AR magazine adapter review

[christcorp 26]

Just a short note/review. I picked up an AR .223 magazine adapter, 2nd hand, made by Renegadebuck a few weeks back. I shot a few mags through it back then, but I wasn't ready to really test it until the last 2 days. I had some issues with the rifle I had to take care of first. Bottom line: It is a fantastic adapter. I went through 15 different magazines, with between 20-30 rounds in each. Roughly 350-400 rounds of mixed ammo. Mostly Tula steel core. Some Hearders Hollow Point. Some Fiocchi Soft Point. And some Military surplus 5.56. In all those rounds, I didn't have one feeding or ejection problem. Adapter stayed firm and solid on the gun. All magazines remained firm inside the adapter. And I also removed the adapter, (2 seconds), and put in one of my Saiga .223 magazines in and fired a mag full of ammo. Again, flawlessly. I then put the adapter back on. (2 seconds). And finished my testing. I know some people were interested in these adapters. I just wanted to say that I couldn't be more pleased. Thanks Renegade.

[christcorp 26]

Just an update. I had a handful of magazines that had issues. These were not part of the 15 that I tested in my review. These had feeding problems ONLY with the last 2 rounds in the magazine. Wasn't sure if the Renegadebuck adapter simply didn't like these magazines, or if the mags had problems. I got a good deal on Magpul III followers. I replaced the followers in the 5 questionable magazines. I fired them last night with 30 rounds in each. The Renegadbuck AR/Saiga adapter and the saiga worked flawlessly. All my magazine now work as they are suppose to. Great job on the renegadebuck adapter.

 

On a side note, many people forget that AR15 magazines, especially mil surpluse, have had their own critics throughout the years. Whether through an AR15 rifle or an adapter we are using such as the Renegadebuck or MSA. Many times, the problem is the magazine. I've had this issue with my AR-15 before. Can't stress enough having a good follower. Simetimes even a new spring.

[Falcon09 22]

Did you have to do any modifications to the rifle to use the Renegadebuck adapter?

[christcorp 26]

Yes, but it isn't that much. It can be done with a dremmel. The only modification is to allow an AR magazine to fit all the way up. Once you have the adapter and you try putting in the AR magazine, you see immediately what needs to be done. The adapter itself doesn't require any modification. It snaps in just like a magazine would. And the amount needed to be ground for the magazine to go deeper can be done in less than an hour with a dremmel. And as quick as it is to pull out the adapter, (Same as removing a magazine, about 2 seconds), you can use the original saiga magazines again too if you wanted to. I'm quite pleased with it.

[Falcon09 22]

Thanks

[avatar 4]

If you use a dremmel DO NOT OVERHEAT the steel in that locking lug and only remove as much metal a you have to get the mag to lock in.

[christcorp 26]

If you use a dremmel DO NOT OVERHEAT the steel in that locking lug and only remove as much metal a you have to get the mag to lock in.

When you say "Locking Lug", are you speaking of the LEFT side of the trunnion (Looking down the barrel), where the bolt slides between it? The dremmeling (If that's a word) that I did, was from the bottom up. Bottom, as in where the magazine makes first contact. I saw no possible problem with a locking lug.

 

I do agree with you however about only removing as much is necessary. Taking too much out can cause a sloppy seating for the magazine, which could cause feeding issues. With the Renegadebuck adapter on the rifle, and the top cover, spring, bolt, and gas tube removed; and an AR15 magazine put in as far as it will go, you will see exactly what needs to be ground.

 

FWIW: Renegadebuck includes a very accurate set of instructions. As does MSA I'm sure; but I can only give my review of the one I've used. I couldn't be more pleased. And once I replaced a couple of Magazine followers (Old magazine issues, NOT RELATED to the Renegadebuck adapter); I went out and shot 300+ rounds, multiple manufacturers of ammo, in 15 different individual magazines, without 1 feeding or ejection problem. I even ran a couple original magazines through it without issues either.

[swells08 128]

If you use a dremmel DO NOT OVERHEAT the steel in that locking lug and only remove as much metal a you have to get the mag to lock in.

When you say "Locking Lug", are you speaking of the LEFT side of the trunnion (Looking down the barrel), where the bolt slides between it? The dremmeling (If that's a word) that I did, was from the bottom up. Bottom, as in where the magazine makes first contact. I saw no possible problem with a locking lug.

 

I do agree with you however about only removing as much is necessary. Taking too much out can cause a sloppy seating for the magazine, which could cause feeding issues. With the Renegadebuck adapter on the rifle, and the top cover, spring, bolt, and gas tube removed; and an AR15 magazine put in as far as it will go, you will see exactly what needs to be ground.

 

FWIW: Renegadebuck includes a very accurate set of instructions. As does MSA I'm sure; but I can only give my review of the one I've used. I couldn't be more pleased. And once I replaced a couple of Magazine followers (Old magazine issues, NOT RELATED to the Renegadebuck adapter); I went out and shot 300+ rounds, multiple manufacturers of ammo, in 15 different individual magazines, without 1 feeding or ejection problem. I even ran a couple original magazines through it without issues either.

So do/did you have your bullet guide installed during these tests? Renegadebuck adapter ar-15 mag bullet guide...then modified saiga or pro mag with feed lip removed...and bullet guide.

[leadslinger 37]

Thanks for the review. I was going to buy one from renegadebuck but i backed out once i saw the thread about the guy who broke his trunnion. I am familiar with dremel and AK builds but that really spoked me. I have to say that renegadebuck was a perfect gentleman refunding my prepay with no issues. If i ever get the nerve up to do this mod his will be the one I use. thanks again pics would be great.

[christcorp 26]

DJ; I never installed a bullet guide. In the beginning, I used traditional OEM and Surefire magazines. These have a front end that ramps the bullet up. Then, I added some Pro-Mag magazines, which also has a high front for ramping the bullet. However, they are TOO HIGH and tend to snap off. I, and others, posted numerous instructions and reviews on how to trim down slightly the guide on the Pro-mag magazines, and they work Flawlessly.

 

When I went to using the Renegadebuck AR/Saiga magazine adapter, I don't use a bullet guide at all. There is no need to. The shape of an AR15 magazines has the bullet coming straight ahead and off the magazine. The magazine rides a little higher, and is perfectly in line with the chamber. Goes in straight ahead. A bullet guide is not required. If you already put a bullet guide on, because of using other magazines, it "Can" still work with the Renegadebuck adapter. Looking at my rifle, with the Renegadebuck adapter on, an empty magazine in, and the bolt locked back, I can see enough of a gap, that an installed bullet guide shouldn't hit the AR15 magazine. I believe there is only about 1/8" of overhang with a Dinzag bullet guide. There appears to be more than that much of a gap with the AR15 magazine. The OEM/Surefire has the HUMP (Attached Bullet guide) on their magazines, and it sits forward more than an AR or even a Pro-Mag. That's why those don't work with a Dinzag bullet guide.

 

Now having owned 5 AK-47 variations, one thing I am sure of is: Quality Assurance is not the greatest attribute of these rifles. And maybe that's why they are built so loose, and thus almost indestructible when firing. As such, when it comes to mechanical alterations and fitting, it is not uncommon for one AK to require a slightly different amount of modifying than another.

 

Leadslinger; I am not 100% positive, but I am pretty sure than the individual who tore up his trunnion, didn't have a Renegadebuck adapter. Having said that, I find it pretty difficult to screw up the trunnion if you have the adapter in hand, mount it, and look at what needs to be worked. It isn't rocket science. There have been other adapters available over the years; not just the 2 currently on the market. I am not sure what modifications and machining were required on any of the others. But the filing/grinding required for the Renegadebuck adapter to work, is very simple and straight forward.

[Cobra 76 two 2,677]

FYI the gentleman who had the problem with the cracked trunnion did indeed do it after installing the R.B. adapter. I know because he loaned it to me and it's the one in those pics I posted in the other thread.

[christcorp 26]

Thanks for the Info Cobra. Thing is; whether it's the Renegadebuck adapter, or the MSA by Nate, both seem very straight forward in the amount of grinding needed. It isn't rocket science. For a person to have screwed up a trunnion as bad as that; (It's been months since I've seen the pictures), they either tried doing it by anticipating what they needed to do. "In other words, they didn't have the adapter in hand and was guestimating". Or, they really have little to no mechanical skills. Like I said, with the renegadebuck that I use, and the instructions Nate provided for the MSA adapter, it's pretty simple. With the rifle field stripped, put adapter on, TRY to insert AR15 magazine. Notice that it doesn't go all the way in. See where it stops. Realize what you need to grind and grind. Do a little at a time. Repeat process until the magazine locks into place in the adapter and seats firmly to the rail. Stir briskly and serve over ice. It really is pretty easy. Either adapter you choose.

[admbleg 35]

Thanks for the Info Cobra. Thing is; whether it's the Renegadebuck adapter, or the MSA by Nate, both seem very straight forward in the amount of grinding needed. It isn't rocket science. For a person to have screwed up a trunnion as bad as that; (It's been months since I've seen the pictures), they either tried doing it by anticipating what they needed to do. "In other words, they didn't have the adapter in hand and was guestimating". Or, they really have little to no mechanical skills. Like I said, with the renegadebuck that I use, and the instructions Nate provided for the MSA adapter, it's pretty simple. With the rifle field stripped, put adapter on, TRY to insert AR15 magazine. Notice that it doesn't go all the way in. See where it stops. Realize what you need to grind and grind. Do a little at a time. Repeat process until the magazine locks into place in the adapter and seats firmly to the rail. Stir briskly and serve over ice. It really is pretty easy. Either adapter you choose.

 

Well when I began reading this thread I was pretty calm... Then I came across your response to Cobras comments above.

 

Let me clairify a few things. .. I'm not some douche with no mechanical skills... I am the one that had the cracked trunnion... I had the adapter in hand. I had three mags to place inside the mag well to check fit as I ground down the areas. The Renegade Adapter wouldn't even fit when I first got it. I had to grind down part of the adapter where it meets the mag catch.

 

After finally getting mags to drop free, and paying closer attention to the RB adapter was uneven on the top edge resulting in a uneven fit to the receiver.

 

The spring was crap mags would drop or cause them to slightly pull out(When holding the magwell). resulting in a FTF. To correct this I used an old 50cal spring I cut in half to provide enough hold on mags.

 

I could go on... but Im pissed and yeah its my fault my trunnion broke because I removed to much to allow mags to drop free after installing a PIECE of Shit Adapter.... That was built..... I better stop.

 

Anyways I am glad Renegade Buck came up with the adapter, and I know he has corrected some of the bad adapters that got sent out.

 

 

Ok...after I cooled down sorry if I came across alittle to strong

Edited October 6, 2010 by RLTW

[christcorp 26]

RLTW. I had no intention of upsetting you. I've owned many AK-47 variations over the years. I have to say, that while they are definitely reliable guns, they are about the "LEAST" quality controlled guns I've ever seen. Usually, it's the tolerances that tend to be way off. I had a Romanian 7.62x39 that wouldn't fit a standard magazine. The mag well was shifted some how. If the magazine catch would work and hold the magazine in place, then it wouldn't feed at all. I had a Maadi that wouldn't go 100% into battery, and rarely extracted properly. I had to replace 7 individual pieces on that.

 

I only bring this up because I would think that with the inside of the trunnion cracking, like in your pictures, that I would almost be willing to bet that it probably would have cracked after some extensive use, even without the AR adapter and modification. Except where the bolt rolls around the left side of the trunnion, and the part being grounded, there is very little stress on the rest of that section of the trunnion.

 

As for the adapter not fitting into the gun, mine slipped right in, like it was a magazine. No adjustments required at all. Yes, the Paddle button was a little tight on holding the adapter on, but after putting the adapter on 2-3 times, it fit and snapped into place, just like an OEM magazine. Again, I have seen way to many quality control tolerance issues with AK style weapons. I was actually very apprehensive about buying another AK style weapon. My memory isn't what it use to be, but I know I've had 6 AK rifles; possibly a 7th. Can't remember. And each of them, i sold usually within a year because of something about it I didn't like. Mainly the ergonomics. The only reason I decided to take another chance on the saiga, was because I could get it in .223 and I liked the feel of the trigger assembly being further back. (That's why I WON'T do a full conversion. I HATE the ergonomics of an AK trigger vs hand guard handling. I like the trigger assembly that extra couple inches back).

 

Anyway, it's been fine. I used a dremel on the nubs inside the trunnion. I've shot around 1500 rounds using the AR15 adapter. Prior and since the adapter, I shot about 500 rounds using the standard OEM magazine, as well as the Surefires and Pro-mags. No issues so far. And to be honest, I am the WORST/sloppiest when it comes to doing this type of work. I know how to, but I don't have the type of tools to do a "professional" job. I'm an electronic engineer. Definitely not a gunsmith. But, the magazines fit inside the adapter firmly, feed straight, ejects fine, and shoots accurately. Same with the adapter out and the OEM/Surefire/Promags installed.

[admbleg 35]

No maj...

 

Got to Luv these guns regardless...

 

Have a good one.