Help me out here....

[essohbe 47]

I already have a 7.62 rifle. I want my next to be either a 5.45 or a .223 and for a long time (and still) I am really set on the 5.45 caliber. I have fired a .223 and I like it, I have however not fired a 5.45 yet. I imagine them to be pretty much the same. I am used to medium and large calibers so this will be my smaller caliber auto-loading gun.

 

The biggest issue to me is price of ammo and future surplus availability for 5.45x39. It seems there's more involved with making a .223 Saiga work the way I want than there is with a 5.45 and ammo availability has been a concern, although there is enough people with 5.45s now in the US that domestic manufacturers are making it and I assume more will be making it in the future, especially if they can't import 5.45 for whatever reasons. The only reason I really want the 5.45 is for the dirt cheap surplus and it's wound balistics. That surplus will not last forever though, and when it's gone I am paying the same price (or more?) for .223 but for new production 5.45... uhgh...

 

I see the mag situation is kinda the same for both guns. AK 74 mags are easy to find and Bulgarian .223 ones can be had as well. Both rifles need a bullet guide, yes? But better yet the .223 Saiga can be modded to fit AR mags (pricey?) but the Saiga SureFire .223 seem to much to pay unless there's a bulk discount that puts them at the same range as the AK74 mags.

 

Now I'm veering back and forth and want to ask why did you all pick your .223s when you got them?

[Lashlarue 1]

No guarantees on 5.45 availability.Either us or the ruskies could get a hair up their butt and and we could ban importation or vice versa.It happened with Norinco, and no Chinese weapons or ammo have been imported for years.I got a 1260 round tin of 7.62x39 for $99 in 1990, copper washed, steel core.Not one failure of any kind, still kicking myself for not getting a Norinco 1911 for $279. Wilson Combat was using them as base guns for their custom builds.

[protected static 19]

In part, standardization: I already owned a .223 rifle.

[kresk 10,063]

To round out the collection.

[Hexus535 14]

It may sound crazy, but I grabbed the .223 as a survival type weapon. I figured that if I combined the legendary reliability of the AK platform with the huge availability of the .223 round State-side, it would make the perfect package. In case shit really hits the fan, the most common round you'd find laying around is .223/5.56 (i'm assuming you live in the USA and not actually Antarctica). Also, if you toss in that mag adapter, you can use one of the most common magazines around: AR mags. Also, thinking into the future, 5.56 is the NATO standard and there will be ammo for YEARS to come.

 

Plus, its really fun to shoot, and its nice being able to use the same ammo as everyone else, but have a totally different gun. Cheap too. 20rd boxes of Tula steel-cased non corrosive .223 are about $4.50. I bring it out to the range and people see it and think, "Oh cool, this guy's got a blacked/tact-ed out AK74", then they see the the mags and ammo I'm running and they are pretty surprised.

 

Get a .223, then later on down the road, build up an AKS-74U if you want a 5.45

[Paulry 50]

I agree with Hex and this is what I did.

Now own 3 5.45x39 and a number of .223.

 

Like them all!

 

[essohbe 47]

I agree with Hex and this is what I did.

Now own 3 5.45x39 and a number of .223.

 

You bastard, so that's where all the rifles went! Lol.

 

Damnit. I still don't know. It's come down to ammo. The .223 wasn't designed to be shot from a 16 inch barrel, so you loose efficiency. I don't want a 20" barrel Saiga and even though it's not a big deal, I'd rather have the 5.45 round which was designed to be fired at lower velocities from a shorter barrel. The fact that surplus is so cheap also has swayed me and the round shoots a bit flatter that 5.56 also.

 

Does the new production 5.45 (like Wolf or Hornady) maintain the same ballistics as the 7n6 (and the others) or is the hollow cavity and penetrators simply absent from the new ammo, thus making it less desirable?

[Hexus535 14]

I can only speculate on the performance of 5.45, because I don't own one. However, I've noticed that the heavier 62 gr fmj seems to shoot better because of this barrel short coming, but not as flat as 5.45.

 

I dont really plan to use my 5.56 at ranges beyond the point where that would come into effect. It sounds like you've already made up your mind, and in reality you are the only one how can make that call for yourself. My next rifle is definitely going to be 5.45 and I'm keeping it classic.

 

Also, the 5.45 is known as the "Poison Bullet" which is an awesome nick-name

[JK-47 33]

if you've got the money to buy a few tins of russian surplus, you won't need to worry about future availability. The 5.45 will probably be available in the wolf/bear/tula etc... commercial ammo at about the same price as steel cased .223 from now on. The surplus i here now and will be gone one day- no one knows when.

 

unless we stop importing ammo from russia altogether (in which case AK owners of all types are screwed) you should be fine with either. The .223 is still a lot easier to get stateside, but again, put a few tins away now you'll be fine.

 

P.S. 223 is more effective than 5.45 if it's going fast enough to fragment. Past that range it will still tumble, though its not specificaly made to tumble like the 5.45.

[essohbe 47]

P.S. 223 is more effective than 5.45 if it's going fast enough to fragment

 

I was thinking about that. Maybe shooting different weights of bullets from a 20" barrel to see what is most effective/mimicks 5.45x39 round.

 

I could always cut the barrel down later if I wanted to.