New guy with a mag question......

[WARTIGER 0]

Ok guys, I am sure you all have answered this a thousand times, but this is my first thread so bear with me. I have a Saiga 7.62x39. I do not plan on converting it, simply adding the Tapco Intrafuse stock and fore-end. My biggest question and concern is with the mags. I have a 30 and two 10rd factory Saiga mags and a few early model ProMags. Of course the ProMags do not feed, ala lack of feed ramp. I want to be able to shoot standard AK mags. I know I will have to install a BG to do this. What other modifications, if any would I need to make to the gun/mags, and once I install the BG, will my factory Saiga mags still work?

 

 

Or am I better off buying a few Surefire mags and just riding out?

 

Thanks for any advice and input.

[hutchsaiga 93]

I guess my biggest question is why you don't want to restore the rifle?

 

To run surplus mags over ten rounds you need be 922r compliant. If you're going to make the rifle 922 complaint. You might as well convert it

 

 

Restore the rifle to its original form. Sooner, rather than later

 

[WARTIGER 0]

I have neither the time or mechanical aptitude to convert it. I know, it's easy, at least everybody who has done it says it's easy. I just don't want to screw up a brand new gun and then have the embarrassment of taking it to a gunsmith to fix my screw up. Basically, I know just enough to get in trouble!

[ekim 6]

If it's not broke why try to fix it. You don't have to convert it to be able to use 20 round or bigger mags, but you will have to change some parts if you want a pistol grip. You can't convert it to 3 shot burst / full auto legally so you can't really make it like an original AK any how. That would be the only way I would convert mine at least.

[WARTIGER 0]

All I want to do is be able to use cheaper (price wise) surplus mags and still be able to use the mags I currently have. As it stands, once I put on the Tapco stock, pistol grip, forend and few other parts, it will be compliant, no problems there. I will be adding the BG guide from Danzig, no problems there. As to "restoring" it, there's nothing to restore.

[dayofruin 425]

If you truly don't have an interest in doing the conversion, you might as well not try to use standard mags. Getting one into 922 compliance is much easier if you convert. Converting is is as simple as using a Dremel with a cut off wheel and a steady hand, and a screw driver. There are a ton of videos out there/on here that'll take you steb by step. Hell, you could do it with a file and screwdriver but it'd take forever.

 

To answer your mod question... To make surplus mags fit and function, you need the bullet guide and you'll need to file the top of the magazine latch. ( the part of it that holds the magazine in). Just file a little at a time while testing the magazine until it fully sears in. But if you're mechanically inclined enough to do the bullet guide, you're good enought to do the conversion.

[hutchsaiga 93]

If you truly don't have an interest in doing the conversion, you might as well not try to use standard mags. Getting one into 922 compliance is much easier if you convert. Converting is is as simple as using a Dremel with a cut off wheel and a steady hand, and a screw driver. There are a ton of videos out there/on here that'll take you steb by step. Hell, you could do it with a file and screwdriver but it would take forever

 

True story.

 

Mikhail dies a little inside everytime a saiga sporter is not converted

 

 

And by the way ekim, AK's never had three round burst. And just because my ak isnt select fire, doesn't mean it's not an ak

 

Please don't incorrectly inform members of this board

 

The conversion is worth it. Do it

 

End thread

 

 

[JBubbs 17]

I was way more nervous about drilling and tapping for a bullet guide than removing a few rivets. You will be so much happier with the conversion and it won't look like a crotch rocket with ape hangers

[Agent Lemon 157]

I think that you are confusing a couple of things here.

 

The installation of the bullet guide is the more difficult thing to do. This is because not only do you have to carefully drill a well aligned hole (on a part that wont work if you mis-drill the hole), but you also have to tap the hole properly, too. If you mess up either the drilling or the tapping, you will have to take it to a gunsmith after messing up, unless you can find a proper, larger sized drill bit/tap/screw. If you drill in the wrong place you'll have to weld it up and risk messing up the temper of the metal/ making the metal there do weird things.

 

To do the conversion, you just drill/file out a few rivets, then put in a different FCG. There is virtually no way to mess up, except for maybe scratching the finish a little bit, or possibly elongating one of the rivet holes (which would not matter anyway).

 

 

However if you are set on doing this, then this is my method-

 

Put the BG in the trunnion and then align it. Put some superglue into the hole and let it dry. Once its dry, rack the bolt carrier a few times to make sure that everything closes properly. Then, disassemble the gun and look at the bullet guide. If the bullet guide got scratched by the bolt then you fucked up with the alignment and have to re do it, in order for everything to work smooth and not snag. Then, you take a pointy metal punch and punch right in the dead middle of the BGs hole. Take a drill and drill down at a right angle through the hole that you punched. Then, you tap the hole at a slower speed than you did the drilling, making sure not to snap the tap, rendering the entire gun out of action for a long while. Then simply apply a drop of red loctite to the screw, and screw it into the newly tapped hole.

 

Having a drill press helps to drill everything down properly. However, I have never used mine. I always freehand it.

 

After this is done, either file the mag catch, ore replace it entirely.

[thehun 20]

quick question...what happens if i convert my saiga to accept ak surplus mags..will the saiga surefire mags still work?

[dayofruin 425]

 

 

Yes they will but you have to file or Dremel down the feed ramp on the surefire mags. Just make the front look like your surplus mags.

@ekim: btw, you can convert a saiga to full auto legally if you have or obtain a class 3 manufacturers license. Not sure on the form titles but it becomes a non transferable post sample that can't be sold to an individual. There are people here much more educated on this than I that could better explain.

Edited March 21, 2012 by dayofruin

[ekim 6]

Yes they will but you have to file or Dremel down the feed ramp on the surefire mags. Just make the front look like your surplus mags.

@ekim: btw, you can convert a saiga to full auto legally if you have or obtain a class 3 manufacturers license. Not sure on the form titles but it becomes a non transferable post sample that can't be sold to an individual. There are people here much more educated on this than I that could better explain.

 

With enough paper work and money you can do just about anything. I haven't checked into a class 3 manufactures license, but,IMO, It would probably be faster and easier to just buy a legal full auto AK, if you can find one and afford it. I think it may be more than just filling out a few papers and sending in a check though. And yes I did have a full auto AR back about 35 years ago, the fun lasted about two outing, I couldn't afford to shoot it even back then, but unlike what some may say a 3 shoot burst AK would be more to my liking and could be had / made!

 

I was just trying to make a point, I bought a Saiga because it does what I want it to do, was cheaper than an AK. If I had wanted an AK, I would have bought one or an AR if that is what I wanted. This is a Sagia forum, but it seems everybody want's an AK. I wonder how many people on the AK forum convert their AK's to sporting type Sagia look alikes. As you can see by my post count, I don't post here much as most here don't accept opposing debate / opinions, unless the right person should happen to post it.

Edited March 22, 2012 by ekim

[Cobra 0]

Maybe I'm missing something since I am a bit of a newbie on all this, but...

 

I believe if you add a 30 round mag to a Saiga sport rifle, it becomes an illegal assault rifle UNLESS the rifle is made 922r compliant. In other words what you are proposing to do makes the gun illegal. I think this is what hutchsaiga was trying to tell you.

 

However, to make the rifle 922r compliant, you need to replace a number of the foreign made parts with US made parts. Thus, you will end up "converting" it anyway...unless you want to be running around with an illegal piece.

 

I have an AK-47 already, so I actually like the Saiga just the way it is (weird I know). Sometimes I feel like an assault rifle, sometimes I don't...

Edited March 22, 2012 by Cobra

[dayofruin 425]

Cobra, you're pretty much right on about the 922 BS! It should be a non issue but the powers that be say it IS an issue.

Ekim,

No offense intended. I was just stating that you can convert to full auto legally with the right papers and money. If you guys prefer the sporting configuration, it's your preference to have. I don't prefer it. I know guys with S-12's that wouldn't have one converted for anything.

[Bigtwin 219]

All I want to do is be able to use cheaper (price wise) surplus mags and still be able to use the mags I currently have. As it stands, once I put on the Tapco stock, pistol grip, forend and few other parts, it will be compliant, no problems there. I will be adding the BG guide from Danzig, no problems there. As to "restoring" it, there's nothing to restore.

 

That is just it! Once you take it out of "as imported" condition, you have to comply with 922r! Remember the Saiga rifle is imported with 10rd mags, and no pistol grip. Therefore if you go with higher cap mags or add the Tapco Saiga buttstock you will be removing it from "as imported" condition!

[chevyman097 2,579]

I have neither the time or mechanical aptitude to convert it. I know, it's easy, at least everybody who has done it says it's easy. I just don't want to screw up a brand new gun and then have the embarrassment of taking it to a gunsmith to fix my screw up. Basically, I know just enough to get in trouble!

 

I wish I had a buck for every newbie that said that. I could buy 10 saigas! Although I do have to admit, I would have paid in that one buck long ago.

 

Do the conversion man! thats all, im not going into details right now because im so lazy thinking about how easy it is.

 

yawn, how many times have I linked this?

 

 

Mess it up? Man its an AK, you would have to destroy it to mess it up. The first thing you have to do is stop worrying about this like its a brand new chromed out 1911. You would have to destroy it to screw it up(did I say that already?). trust me, it is uglier in factory configuration than it will ever be after you convert it.

[Bigtwin 219]

Chevyman....that one is my favorite and the one that shows the job clearly(the guy used good lighting compared to the youtube vids)! I have linked that vid so many times it is not funny. This, coming from a guy that was happy with the sporter configuration.....right up until some jerk let me shoot their restored Saiga! Then it was no longer any good as imported!