S-.308 over a FN/FAL?

[finlander 3]

yes, it does. Standard AK cover.

 

You could just get a low-rise side rail mount - and a screw-on aperture site - will be much much more stable and the zero won't wander like a cover mounted one will. The cover is just held in place by spring pressure... that would allow you to install a scope too if desired.

 

Speaking of hunting - do you hunt afoot or from a stand? Moose?

 

I bet some good Lapua hunting ammo would shoot even smaller groups for you.

 

Thought about that side rail too but don't really like the looks of the rifle that way. More stable it would be than cover mounted, for sure.

 

Yep, moose hunting it is going to be. Have been hunting small game mainly but this or next year I'm going to participate in moose hunt.

 

Well, you may want to try a rear-sight replacement with a windage-adjustable aperture sight. I would rather the aperture be closer to my eye, but others like them.

 

And when moose hunting, do you drive the moose and hunt on foot? Or do you hunt from a stand (tower, box blind, etc.)?

 

Oh, also - you state that you can only have two rounds - do you have to block the magazine so it will not accept more than one round?

 

Just curious.

 

Dogs drive the moose and hunters stay on certain positions waiting for the moose. Few decades ago it was common that other hunters drove the moose and others then waited but nowadays it's that dogs drive and men wait.

 

We have to block the magazine so it doesn't take more than two rounds. It's 2+1 as there can be a round in chamber.

[O.S.O.K. 0]

Ah, I see - probably safer to have the dogs do the driving! And you will be shooting at a moving target. That's what I was wondering about. A red-dot would be nice for that! Especially if its early in the morning or late in evening in low light.

[DaGroaner 2]

Screw the conversion just get the orginal 16" barreled saiga with the skeleton stock. They are really neat plus they look and feel great too and they come new that way from russia.

 

I have to respectfully disagree. In the first place you're really not converting the gun, you're unconverting it and returning it to it's normal configuration. Proof of that fact is that you have to remove that added piece of sheet metal on the bottom of the receiver. They only come that way from Russia because the US Gov't forced them to add that crap. Secondly the improvement in the trigger pull alone is worth doing the conversion. Lastly if you think one the Saiga feels great as imported wait until you handle one in it's proper configuration. There is simply no comparison.

[O.S.O.K. 0]

Screw the conversion just get the orginal 16" barreled saiga with the skeleton stock. They are really neat plus they look and feel great too and they come new that way from russia.

 

I have to respectfully disagree. In the first place you're really not converting the gun, you're unconverting it and returning it to it's normal configuration. Proof of that fact is that you have to remove that added piece of sheet metal on the bottom of the receiver. They only come that way from Russia because the US Gov't forced them to add that crap. Secondly the improvement in the trigger pull alone is worth doing the conversion. Lastly if you think one the Saiga feels great as imported wait until you handle one in it's proper configuration. There is simply no comparison.

 

I totally agree

[finlander 3]

I'm going to buy the diopter sight for Saiga there is one company that makes sights that fit the Ak based guns. Have to be welded to the receiver cover and that's why was asking if the AK receiver cover fits the Saiga you know as I don't want to fuck up the original cover. Let's see if I can show you how it would look. Saiga sights Scroll down the page it's near the top there should be image of Saiga rifle with those diopter sights I'm going to buy.

Edited July 16, 2006 by finlander

[Kyrinn 0]

Ah, I see - probably safer to have the dogs do the driving! And you will be shooting at a moving target. That's what I was wondering about. A red-dot would be nice for that! Especially if its early in the morning or late in evening in low light.

 

How old does a dog have to be to get his Driver's Licence?

& I imagine the Moose have Rack and pinion steering, neh?

[finlander 3]

I'll try to get some pics with diopter sight on the Saiga.

Edited July 19, 2006 by finlander

[NoAim 0]

NoAim does your Practical Rifle rules require a double tap with a 308? Most places consider one 308 hit sufficient to do the job. That is why I'm going to get a 308 this fall!

 

No. All rifle hits are 1 shot for long range.

 

A lot of the close range stuff is all double tab regardless of caliber.

 

They way we have it divided is:

 

Major Caliber (.308, etc.) or Minor Caliber (.223, 7.62x39, etc.)

Scoped (includes red-dot) or Irons

Woman, Senior, Tyro, etc.

 

However, in practice, all rifles shoot the exact same stages. No differences for major or minor.

 

But, they've just pulled .308 as an allowed caliber. The steel targets we've been using have to be tuned for the different impacts. A .223 seems to barely move it, a .308 slams it. When it gets slammed, the welds break.

 

We're looking at ways to keep the .308 in the game.

[O.S.O.K. 0]

Ah, I see - probably safer to have the dogs do the driving! And you will be shooting at a moving target. That's what I was wondering about. A red-dot would be nice for that! Especially if its early in the morning or late in evening in low light.

 

How old does a dog have to be to get his Driver's Licence?

& I imagine the Moose have Rack and pinion steering, neh?

 

Hmm, the canine would probably have to be at least 2.3 years old (16/7years) and the Moose also sport 4 hoof drive, so are pretty hard to catch up to! :lool:

[Messiah Jones 2]

I've been getting the itch to buy a .308 but want to hear some good auguments about why I should get an S-.308 over an FN. High capacity mags are available for the FN and to convert a S-.308 to a pistol/assault look will cost just under getting an FN.

 

I have both and love both. The mags are very cheap for the metric FAL... and cheap is a plus! The FAL is easy to field strip and can handle commercial .308WIN with no problem. The Saiga is all of this except for the magazine issue. I haven't found a cheap and easy way to convert a Saiga .308 to use high capacity mags. Maybe others here have?

 

That said, the Saiga has the advantage of being produced new, and by high quality standards in Russia. The FALs are usually kit builds done by US importers. Sometimes these small companies have issues with their builds, (although my "Century International Arms" FAL functions perfectly). Some people have had trouble with the earlier ones. The Saiga can also use most standard AK parts. If you break or lose some trigger part or gas piston or something, the market is flooded with parts for AKs.

 

It's a toss-up. They are both great rifles. I'm partial to AKs and happen to think the Saiga is the absolute best AK bang for the buck. Both the Kalashnikov and FAL designs have been proven to be absolutely reliable in the worst conditions. Both are easy to mount a scope on. The Saiga is lighter. The FAL will probably be worth more in the future when the kits dry up. ...you have to decide what matters the most to you.

[finlander 3]

 

It ain't perfectly aligned but that doesn't matter.

 

 

The cover (chinese made) fits now real tight, needs a rubber mallet or something to get the cover retainer thinggy in, practically no movement. Of course the cover and so the sight will loosen over time, but this is kind of test, wants to see if the sight mounted on cover can work. Well it works on Sako rifles. Someone stated the Sako receiver covers are hardened maybe that matters who knows.

 

Wasn't able to shoot at 100 range, got a 3", 15shot, group from not so good rest at 50m with south african surplus.

 

And I really like the peep sights over the standard AK sights, sight picture and so on.

Edited August 18, 2006 by finlander

[finlander 3]

Went to the 100m range today, Lapua Trainer 124gr was about 4" 5 shots. Lapua Scenar 155gr 1 1/2" with 3 shots, wow! Group I got with Scenar may be luck, shot only one group with it. Next time I'll shoot only Scenar and see if my luck continues.

[chapperjoe 0]

...

 

there's NO physical way the cover isn't moving. ALOT. the hope is that the tightness means it returns to the same place when the commotion ends. Don't fool yourslef into thinking andy of these sheet0metal receiver covers are stable, be it AK, galil, valmet etc. That's not to say they aren't accurate and dependble - but don't say no movement till you have someone record you shooting with high speed camera and then watch your 'tight' receiver cover in slo-mo.

 

for what its worth, I'm probably going with the tromix HK style sights and those are dust cover (that's all the cover is really) mounted too.

 

in term sof the FAL SAiga argument. I say without hesitation that the saiga I got back from tony is FAR superior to the fal - as a rifle e.g. not withstadning price - save balance and the last round bolt hold open.

 

the 22" saiga I have is very forward heavy with the balance point near the rear of the handguards. and I guess as a red blooded american, I miss the bolt hold open.

 

I had to fals - my first foray into 308. a 400$ centruy SLR and a 2200$ DSA SA58 with EVERYTHING .

 

I found them to be heavy, couldn't get the mag loading motion down to where I could do it blind, and just never trusted the tilt locking system. In their favor, they are VERY well balanced and shoulder naturally.

 

I can't explain why, but I only own, buy and shoot rotary locking guns. tilt locking gives me the hebbegeebees.

[finlander 3]

there's NO physical way the cover isn't moving. ALOT. the hope is that the tightness means it returns to the same place when the commotion ends. Don't fool yourslef into thinking andy of these sheet0metal receiver covers are stable, be it AK, galil, valmet etc. That's not to say they aren't accurate and dependble - but don't say no movement till you have someone record you shooting with high speed camera and then watch your 'tight' receiver cover in slo-mo.

 

You are absolutely right there. No mevement is when I try to move it by hand, and I would still call it tight, be it tight when compared to standard AK cover. Everything's relative. If speaking in absolute terms it sure ain't tight. Whatever.

 

I'd like to see pic of HK sights on Saiga.

Edited August 20, 2006 by finlander

[Burboy 0]

HK sights on a Saiga

 

Tromix will make'm any way you want.

Check out the 8" S-12.

[finlander 3]

Any thoughts why it is so that in five shot groups there are three or four shots in 1-2" but the fifth shot is down and spreads the group to 4"? Barrel heating? Three shot groups are great, five shot not.

 

Is it normal that with different ammo the POI is different horizontally? Vertical difference I understand but horizontal?

[G O B 3,516]

The horizontal movement is generally the shooter's reaction to different louds. I seem to shoot to the right with heavier loads.

[kresk 10,063]

Any thoughts why it is so that in five shot groups there are three or four shots in 1-2" but the fifth shot is down and spreads the group to 4"? Barrel heating? Three shot groups are great, five shot not.

 

Is it normal that with different ammo the POI is different horizontally? Vertical difference I understand but horizontal?

It was explained to me that with barrel heating the shot may be off in any direction depending on the thermally induced barrel deformity of the individual gun.