New US made railed forend from a quality company

[22_Shooter 1,560]

I agree that I am making negative assumptions for something I haven't ever handled. Much like you make positive assumptions for something you don't have and haven't handled.

 

I guess I'm just a positive person . Seriously though.......MI is a good company. This looks like to be a good rail. This is a new rail. The only other US made rails for AK rifles (that I know of, anyway) are Krebs (EXPENSIVE. Not saying it's not worth it, but it's damn expensive) and Ultimak lower rails (again, regardless of if they're worth it or not, they're expensive). This rail might not need anything other than the supplied clamp to be used (You say it won't hold, but I'll still wait and see. Like I said, Ultimak lower rails don't use lower HG retainers, and I here those lock up just fine and tight).

 

So, yes, those are all positives, IMO.

 

Since you say "coughfuckUTGcough" in your header, do you own a UTG Saiga rail or are you making assumptions? Because I have never been able to find a negative review from a UTG Saiga owner.

 

Own? No.

 

Have handled? Yes. Not up until recently did I get to fondle an AK UTG railed forend. Granted, it was not the Saiga-specific rail, but I'm assuming their rails are all the same, save for slight mods made to it to fit Saigas without modifications.

 

I wasn't impressed; by the look/feel or the performance. I'll admit that I already had a bad taste in my mouth from all the research I've done on AK accessories, and seeing UTG reviews. But my impression wouldn't have changed, if I hadn't heard of UTG before handling one.

 

It was on a rental AK at a range. I even went as far as to ask the RO how old the rail was (simply because it seemed "weathered").......the guy got all excited, as if this UTG rail was the best thing since sliced bread. I'm assuming he hasn't handled/seen many rails in his lifetime.

 

 

 

 

The whole point of this thread was to inform other of this new rail. Nothing more, nothing less. Could I have left out the little snide remarks about UTG? Probably.

 

To each his own.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't wanna jump into this whole side-topic, but I saw this.......

 

....It is like getting on your buy American soapbox to buy a US made hood for your Honda.

 

......and felt the need to reply to it.

 

As far as Hondas (and the like) go, the VAST majority of them are made here in the US, in factories that employ hard working Americans. As opposed to some big-name "American" car companies, that are made in Mexico (like some Dodges, etc).

 

There was a huge thread on Arfcom about this very subject awhile back. After doing some research, lots of people ended up finding out that their "American" cars/trucks were indeed made outside of the US..........and that many "imports" were actually made right here in the US, by other Americans.

 

Not trying to instigate this back-and-forth any further. Just felt the need to reply to that one part.

[vbrtrmn 167]

SmirkingJackOff can't help it, he'd rather help further Communism than be bothered with supporting the small businesses, people and country in which he resides.

 

I've seen dudes get defensive about their Harleys and Fords, but never about fucking worthless Chinese shit, maybe the UTG rail comes with a blow job or something.

Edited September 11, 2009 by vbrtrmn

[kyro74 1]

22_Shooter, I am in complete agreement with you on all of your points. To each his own. If you don't like the UTG rail, it is nice to see some other options start to hit the market. I just dont see this one as being the perfect solution yet. And, yes, some Hondas are made in the US.

 

vbrtmn, It is clear that you are just don't have the capacity to form any sort of genuine response to what could be a worthwhile debate, incapable of forming an informed position on anything. Further communism by buying the only rail made for an already foreign rifle that costs less than $200? If you say so. I do notice that you offer no response to any of the points that I bring up. Not surprising. Blind propaganda spewers like you really rarely are able to offer any substantial debate. Childish name calling and cursing and swearing are the extent of your rhetorical repetiore. You just jump on something that you think makes you appear to be patriotic and are not even able to support your stance. There is no chance of having any sort of constructive debate on the merits of this subject with you.

 

The real subject of this thread is that the rail LOOKS very cool. It clearly is not ideal for Saigas and will need more finesse to make it work but if someone is willing to take the steps, I think it will make for a very nice looking front end. I do still think that a front HG retainer will be necessary for looks as well as function. But like I said before, it is nice to see some options. I hope it works out.

[22_Shooter 1,560]

The real subject of this thread is that the rail LOOKS very cool. It clearly is not ideal for Saigas and will need more finesse to make it work but if someone is willing to take the steps, I think it will make for a very nice looking front end. I do still think that a front HG retainer will be necessary for looks as well as function. But like I said before, it is nice to see some options. I hope it works out.

 

Any non-Saiga-specific AK furniture may need some "finessing" to work on a Saiga. Personally, I don't think that's a shortcoming.......although my use of the word "perfect" may have been a little greedy. Either way, all of these gorgeous Saigas posted all over this forum, with regular AK furniture all needed a little "finessing" to install on a Saiga.

 

But I'll guess we'll just leave it at "To each his own". Because that's what it really comes down to.

 

I'm not going to gain or lose anything from what you decide to put on your gun, and vice versa about what I put on my gun.

 

 

 

 

(Moe, be sure to post your thoughts on the rail when you get it..........and some pics!)

[kyro74 1]

 

Any non-Saiga-specific AK furniture may need some "finessing" to work on a Saiga. Personally, I don't think that's a shortcoming.......although my use of the word "perfect" may have been a little greedy. Either way, all of these gorgeous Saigas posted all over this forum, with regular AK furniture all needed a little "finessing" to install on a Saiga.

 

But I'll guess we'll just leave it at "To each his own". Because that's what it really comes down to.

 

I'm not going to gain or lose anything from what you decide to put on your gun, and vice versa about what I put on my gun.

 

 

 

 

(Moe, be sure to post your thoughts on the rail when you get it..........and some pics!)

 

I couldn't agree more man. That was my only real problem with this rail was that some may have read the thread and thought it was a drop in replacement. It needs additional work and an extra part but the end result will be a very nice looking (and hopefully functional) rail system. As long as people know what they are getting into before they drop their hard earned cash, I say to go for it. I really like the look of the pictures posted on the AK. Hopefully someone will come up with a better alternative to a front HG retainer to really get the full use and looks out of this new rail.

[Botasky1 3]

Heres a picture of the rail mounted on a SaigaX39... Its definitly sans new gas tube and lower HG retainer... This rail will definitly be finding its way on my X39.. It looks pretty damned light compared to the full length tri rail Im using now.

 

[22_Shooter 1,560]

Heres a picture of the rail mounted on a SaigaX39... Its definitly sans new gas tube and lower HG retainer... This rail will definitly be finding its way on my X39.. It looks pretty damned light compared to the full length tri rail Im using now.

 

 

Looks good!

 

Hopefully, some of our vendors will start carrying this.

[Moe Zambeak 53]

Heres a picture of the rail mounted on a SaigaX39... Its definitly sans new gas tube and lower HG retainer... This rail will definitly be finding its way on my X39.. It looks pretty damned light compared to the full length tri rail Im using now.

 

 

Looks good!

 

Hopefully, some of our vendors will start carrying this.

 

 

Damn that looks sweet!

 

Mine just came in the mail today. The only problem is that I am in California for work until Wednesday

[22_Shooter 1,560]

Heres a picture of the rail mounted on a SaigaX39... Its definitly sans new gas tube and lower HG retainer... This rail will definitly be finding its way on my X39.. It looks pretty damned light compared to the full length tri rail Im using now.

 

 

Looks good!

 

Hopefully, some of our vendors will start carrying this.

 

 

Damn that looks sweet!

 

Mine just came in the mail today. The only problem is that I am in California for work until Wednesday

 

Cool. Looking forward to some pics and your opinion.

[Moe Zambeak 53]

Well, I didn't get home until Friday. I opened the box and to be honest, I was pretty damned impressed right away. I wanted to take pics of it, but I couldn't wait and ended up installing it right away. It feels REAL solid. I will take some pics tomorrow and hopefully get a range report this week.

 

One last thing, It looks like I would pay hell if I tried to ream it out to fit an S12.

[bigsal 757]

I still don't get why there is this hate for UTG. Isn't this a piece of aluminum with rails that screws onto the front to hold accessories? I can see it as a potential alternative to the UTG rail if you need another part for your 922r count or you don't like the length of the UTG rail, but this will need a handguard retainer or else it will only be held in place by friction on the gas tube (which will also need to be replaced). The first time you shoot your rifle without a handguard retainer this rail system will most definitely move forward. So your $80 (on sale) part will cost about $200 when all is said and done. I am completely happy with my UTG rail. It fits precisely and is rock solid. Otherwise, it is nice to see another option out there.

 

There is a huge thread about this, I'll sum it up for you:

If you're an American and you buy a Chinese made product over a comparable American made product, you're basically selling out to Communism. This goes doubly for people who claim to be Republicans and/or Right-Wing (with the exception of possibly purist Libertarians) AND infinitely so for people who claim to be Patriots. The biggest fraud is seeing cars parked at Walmart (where nearly 95% of the products are made in China) with McCain/Palin, Pro-American, and/or Troop Support bumper stickers; one can say they support all of that, but they sell out all of their beliefs when they turn around and shop there.

 

It drives me up the wall every time people say, go buy some Winchester ammo at Walmart, every time, I think.. "Get a fucking clue, for Christ's sake!"

 

If I saw two pair of boots the first costing $100 and Made in China, the second costing $300 and Made in the USA, even if they looked the same, I'd pay the extra for my money to stay in my country. The reasons behind this are: 1. the product made in the USA is more likely to be of higher quality, I've seen it time and time again, 2. more of the money stays in the country and possibly my state, 3. the support is better if I have questions about the product, I can call the company and generally talk to an American, not "Heeloo mai neem is Roobert Smiiith, hoow mei ei elp yoo todee?", 4. many many other reasons, which I don't feel like going over again and again.

 

Buy American products or go get a Chinese flag and wave that!

 

Bingo. I agree with all of that except I don't think you need to be a right-winger to want to buy American. I am probably the most leftist guy you'll meet (on a gun board anyway) and I try to stay clear of products made by slave labor.

Hell, since we are talking about rails we really should be talking about Ultimak (produced here in my native Moscow, Idaho), and not the UTG crap that does not allow co-witness. I have the same issues with Midwest Industries new rail, but at least they are made here stateside (also they are a heck of a lot better designed than the UTG crap).

[22_Shooter 1,560]

Well, I didn't get home until Friday. I opened the box and to be honest, I was pretty damned impressed right away. I wanted to take pics of it, but I couldn't wait and ended up installing it right away. It feels REAL solid. I will take some pics tomorrow and hopefully get a range report this week.

 

One last thing, It looks like I would pay hell if I tried to ream it out to fit an S12.

 

Glad to hear, and looking forward to the pics.

 

So it locks up nice and tight with the supplied "clamp", and not using a lower HG retainer?

[Moe Zambeak 53]

Alright, so I got some quick pics tonight. Once again, I am sorry for being to anxious and not taking any pics before installation. The first thing I noticed when I opened the packaging was that they included instructions. That made me kinda nervous thinking that it would be complicated to install, but I guess they just want to make sure people get it right.

 

 

If you notice in the picture in the instruction, they also include some "blue thread locker". I thought that was a nice touch.

 

Installation was pretty straight forward. You place the bottom FHG on the barrel, then place the clamp on top, then screw the clamp with the provided screws. Next you place the top rail on, and clamp it down. I'm sure you also noticed in the pictures, I installed the Dinzag bolt on FHG retainer. I don't think you need it, but it gives a more polished look.

 

Enough talk, on with the pics.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I should be taking it out to the range within the next 2 days to give it a run.

[kyro74 1]

Looks good. I think you made the right call with the handguard retainer for both looks and function. I don't know if you saw the thread about the muzzle break that left drag marks on the barrel from recoil. I would want the added security of the retainer to keep it from working its way forward when firing. Is that a new gas tube or did you remove the shroud?

[kyro74 1]

I still don't get why there is this hate for UTG. Isn't this a piece of aluminum with rails that screws onto the front to hold accessories? I can see it as a potential alternative to the UTG rail if you need another part for your 922r count or you don't like the length of the UTG rail, but this will need a handguard retainer or else it will only be held in place by friction on the gas tube (which will also need to be replaced). The first time you shoot your rifle without a handguard retainer this rail system will most definitely move forward. So your $80 (on sale) part will cost about $200 when all is said and done. I am completely happy with my UTG rail. It fits precisely and is rock solid. Otherwise, it is nice to see another option out there.

 

There is a huge thread about this, I'll sum it up for you:

If you're an American and you buy a Chinese made product over a comparable American made product, you're basically selling out to Communism. This goes doubly for people who claim to be Republicans and/or Right-Wing (with the exception of possibly purist Libertarians) AND infinitely so for people who claim to be Patriots. The biggest fraud is seeing cars parked at Walmart (where nearly 95% of the products are made in China) with McCain/Palin, Pro-American, and/or Troop Support bumper stickers; one can say they support all of that, but they sell out all of their beliefs when they turn around and shop there.

 

It drives me up the wall every time people say, go buy some Winchester ammo at Walmart, every time, I think.. "Get a fucking clue, for Christ's sake!"

 

If I saw two pair of boots the first costing $100 and Made in China, the second costing $300 and Made in the USA, even if they looked the same, I'd pay the extra for my money to stay in my country. The reasons behind this are: 1. the product made in the USA is more likely to be of higher quality, I've seen it time and time again, 2. more of the money stays in the country and possibly my state, 3. the support is better if I have questions about the product, I can call the company and generally talk to an American, not "Heeloo mai neem is Roobert Smiiith, hoow mei ei elp yoo todee?", 4. many many other reasons, which I don't feel like going over again and again.

 

Buy American products or go get a Chinese flag and wave that!

 

Bingo. I agree with all of that except I don't think you need to be a right-winger to want to buy American. I am probably the most leftist guy you'll meet (on a gun board anyway) and I try to stay clear of products made by slave labor.

Hell, since we are talking about rails we really should be talking about Ultimak (produced here in my native Moscow, Idaho), and not the UTG crap that does not allow co-witness. I have the same issues with Midwest Industries new rail, but at least they are made here stateside (also they are a heck of a lot better designed than the UTG crap).

 

UGH, this again? BigSal, we get it, you don't like the UTG rail. But the hypocrisy of demanding "buy American" for a foreign rifle is baffling. I support local businesses, all sell things that are made overseas. It is the state of the world today. To say that anything that was not manufactured in the USA is made by slave labor is incredibly ignorant. I am not sure if you have ever been anywhere else, but people that have never traveled outside of the United States have a very skewed view of reality as it pertains to the rest of the world. You should go through your house and remove everything that wasn't made in the USA from USA manufactured parts from USA native raw materials in which no money from your purchase has gone to a foreign company or its subsidiary. Your house will be empty.

Find me one, just one, UTG owner that has anything bad to say. I did tons of research and could not come up with anything but people like you that just hated it to hate it. The truth is that it is the ONLY option for a Saiga specific front rail system (metal) that is below $200 (I paid $79.00). A POSP mounted via the side mount will still allow for the use of ironsights with the UTG installed. Why this undying obsession for the Ultimak co-witness? I could not care less because I think the side rail mount is a superior option for mounting optics. The rail system in this thread looks good and is a somewhat reasonable option to someone that wants a FHG/Quad Rail setup. It needs some extra work since it is NOT Saiga specific, and it will cost about double what the UTG costs. But as an option, it seems like it may work

Edited September 22, 2009 by JaxSmirkingRevenge

[Moe Zambeak 53]

Looks good. I think you made the right call with the handguard retainer for both looks and function. I don't know if you saw the thread about the muzzle break that left drag marks on the barrel from recoil. I would want the added security of the retainer to keep it from working its way forward when firing. Is that a new gas tube or did you remove the shroud?

 

Thanks man!

 

I saw that thread. I think I am going to take imarangemaster's advice and dimple the FSB.

 

The gas tube is courtesy of Dinzag. When I pick up a 5.45, I think I am going to swap gas tube on it, and use the original x39 tube with this FHG. It looks like it would be easy to dremel the spot welds on the factory tube and get this rail to fit.

[saigafreake 27]

looks great blows away the utg.

[kyro74 1]

 

I saw that thread. I think I am going to take imarangemaster's advice and dimple the FSB.

 

 

That would be a good idea IMO. The other reason I brought that up is to demonstrate the real forces at work with recoil. Your choice to go with the handguard retainer and the gas tube with the retainer should go a long way in helping to make sure that your rail doesn't move forward. Without those I think it wouldn't look nearly as good and, like I said before, would probably effect the ability of the HG to hold zero. Great work.

[22_Shooter 1,560]

Alright, so I got some quick pics tonight. Once again, I am sorry for being to anxious and not taking any pics before installation. The first thing I noticed when I opened the packaging was that they included instructions. That made me kinda nervous thinking that it would be complicated to install, but I guess they just want to make sure people get it right.

 

 

If you notice in the picture in the instruction, they also include some "blue thread locker". I thought that was a nice touch.

 

Installation was pretty straight forward. You place the bottom FHG on the barrel, then place the clamp on top, then screw the clamp with the provided screws. Next you place the top rail on, and clamp it down. I'm sure you also noticed in the pictures, I installed the Dinzag bolt on FHG retainer. I don't think you need it, but it gives a more polished look.

 

Enough talk, on with the pics.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I should be taking it out to the range within the next 2 days to give it a run.

 

Looks damn good!

 

One question, is it possible to only mount the lower tri-rail? Or does the top rail need to be mounted to, for it all to attach to the gun?

[kyro74 1]

By the looks of the instructions there are legs sticking up for the screws to mount into. Doesn't look like you can use one or the other, need both to stay on.

[Moe Zambeak 53]

You can install only the tri-rail if you wanted, but the top of the clamp with the holes for the top would be exposed.

 

I'm starting to really regret not taking pictures as I went along, LOL!

 

The bottom of the clamp has little ridges that run perpendicular with the barrel. These ridges mate up with the ridges in the barrel and prevent it from sliding forward once clamped down. It seems like a really solid design.

[22_Shooter 1,560]

You can install only the tri-rail if you wanted, but the top of the clamp with the holes for the top would be exposed.

 

I'm starting to really regret not taking pictures as I went along, LOL!

 

The bottom of the clamp has little ridges that run perpendicular with the barrel. These ridges mate up with the ridges in the barrel and prevent it from sliding forward once clamped down. It seems like a really solid design.

 

Awesome, thanks for the info.

 

[Moe Zambeak 53]

Today was the first range day. I gotta say, this baby held up strong. It didn't budge through the 30 rounds I fired. I'm really happy with it so far. I will probably going to the range again next week and put many more rounds through it. I'll be sure to keep you guys posted on how it holds up!

[bigsal 757]

I still don't get why there is this hate for UTG. Isn't this a piece of aluminum with rails that screws onto the front to hold accessories? I can see it as a potential alternative to the UTG rail if you need another part for your 922r count or you don't like the length of the UTG rail, but this will need a handguard retainer or else it will only be held in place by friction on the gas tube (which will also need to be replaced). The first time you shoot your rifle without a handguard retainer this rail system will most definitely move forward. So your $80 (on sale) part will cost about $200 when all is said and done. I am completely happy with my UTG rail. It fits precisely and is rock solid. Otherwise, it is nice to see another option out there.

 

There is a huge thread about this, I'll sum it up for you:

If you're an American and you buy a Chinese made product over a comparable American made product, you're basically selling out to Communism. This goes doubly for people who claim to be Republicans and/or Right-Wing (with the exception of possibly purist Libertarians) AND infinitely so for people who claim to be Patriots. The biggest fraud is seeing cars parked at Walmart (where nearly 95% of the products are made in China) with McCain/Palin, Pro-American, and/or Troop Support bumper stickers; one can say they support all of that, but they sell out all of their beliefs when they turn around and shop there.

 

It drives me up the wall every time people say, go buy some Winchester ammo at Walmart, every time, I think.. "Get a fucking clue, for Christ's sake!"

 

If I saw two pair of boots the first costing $100 and Made in China, the second costing $300 and Made in the USA, even if they looked the same, I'd pay the extra for my money to stay in my country. The reasons behind this are: 1. the product made in the USA is more likely to be of higher quality, I've seen it time and time again, 2. more of the money stays in the country and possibly my state, 3. the support is better if I have questions about the product, I can call the company and generally talk to an American, not "Heeloo mai neem is Roobert Smiiith, hoow mei ei elp yoo todee?", 4. many many other reasons, which I don't feel like going over again and again.

 

Buy American products or go get a Chinese flag and wave that!

 

Bingo. I agree with all of that except I don't think you need to be a right-winger to want to buy American. I am probably the most leftist guy you'll meet (on a gun board anyway) and I try to stay clear of products made by slave labor.

Hell, since we are talking about rails we really should be talking about Ultimak (produced here in my native Moscow, Idaho), and not the UTG crap that does not allow co-witness. I have the same issues with Midwest Industries new rail, but at least they are made here stateside (also they are a heck of a lot better designed than the UTG crap).

 

UGH, this again? BigSal, we get it, you don't like the UTG rail. But the hypocrisy of demanding "buy American" for a foreign rifle is baffling. I support local businesses, all sell things that are made overseas. It is the state of the world today. To say that anything that was not manufactured in the USA is made by slave labor is incredibly ignorant. I am not sure if you have ever been anywhere else, but people that have never traveled outside of the United States have a very skewed view of reality as it pertains to the rest of the world. You should go through your house and remove everything that wasn't made in the USA from USA manufactured parts from USA native raw materials in which no money from your purchase has gone to a foreign company or its subsidiary. Your house will be empty.

Find me one, just one, UTG owner that has anything bad to say. I did tons of research and could not come up with anything but people like you that just hated it to hate it. The truth is that it is the ONLY option for a Saiga specific front rail system (metal) that is below $200 (I paid $79.00). A POSP mounted via the side mount will still allow for the use of ironsights with the UTG installed. Why this undying obsession for the Ultimak co-witness? I could not care less because I think the side rail mount is a superior option for mounting optics. The rail system in this thread looks good and is a somewhat reasonable option to someone that wants a FHG/Quad Rail setup. It needs some extra work since it is NOT Saiga specific, and it will cost about double what the UTG costs. But as an option, it seems like it may work

 

I am not trying to call you out bro, because I know your new to guns, but I don't think you know what co-witness means if you think it can be achieved with a side-mounted POSP scope.

[kyro74 1]

I still don't get why there is this hate for UTG. Isn't this a piece of aluminum with rails that screws onto the front to hold accessories? I can see it as a potential alternative to the UTG rail if you need another part for your 922r count or you don't like the length of the UTG rail, but this will need a handguard retainer or else it will only be held in place by friction on the gas tube (which will also need to be replaced). The first time you shoot your rifle without a handguard retainer this rail system will most definitely move forward. So your $80 (on sale) part will cost about $200 when all is said and done. I am completely happy with my UTG rail. It fits precisely and is rock solid. Otherwise, it is nice to see another option out there.

 

There is a huge thread about this, I'll sum it up for you:

If you're an American and you buy a Chinese made product over a comparable American made product, you're basically selling out to Communism. This goes doubly for people who claim to be Republicans and/or Right-Wing (with the exception of possibly purist Libertarians) AND infinitely so for people who claim to be Patriots. The biggest fraud is seeing cars parked at Walmart (where nearly 95% of the products are made in China) with McCain/Palin, Pro-American, and/or Troop Support bumper stickers; one can say they support all of that, but they sell out all of their beliefs when they turn around and shop there.

 

It drives me up the wall every time people say, go buy some Winchester ammo at Walmart, every time, I think.. "Get a fucking clue, for Christ's sake!"

 

If I saw two pair of boots the first costing $100 and Made in China, the second costing $300 and Made in the USA, even if they looked the same, I'd pay the extra for my money to stay in my country. The reasons behind this are: 1. the product made in the USA is more likely to be of higher quality, I've seen it time and time again, 2. more of the money stays in the country and possibly my state, 3. the support is better if I have questions about the product, I can call the company and generally talk to an American, not "Heeloo mai neem is Roobert Smiiith, hoow mei ei elp yoo todee?", 4. many many other reasons, which I don't feel like going over again and again.

 

Buy American products or go get a Chinese flag and wave that!

 

Bingo. I agree with all of that except I don't think you need to be a right-winger to want to buy American. I am probably the most leftist guy you'll meet (on a gun board anyway) and I try to stay clear of products made by slave labor.

Hell, since we are talking about rails we really should be talking about Ultimak (produced here in my native Moscow, Idaho), and not the UTG crap that does not allow co-witness. I have the same issues with Midwest Industries new rail, but at least they are made here stateside (also they are a heck of a lot better designed than the UTG crap).

 

UGH, this again? BigSal, we get it, you don't like the UTG rail. But the hypocrisy of demanding "buy American" for a foreign rifle is baffling. I support local businesses, all sell things that are made overseas. It is the state of the world today. To say that anything that was not manufactured in the USA is made by slave labor is incredibly ignorant. I am not sure if you have ever been anywhere else, but people that have never traveled outside of the United States have a very skewed view of reality as it pertains to the rest of the world. You should go through your house and remove everything that wasn't made in the USA from USA manufactured parts from USA native raw materials in which no money from your purchase has gone to a foreign company or its subsidiary. Your house will be empty.

Find me one, just one, UTG owner that has anything bad to say. I did tons of research and could not come up with anything but people like you that just hated it to hate it. The truth is that it is the ONLY option for a Saiga specific front rail system (metal) that is below $200 (I paid $79.00). A POSP mounted via the side mount will still allow for the use of ironsights with the UTG installed. Why this undying obsession for the Ultimak co-witness? I could not care less because I think the side rail mount is a superior option for mounting optics. The rail system in this thread looks good and is a somewhat reasonable option to someone that wants a FHG/Quad Rail setup. It needs some extra work since it is NOT Saiga specific, and it will cost about double what the UTG costs. But as an option, it seems like it may work

 

I am not trying to call you out bro, because I know your new to guns, but I don't think you know what co-witness means if you think it can be achieved with a side-mounted POSP scope.

 

I am well aware of what co-witness means. It means being able to see your iron sights through your non-magnified red dot optic so, in case of battery failure, you can still use the irons without having to remove the optic. The same effect can be achieved by simply lowering your sight line by 1/2" to see your irons below a POSP or a you do the same by looking below standard height side mount to weaver mount from Kalinka. You go on and on about being able to cowitness with an ultimak, my point is that most people don't really care. You are limited to a scout style mount and a very narrow selection of optics for it to work correctly. The worst case is you use the "quick" aspect of the quick release side mount and ditch the optic. The irons can be used with the UTG quad rail.

 

I suspect that you understood exactly what I was saying but had no response to any of the points that I had brought up with you so you just threw up something and hoped that it might make you look like you had any idea what you were talking about.

 

Not trying to call you out though bro, I know you're new to guns.

[quikz 1]

I still don't get why there is this hate for UTG. Isn't this a piece of aluminum with rails that screws onto the front to hold accessories? I can see it as a potential alternative to the UTG rail if you need another part for your 922r count or you don't like the length of the UTG rail, but this will need a handguard retainer or else it will only be held in place by friction on the gas tube (which will also need to be replaced). The first time you shoot your rifle without a handguard retainer this rail system will most definitely move forward. So your $80 (on sale) part will cost about $200 when all is said and done. I am completely happy with my UTG rail. It fits precisely and is rock solid. Otherwise, it is nice to see another option out there.

 

 

COMPLETELY AGREE.