DanTheEldest 2 Posted June 25, 2011 Report Share Posted June 25, 2011 Before I post my issue I just want to say hello to all the Saiga folks here. I'm familiar with some of your members (especially Nalioth) from other boards, and now that I'm doing my own conversion I naturally came here for some answers. My issue is this: I'm doing a conversion on a 7.62x39 Saiga and I really liked the looks of the Timbersmith black laminate furniture, so I ordered a set. Now that I'm actually doing the work I did a dry-fit to see how everything lines up and found (much to my dismay) that there is a very large difference in height between the inside dimensions of the receiver and the mating parts on the buttstock. Basically, when I put the stock in there's a large gap (at least 1/8" or more) under the upper tang. In order to give the stock a snug fit I'm faced with making some custom shims, which I don't necessarily mind doing, but I'm a little upset. Either my stock is seriously out of spec, or these aren't actually meant for Saigas and should have had a warning on the manufacturer's site and/or the place where I bought the stock. I did a search for similar troubles on this board, and other than some other issues with the deep tang cut I couldn't find much, so my apologies if this is a recent repost. Anybody else have these sorts of troubles with Timbersmith? I'm bummed because I really like the look, but these sorts of tolerances aren't acceptable in my book. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jmzzl 146 Posted June 25, 2011 Report Share Posted June 25, 2011 Before I post my issue I just want to say hello to all the Saiga folks here. I'm familiar with some of your members (especially Nalioth) from other boards, and now that I'm doing my own conversion I naturally came here for some answers. My issue is this: I'm doing a conversion on a 7.62x39 Saiga and I really liked the looks of the Timbersmith black laminate furniture, so I ordered a set. Now that I'm actually doing the work I did a dry-fit to see how everything lines up and found (much to my dismay) that there is a very large difference in height between the inside dimensions of the receiver and the mating parts on the buttstock. Basically, when I put the stock in there's a large gap (at least 1/8" or more) under the upper tang. In order to give the stock a snug fit I'm faced with making some custom shims, which I don't necessarily mind doing, but I'm a little upset. Either my stock is seriously out of spec, or these aren't actually meant for Saigas and should have had a warning on the manufacturer's site and/or the place where I bought the stock. I did a search for similar troubles on this board, and other than some other issues with the deep tang cut I couldn't find much, so my apologies if this is a recent repost. Anybody else have these sorts of troubles with Timbersmith? I'm bummed because I really like the look, but these sorts of tolerances aren't acceptable in my book. It could also be the low manufacturing tolerances of Saiga's. It could be a fluke with the Timbersmith stock set, but I'd wager it's just the gun. As a general rule of thumb, if you add acessories to an AK, you might as well plan on doing some modifications to make it fit. Some cases, worse than others. Some parts actually fit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kresk 10,063 Posted June 25, 2011 Report Share Posted June 25, 2011 With tens of millions of AK's having been produced in dozens of countries it's not surprising that accessories don't perfectly fit every gun. Welcome to the forum! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DanTheEldest 2 Posted June 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2011 Appreciate the responses. I'm no stranger to fitting things and "make it work" projects, but the size of the gap caught me off guard. I've made my peace with it and now I need to find some sheetmetal or a thin piece of hardwood or something to make the shims out of. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Las_Vegas_HK 0 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 The Timbersmith set that I just received(red) fits the Saiga receiver with about 1/16" or slightly less of room the spare not bad for me. For about $105 this set is hard to beat. Wood seems a little soft. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chevyman097 2,579 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 Welcome to Tapco. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Deadeye 325 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 If anything they should have made It a little big not small It Is alwase easer to take away wood and real hard to add 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stnls1911 55 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 Welcome to Tapco. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 My issue is this: I'm doing a conversion on a 7.62x39 Saiga and I really liked the looks of the Timbersmith black laminate furniture, so I ordered a set. Now that I'm actually doing the work I did a dry-fit to see how everything lines up and found (much to my dismay) that there is a very large difference in height between the inside dimensions of the receiver and the mating parts on the buttstock. Basically, when I put the stock in there's a large gap (at least 1/8" or more) under the upper tang. In order to give the stock a snug fit I'm faced with making some custom shims, Saigas are different than the old AKM pattern rifles. Saigas are based on AK103/74 type patterns. The firing pins, bolts, carriers, stocks, etc are different. The timber smith is essentially made for an AKM which has a different trunnion shape and receiver relationship. The AK74 style stocks will fit much more perfect. Why, because the difference between the AKM and AK74 rear openings result in a gap between the trunnion of the saiga and an AKM stock. The Tapco AKM stocks insert until the outer stock edge presses the receiver edge and not the trunnion like it should. If you really must use the timber smith, make a shim so that it properly presses the rear trunnion and not the knife edge of the receiver. In the picture, you can see a tapco AKM stock and the obvious gap difference compared to the saiga 74/103 pattern stock. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DanTheEldest 2 Posted June 26, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 (edited) ^^^Thanks for the details. After sleeping on it I've made a decision: my original idea for this Saiga was actually to make an AK-103 clone complete with a '74-style brake, and after seeing all that's involved with this furniture I think I'm going to go back to that idea. I'm going to put the Timbersmith set up for sale and pick up a K-Var black poly set. Does K-Var offer a buttstock in the Warsaw length with the proper mating surfaces to fit snugly for a Saiga? Edited June 26, 2011 by DanTheEldest Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DrThunder88 912 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 (edited) Just bed it with some JB Weld. Oops, sorry. I didn't see the new course of action. Edited June 26, 2011 by DrThunder88 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stnls1911 55 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 Does K-Var offer a buttstock in the Warsaw length with the proper mating surfaces to fit snugly for a Saiga? I had to use a mallet to get my stock in. They are made slightly larger, so you shouldn't have any gap problems. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 (edited) Does K-Var offer a buttstock in the Warsaw length with the proper mating surfaces to fit snugly for a Saiga? All the Kvar 74 style stocks should fit perfect in saigas. I have several warsaw and a nato length one and they all fit snug against the inner trunnion. I just recently finished a 2008 RAA Saiga rifle with a kvar stock set minus the grip. Edited June 26, 2011 by my762buzz Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gato 0 Posted June 26, 2011 Report Share Posted June 26, 2011 (edited) I had the same problem when I got my red Timbersmith stock. After 6 or 7 strips of electrical tape the stock fits in my receiver fine. Edited June 26, 2011 by Gato Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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