.223 M

[coyotewillie 0]

Is the receiver on the black stock M identical to regular Saiga? I got the tapco T6 and now I'm worried it won't fit. I hope surefire mags fit also.

 

 

The receiver is the same as far as I can tell. The only difference I can see is in the triggers. The "M" has an elongated trigger which pivots off the hammer pin (I think thats the best way to describe it) and doesn't have the 2 rearward trigger and linkage pins that my 16" has. Of course, that part of the receiver is different I guess where its not drilled for the 2 pins. But, the rear of the receiver is a straight type, not slanted. Greg

[cma g21 3]

Which one did you order? The plastic stock versions (from the photos posted) has the same trigger set up as the regular Saiga.223 with the trigger moved to the rear. The wooden version shows the trigger moved forward behind the mag release. These are very similar to the Norinco Hunter except the Norinco also has the trigger set in the wrong place.

 

The plastic stocked model I bought (.223) has the same trigger setup as the normal Saiga 308, and not the same as the normal Saiga .223 or 7.62x39 models.

[dave43 0]

Which one did you order? The plastic stock versions (from the photos posted) has the same trigger set up as the regular Saiga.223 with the trigger moved to the rear. The wooden version shows the trigger moved forward behind the mag release. These are very similar to the Norinco Hunter except the Norinco also has the trigger set in the wrong place.

 

The plastic stocked model I bought (.223) has the same trigger setup as the normal Saiga 308, and not the same as the normal Saiga .223 or 7.62x39 models.

 

Is it a better trigger then the regular 223?

[second shooter 22]

Here is my .223 m, it came with a longer barrel but i cut it back as short as the law allows.the other is a factory vepr in 762x39

[bkbville 0]

Picked up mine this am from the dealer. I measured the thickness of the sidewall of the receiver and compared it to my 16" that I had. No difference in thickness there. Everything posted has said that the receivers are supposed to be heavier...don't know where, but mine isn't. Love it tho! Might just convert the 16" and leave this one as it is. Actually has a better trigger pull than the 16" has. Greg

 

 

Anyone have shooting reports?

 

I'm wondering how it does with the 21" barrel.

 

How is the trigger overall? Is it something that would really need to go anyway? Or could it be adequate?

 

I'm not sure if I want to pick this one up or not. On the one hand I wouldn't mind waiting for another batch of x39's to show up - leverge my ammo and mag investments further. on the other if it shoots as well as it looks I might put my next unemployment check toward it.

 

I guess I wish someone could talk me into why .223 ...

 

esp since I would need pre-ban .223 AK mags where I live...

 

Can it touch my AR15 shooting .223?

[imarangemaster 315]

Well, my .223 Saiga out-shot my M4 off hand, and its trigger pull, while long, breaks better than my DPMS. When they ban import of Military calibers like 7.62x39 and 5.45x39, they will get expensive to shoot, but .223 will be readily available and cheaper to re-load. That's why I picked up the .223 Saiga

[imarangemaster 315]

Ugh, listen to me! I am starting to sound like "a prophet for the one, true path of the .223 Saiga." :unsure:

 

Sorry about that guys, but I just love my new toy!

[Paulry 50]

Don't make excuses, that's why I bought the .223 as well.

 

As well as the 7.62x39

 

Frosty

[dave43 0]

Are the barrels the same as the original? I wonder if it will shoot 5.56 with no problems.

[Fett 0]

Are the barrels the same as the original? I wonder if it will shoot 5.56 with no problems.

 

According to Izhmash and many first hand users, yes, it will take the 5.56 all day long. (I have not shot any through mine though.) I'm not sure about the barrel, but I think it is the same.

[cma g21 3]

...I'm not sure about the barrel, but I think it is the same.

 

The Saiga-M barrel appears to be slightly longer.

 

RAA lists the barrels as 16.3 and 20.49 inches for the Saiga .223's:

http://www.raacfirearms.com/Saiga.htm

 

The Saiga-M in .223 barrel appears to be 21.8 inches:

http://www.centerfiresystems.com/saiga223m...artsai-b-1.aspx

[scoutjoe 276]

I got to handle a couple of the .223 and x39 versions, all were 20" or so barrels (didn't take a tape measure with me).

 

Fit and finish was much better, I really liked the way the wood grip felt in my hands. Dang me being unemployed or I would of been all over at least the x39 version maybe the .223 one also.

 

If anybody is in Western Pennsyltucky and wants one let me know I'll give ya the shop info where they are on the wall.

[cma g21 3]

I got to handle a couple of the .223 and x39 versions, all were 20" or so barrels (didn't take a tape measure with me).

 

I just measured my Saiga-M .223 using the BATFE method (using a rod inserted in the barrel with the bolt forward).

It is approximately 21.8". I used the cleaning rod that came with the rifle.

I don't have a standard Saiga .223 to measure; perhaps someone that does can measure theirs.

[dave43 0]

What is the twist ratio in these barrels?

[pickles 0]

So..can anyone tell me if I'll be able to use a standard AK pistol grip set on one of these with 0% modification?

[kiwi** 0]

What is the twist ratio in these barrels?

Hi My 223 is the same rifle and the barrel twist is 1-9 and favours the 60gr hornady GR HP Bullets and groups a times around 5/8 at 100metres with 23.5gr of adi 2206 powder .

Also loaded up some sierras 63gr semi point with same powder but 24grs works good also. The screw tension holding on the forearm also makes a difference to groups.

Hope this helps. Regards Kiwi**

Edited January 22, 2009 by kiwi**

[cma g21 3]

So..can anyone tell me if I'll be able to use a standard AK pistol grip set on one of these with 0% modification?

 

Will it fit? Yes (if it's made for an AK with a stamped receiver).

 

Would it be 922r compliant (replacing only buttstock and adding pistol grip)? Maybe.

If you use a US made butt stock and pistol grip, you'd be compliant with US made magazines only (not with foreign magazines, including the one that came with the rifle).

If you use foreign made butt stock and/or pistol grip, you'd be out of compliance with any magazine.

 

Edited to add: the AK forends will not fit without modifications or part replacements/additions.

Edited January 22, 2009 by cma g21

[pickles 0]

So if I was to swap one part for compliance, and use only US mags, I'd be good. OK. My next question is, if I put the stock mag in to use for mid size game hunting(I'd rather not carry around 20+ rounds that are just gonna get in the way), is that illegal? It's back to a "sporting" configuration, so 922 is out the window right?

[pickles 0]

Can anybody tell me if the promag 223 AK mags will fit? or do i need saiga specific mags?

[cma g21 3]

Can anybody tell me if the promag 223 AK mags will fit? or do i need saiga specific mags?

 

ProMag makes a Saiga specific magazine. So does Surefire

 

To use an AK magazine will require some alterations to the gun and/or magazine.

 

Unfortunately, unlike 7.62x39mm, there's really no standard .223 (5.56x45mm) AK magazine. There are some dimensional differences that need to be addressed. You'll likely need a bullet guide as well.

 

If you decide to go with the Saiga ProMags, I really recommend buying just one to try out before buying any more. I've yet to have a polymer ProMag function in any rifle without some tweaking, and I don't trust them except as range mags. YMMV.

 

I've had no experience with the Surefires in .223, but going by the Saiga 308 Surfires, I'd expect them to be better than the Promags. Again, YMMV.

 

Depending on how many magazines you want to have, you may be better off getting the MSA AR mag adapter.

[cma g21 3]

So if I was to swap one part for compliance, and use only US mags, I'd be good. OK. My next question is, if I put the stock mag in to use for mid size game hunting(I'd rather not carry around 20+ rounds that are just gonna get in the way), is that illegal? It's back to a "sporting" configuration, so 922 is out the window right?

 

As long as you don't add a pistol grip. If you do, it's no longer 'sporting.'

 

There are some that disagree with this. But, the test for 922r applying is importability. That is, if your rifle is in a configuration in which it could be legally imported, 922r does not apply.

 

The idea that you can add a pistol grip to a Saiga and have 922r not apply (as long as you use low cap mags) makes no sense. If this were the case, RAA would be able to import the Saiga models with pistol grips that are sold in other countries.

Edited January 26, 2009 by cma g21

[Bean.223 365]

HEYA, rehashing this thread

 

WHERE THE HELL can I find one of these wooden thumbhole 223s????

 

I cant find a "M" anywhere???

 

THANX!!!

[Bean.223 365]

OK there is ONE on gunbroker