Picked up an S223 on trade.

[thebuns1 4,323]

picked up an '09 still bastardized, just the way i wanted it. it was used, and so was the mossy 30-30 i traded for at the local shop. it does have the velcro patch. i currently have a sgl in 5.45, so this will be a nice addition. cant wait to get it torn apart and get this bitch back to its original configuration.

[gunfun 3,931]

This will be more fun and cheaper to shoot than the mossberg. I wouldn't feed it much with a 5.45 at hand though. Good to keep around in case the cheap 5.45 runs out.

[RED333 1,025]

Cool deal man, ya know we NEED PICS!

[thebuns1 4,323]

i know it fellas. im not going to rush into this conversion though. im going to take my time with it and think things through for once.

 

and yes gun fun, the price on ammo i wont feel since i stopped shooting 30-30 some time ago. i was looking to get into another caliber for some time, but wanted to keep it in an Ak platform. so this is what i came across. and i plan on hoarding some of the milsurp 5.45 just in case, so this will be a fun project.

 

and red, i know i need photos. and i shall produce just as soon as i stop being a cheap ass and get some better batteries for my shitty old camera. lol.

 

i was originally in the market for a 7.62 model, but have an infatuation with small caliber, high velocity calibers, and also wanted to see a true comparison between a 223 ak vs. a 5.45. and i will post results, but it may be a while since i now have to buy conversion parts and am planning this one out fairly decent as to my others. so im excited fellas. and dont worry, pics will come!

[mancat 2,368]

The fact that the Saiga .223 doesn't care about steel cased ammo means it's still pretty cheap to shoot. A lot of the AR guys won't even think of feeding their rifles steel cased, though it seems to be changing. I've been having a hard time finding it in stock lately.

 

Izhmash themselves have stated that the .223 and .308 are the most accurate Saiga/AK-10x chamberings.

 

Not to start a flame war but I purposefully avoided 5.45 so that I wouldn't have to deal with this issue. .223 will always be available, has a shit ton of commercial loadings, and corrosive surplus is unheard of.

[thebuns1 4,323]

The fact that the Saiga .223 doesn't care about steel cased ammo means it's still pretty cheap to shoot. A lot of the AR guys won't even think of feeding their rifles steel cased, though it seems to be changing. I've been having a hard time finding it in stock lately.

 

Izhmash themselves have stated that the .223 and .308 are the most accurate Saiga/AK-10x chamberings.

 

Not to start a flame war but I purposefully avoided 5.45 so that I wouldn't have to deal with this issue. .223 will always be available, has a shit ton of commercial loadings, and corrosive surplus is unheard of.

 

no flame war intended mancat. truth is, 5.45 surplus could dry up at any time, but luckily we have a decent amount of it getting pumped out in terms of availability. i found it a pretty smart choice going with .223 considering that i dont have a rifle in this caliber and that i was wanting one, and that my friends and family all share the same deal. so for me it was a win-win deal. but overall, i blame this forum for me wanting a lot of things....

[mancat 2,368]

Yeah I had no interest in Saigas when I knew nothing about them - just thinking that they were a permanently neutered AK - then I started browsing around here and I was like, "oh, so THAT'S what you can do with them?? Want one now."

Edited June 23, 2012 by mancat

[thebuns1 4,323]

i know it. its a beautiful thing man. and sadly still SO many people dont know. they all think its a cult thing. but fuck'em. more for us. to me it goes to show how many dont know about what these things can become. and i find it fuckin badass. i just wish they were still 300 bucks.

[pyzik 597]

That's great, Captain.

I have been considering parting ways with my SKS for another Saiga.

[thebuns1 4,323]

well its time for an update.

 

i got the reciever stripped and the plate off the bottom.

 

i gave he rifle to my buddy who is a head welding inspector fill my holes and i got them sanded and filed down flush.

 

and i just got the GB and FSB removed today.

 

now im playig the waiting game on parts to come in the mail.

 

im going to have my buddy that did the welding take it with him to work again and have it bead blasted once i get it together and test fire it. then ill strip it back down and give it some duracoat. havent decided on color just yet.

Edited July 15, 2012 by Captain Hero

[mancat 2,368]

FYI most of the factory finish will come right off with chlorinated brake cleaner, if for any reason you can't get it bead blasted.

[thebuns1 4,323]

thanks for the heads up mancat. ill keep that in mind.

[Jaba1017 71]

What are you thinking about for a muzzle device? I'm thinking something similar to this Beryl cage hider http://www.robertrtg.com/usberylflash.html or the Tantal like barrel extension break on the Archer http://i1036.photobucket.com/albums/a443/hansellhd/archer001.jpg. I assume the Poles did some kind of research on what works best for 5.56 out of an AK. The longer break would bring the barrel length out to 18 inches which would probably be more optimal for 5.56 rounds.

[thebuns1 4,323]

since i have 3 spares, i may opt to go with a '74 FSB and one of the spare brakes i have, but not 100% sure just yet. i havent gave that much thought, until i get my GB and lower handguard retainer on.

[Jaba1017 71]

My gut (along with the flash at the end of my barrel) tells me the 16 inch barrel .223 AK needs a 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 inch break, though the short AR type cage breaks seem most popular on this forum.

[thebuns1 4,323]

i dont know man. i think its just preference, really. im gunna go with a '74 style. no sense in me having as many as i do. might as well use them.

[mancat 2,368]

My gut (along with the flash at the end of my barrel) tells me the 16 inch barrel .223 AK needs a 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 inch break, though the short AR type cage breaks seem most popular on this forum.

 

I'm not sure what you mean? The short cage brakes are just fine for flash suppression on a 16" bbl. The AK-74 brake works great with .223.

[thebuns1 4,323]

i figured it would too mancat.

[liberty -r- death 1,445]

I have the AK74 style on mine and love it.

[thebuns1 4,323]

i like the '74 brake.

[RED333 1,025]

I think ya need one these, The muzzle brake of the 105 mm gun on an AMX 10 RC fighting vehicle.

That will slow your ass down.

Looks like some good progress there.

[thebuns1 4,323]

that would be bad ass red!

[Jaba1017 71]

The 74 break has a long expansion chamber which I think would be good for the AK .223. The AR cage breaks really have no expansion chamber. From what I've been able to determine from researching the issue the Russians found that the expansion chamber was important in maintaining accuracy with the 5.45. The 74 break is also symmetrical which some authorities say is important in maintaining the accuracy of the .223 bullet, though most AR breaks only have vents or ports along the top making them asymmetrical.

 

The .223 doesn't need much break but it does need some additional barrel length because at 16 inches there is a lot unburned powder and flash, and would benefit from the break provided by a ported expansion chamber like the 74 break which should give it near nothing for recoil.

 

Are you all using an adapter and a true 74 break or using one designed with the standard 14LH AK thread?

[thebuns1 4,323]

well i have one on my sgl31. and i have 3 spare russian made '74 brakes. two are one piece zig-zag, and the other is the "arrowhead" two piece brake. i currently dont have any AK's with a 14x1 LH.

Edited July 20, 2012 by Captain Hero

[mancat 2,368]

Did a full conversion on mine using Bulgarian AK-74 kit - 24mm threaded FSB, gas block with lug, standard LHG retainer, etc.

 

I also use a CNC Warrior Bulgarian AK-74 brake on my WASR-10/63 (same as pictured, AMD brake in this pic) via 14x1LH adapter, and that works great as well.

 

Edited July 20, 2012 by mancat

[thebuns1 4,323]

im fixin to buy my gas block, anyone know if a bulgy one will fit ok? i butchered the factory one getting it off with a dremel.

 

edit: nevermind. it will work.

Edited July 21, 2012 by Captain Hero

[mancat 2,368]

If you have a dimpled receiver and the barrel has locating cuts on both sides for the handguard retainer, a Bulgy '74 block will work. .223 Saigas with these two features have a milspec AK-101 barrel. You can also mike the journal where the block sits - should measure .591". If so, you are GTG.

Edited July 21, 2012 by mancat

[thebuns1 4,323]

thanks mancat, i though that was how it is, but asked to make sure. i just got my russian lower HG retainter in the mail today with my gas tube and with a little help with a wooden dowel its on and works smooth on and off. tomorrow ill dremel or file the groove for the pin to rotate, and yes i have the cuts in the barrel, so all is good for now guys. this will be my first .223 conversion so im stoked.

 

and i just placed the order through k-var. damn these things aint cheap.

[mancat 2,368]

FYI if you have both plum and wood furniture, I suggest fitting the handguard retainer for the plum handguard. Wood AK-74 handguards have a tension spring and can be fitted manually after the fact - plum, not so much.

 

Also do not worry if the retainer has a little play in it once you have the cam lever working. The play disappears when a handguard is installed.

 

In case you haven't used this trick before while setting up a LHG retainer:

 

Install the handguard, get the retainer snug up against it, and mark on the barrel where the retainer forward face edge sits. It needs to be a fine mark, not a fat sharpie, etc. I just score the finish lightly with a razor.

 

Remove the retainer, and measure the distance from its forward face edge (the spot against which you marked the barrel), to the centerline of the cam lever pin. You can then use this measurement, using the existing mark on the barrel as a reference mark, tol tell you where to begin filing the indentation for the cam.

 

Any decent jeweler's file set should have a half-round file that matches the radius of the cam pin. It helps to have another AK of similar origin to check against an already-cut cam pin channel.

 

I prefer the cam to be a bit tight with a handguard installed. It will wear itself in. I prefer mine tight enough that the flat tool from the cleaning kit can be used to lift the lever up/down initially, and the rest can be done by finger - assuming that you have calloused, hard fingers like me, that is.

 

I have a Romy that is loose enough that the lever can sort of flop around on its own. Nice for disassembly, but annoying at times.

 

Also not to make ya feel bad but I did mine when the matching unissued Bulgy '74 parts kits were just a little over $100. Those parts individually are a massive ripoff from most places, espeially K-var, but... What are ya gonna do? Not too many other sources.

 

Sorry if TMI. Typing this while my wife drives down the freeway, a little bored. Driving from Phoenix to Seattle in a little under 20 hours - we've been trading off like truckers.

Edited July 21, 2012 by mancat

[thebuns1 4,323]

 

its ok mancat. ive been there and done that shit with the driving.

 

thanks for the heads up on the LHG installation. the conversions ive done in the past have never been on a front end so i said fuck it. im sick of having someone do it for me. im pretty good with my hands,(ha ha) but i use them for a living so i know what ya mean. man hands. and i figured with the measurements, thats what i was going to do. and it should come out about right, and if not, then it will get better with time, and be damn close.

 

i was curious on what to use, as i have a dremel, but i thought maybe a rat tail file, and an hours time maybe? or if there is a bit for the dremel, i will pick that up to speed the process. i just dont want to take too much off.

 

and dont feel bad about braggin on your price for the parts kit, you fucker. nice score!

 

but i want parts that are not made here. so i reckon i will gladly pay what i have to for them and be done with it. but i cant bitch, as i got some kick ass deals on parts for my 5.45 from vlad for dirt cheap. now he charges an arm and a leg for the same shit. its all good as long as we can still get them!

 

thanks again bud..