Rad-lock. This way you need a tool to remove the magazine, and therefore it is not "detachable." Ammo Brothers had a bunch of these AK's set-up like this (with pistol grip and rad-locks) before the election. But they're all gone now. Sold out in the feeding frenzy. I even saw some of their competetors selling identially set-up AK's at two gun-shows last summer with no problemo's. But they had Rad-locks. Now I went to Ammo Brothers (in Cerritos CA) last week and they swore that it is still legal. And that you can set your Saiga up in the same manner. But I do not take anyone who works behind the counter of a gun-shop as "the last word" if you know what I mean. The photo shown above in this tread with the "monster grip" I know is completely legal in CA. Check on Calguns to see what the deal is now, and let me know. FRT Edited February 24, 2009 by fiveringstakezo Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SJgunguy 5 Posted March 8, 2009 Report Share Posted March 8, 2009 I think you can go full AK conversion with the Saiga.Even add a pistol grip--but to do this you have to loose the mag-catch, and install a bullet button or Rad-lock. This way you need a tool to remove the magazine, and therefore it is not "detachable." Ammo Brothers had a bunch of these AK's set-up like this (with pistol grip and rad-locks) before the election. But they're all gone now. Sold out in the feeding frenzy. I even saw some of their competetors selling identially set-up AK's at two gun-shows last summer with no problemo's. But they had Rad-locks. Now I went to Ammo Brothers (in Cerritos CA) last week and they swore that it is still legal. And that you can set your Saiga up in the same manner. But I do not take anyone who works behind the counter of a gun-shop as "the last word" if you know what I mean. The photo shown above in this tread with the "monster grip" I know is completely legal in CA. Check on Calguns to see what the deal is now, and let me know. FRT Try using the radd lock when bullets are whizzing by your skull.........MMG is the way to go for a CA legal battle rifle. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vintagedude88 16 Posted March 23, 2009 Report Share Posted March 23, 2009 I've been on the fence to convert my .308. I want to keep the mag release because I need it if I am to be stuck with just 10rnd mags. I've looked at the MMG many times but even their website has a disclaimer that they can not guarantee to be CA legal. According to MMG themselves, they have not received a full acknowledgement from the California DOJ that MMGs are legal in California. Until I can see that MMG can assure me it is legal, I'm leaving my gun unconverted. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
janusthephoenix 24 Posted March 23, 2009 Report Share Posted March 23, 2009 My advice is to leave your gun unconverted until you move somewhere else. That's what I'm doing. Honestly, the Saiga Rifles are a fairly nice gun in stock config anyway, it's not like it's useless if you don't convert it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mstranglr 9 Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 I've been on the fence to convert my .308. I want to keep the mag release because I need it if I am to be stuck with just 10rnd mags. I've looked at the MMG many times but even their website has a disclaimer that they can not guarantee to be CA legal. According to MMG themselves, they have not received a full acknowledgement from the California DOJ that MMGs are legal in California. Until I can see that MMG can assure me it is legal, I'm leaving my gun unconverted. Do some research on calguns.net The MM grip and bullet button issue have been challenged and the DOJ backs off. They are legal under current law. The MM grip is never the issue with the Saiga in California, it is the name "Saiga" as it appears on the ban list (EAA vs. RAA). If you call the DOJ, they will try to tell you that the Saiga is illegal in California - thats what they tell all out-of state dealers to try to convince them not to ship here, but the DOJ is being untruthful and has not been able to touch anyone on that one either. So if you are afraid of what the DOJ says, you may want to stay away from most semi-auto guns in California, and get a mini14. I would honestly convert. You get a 10 times better trigger with the conversion, especially with the .308. The factory Saiga .308 trigger is horrendous and unlike any other trigger I have ever seen. The MM grip is also not bad at all once you get used to it, and most tactical carbine classes are full of people using them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
imarangemaster 315 Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 The text of the law lists" Klashnikov USA" in one place, and European American Armory in another. According to what I gather on the California boards, Russian American Armory Siagas ore OK, with no pistol grip and a High cap if it was possessed before the ban, just like M-1 Carbines, Ruger Mini 14s, and Mini 30s. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
janusthephoenix 24 Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 Saigas are 100% legal in CA unless they have a pistol grip or (I'm pretty sure) telescoping or folding stock. Suppressors (sound or flash) are also illegal, and muzzle brakes might be also but I'm not sure. Mags over 10 rounds are illegal also, of course. Like everyone says, check calguns.net. Note: all of the above applies only if the magazine is removable. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mstranglr 9 Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 (edited) Saigas are 100% legal in CA unless they have a pistol grip or (I'm pretty sure) telescoping or folding stock. Suppressors (sound or flash) are also illegal, and muzzle brakes might be also but I'm not sure. Mags over 10 rounds are illegal also, of course. Like everyone says, check calguns.net. Note: all of the above applies only if the magazine is removable. Only RAA Saigas are legal, all other Saigas are illegal to possess in California. Getting caught with a EAA Saiga will get you some serious jail time. The DOJ hates them all and will inaccurately state that they are all illegal when you call them. I did, and thats what they told me, but they will refuse to give you this in writing if you ask - as many have tried. That is why MOST DISTRIBUTORS will not ship Saigas to California. You can have a pistol grip, folding stock, and any kind of muzzle devise you want if you use a bullet button (considered fixed mag). Without a bullet button (any centerfire rifle with a detachable magazine), your stock cannot fold or collapse, no pistol grip (but a MM is OK), no forward grip, and no flash hider. Muzzle brakes are completely legal on any gun. Pre-ban owned high capacity magazines are perfectly legal to use with the MM grip or factory stock. A fixed mag can only use 10 round mags regardless. Luckily, I stocked up on lots of 30 round mags prior to 2000 and use them with the MM grips. Just about everyone I shoot with stocked up on high capacity AR, Glock, FAL, M1A and AK mags before the 2000 ban. For those that are new to guns in California, you are stuck using 10 rounders in everything. But high capacity magazines ARE NOT illegal to own in California, just illegal to buy, sell, or give away. LEGAL SAIGA CONFIGS IN CALIFORNIA: Pistol grip used with bullet button (10/30 mag in pic) and birdcage flash hider Factory configuration with 10 round mag and J-Tac muzzle brake Monsterman grip with pre-ban 30 rounder and 74-style brake Edited March 24, 2009 by desert dog Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nine-seven 0 Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 also worth noting is that the overall length of the rifle cannot be less than 30", so if you're using a folding stock, you're cool on a 20" barrel, but not a 16". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SJgunguy 5 Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 The only Saiga rifles that are illegal must be marked with Kalashnikov USA. They are banned by name, thus making them illegal. The EAA is perfectly legal to own and transfer in Cali. The thing about the DOJ in California is they have stupid laws that make no sense at all and they think we're gonna stand by and take it. Bullshit! If anybody needs info about Cali gun regulations don't bother with DOJ. Calguns.net will have the most up to date info and there are enough lawyers and "the right people" to get any issue ironed out. I think there was a thread about a EAA saiga somebody wanted to buy and it GTG. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stix213 3 Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 (edited) Sorry to dig up such an old thread, but just wanted to make things easy on anyone who stumbles on this and reads all the conflicting information, and bad info (like that EAA Saiga is illegal, when it is totally fine, the ban on EAA was proposed but never put into effect). Just follow the calguns center fire rifle assault weapons identification guide and you can tell if any center fire rifle in existence is illegal in california. Only Kalashnikov USA Saigas are flat out banned, while RAA and EAA are fine as long as you follow the evil features song and dance, and only featureless Saigas can have standard capacity magazines. All relevant codes are cited so you can look up the language yourself each step of the way if you want. http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf Edited September 17, 2009 by stix213 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RoughRider666 47 Posted September 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Saigas are 100% legal in CA unless they have a pistol grip or (I'm pretty sure) telescoping or folding stock. Suppressors (sound or flash) are also illegal, and muzzle brakes might be also but I'm not sure. Mags over 10 rounds are illegal also, of course. Like everyone says, check calguns.net. Note: all of the above applies only if the magazine is removable. Only RAA Saigas are legal, all other Saigas are illegal to possess in California. Getting caught with a EAA Saiga will get you some serious jail time. The DOJ hates them all and will inaccurately state that they are all illegal when you call them. I did, and thats what they told me, but they will refuse to give you this in writing if you ask - as many have tried. That is why MOST DISTRIBUTORS will not ship Saigas to California. You can have a pistol grip, folding stock, and any kind of muzzle devise you want if you use a bullet button (considered fixed mag). Without a bullet button (any centerfire rifle with a detachable magazine), your stock cannot fold or collapse, no pistol grip (but a MM is OK), no forward grip, and no flash hider. Muzzle brakes are completely legal on any gun. Pre-ban owned high capacity magazines are perfectly legal to use with the MM grip or factory stock. A fixed mag can only use 10 round mags regardless. Luckily, I stocked up on lots of 30 round mags prior to 2000 and use them with the MM grips. Just about everyone I shoot with stocked up on high capacity AR, Glock, FAL, M1A and AK mags before the 2000 ban. For those that are new to guns in California, you are stuck using 10 rounders in everything. But high capacity magazines ARE NOT illegal to own in California, just illegal to buy, sell, or give away. LEGAL SAIGA CONFIGS IN CALIFORNIA: Pistol grip used with bullet button (10/30 mag in pic) and birdcage flash hider Factory configuration with 10 round mag and J-Tac muzzle brake Monsterman grip with pre-ban 30 rounder and 74-style brake how can you get a hold of Pre-Ban mags these days? And are they legal to posess / use in CA? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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