I thought this was interesting...

[IndyArms 10,186]

I thougth this was kinda interesting...

 

Seems to me that all you need is to enter a home with intent to commit a crime in NY state... and the homeowner gets to blow you away... legally, scott free, have a nice day!

 

Gotta love it!

 

 

http://billstclair.com/ferran/righttouseforce.html

 

 

[k_dawg 0]

that is actually true in many states. It is dubbed the "castle doctrine", and legally, it is presummed that someone unlawfully entering your house intends to do harm.

 

of course, if you live in NYC.. you could still be cited for not having a legally registered firearm, etc...

[pistonring8 1]

Man, I live in Pennsylvania. If the shot dosen't wake any neighbors up, your supposed to roll the guy outside and call the meatwagon in the morning......Really, thats state law!

 

There have actually been cases in PA where an old timer has blown away a crack head halfway through his living room window. The defence weapon used was alledged to be a "sawed off 12 guage" but the state police accidentally lost it before the ATF got involved. And no charges were ever filed against the defendant.

 

Ofcorse there was just a case recently where a WW2 vet had crashed into a cop car on his way home from the VFW. He got some fines and an ugly DUI charge and that was it.......Until a few years later, he called up the state police to report that a few kids had stolen his trash cans from under his porch. When the police arrived to take a report, one of them noticed that the old guy had 4 antique Winchester rifles in a cabinet in his living room. Well, the man was charged with a firearms felony and it was turned over to a fed. court who sentanced him to 10 years! Thats a life sentance for a guy over 70.

 

I still say that the outcome of ANY occorance is dependant apon thoes who are in "authority" over it. What happens to you completely depends on the attitudes of thoes in charge.

[Bvamp 604]

AH HAH!

 

hahah.

 

NY.

 

mmmm.....

 

they have to be aggressively and actively pursuing you here (dude in your house on your property with a weapon)for you to shoot them dead with the first shot. you have to show intent in NY to not kill outright. dont ask how I know that, but thats the law. take it how you want it. it can only change in this facist state for the worse. thank NYC and those other facist faggots for that one. its a trick indy. you already had the right in NY to defend yourself. that law makes the old way illegal. fuck them and thier facist NYC bullshit. I know my rights.

 

the deal in NY now is the new anti-gun movement forming around the dead kid and the dead hero cop. I checked. the guns in both incidents were illegal to BEGIN WITH. its a facist crock of crap.

 

 

and to make it simple, Ill blow your head off anyway. then Ill check the fucking law.

 

I have a right to exist as a born american. and thats that.

[IndyArms 10,186]

Bvamp....

 

 

Do you need a hug???

 

 

 

[pistonring8 1]

Bvamp....

 

 

Do you need a hug???

 

 

 

 

OMG! Now THATS funnt!!!!

 

 

[AegisDei 2]

The Castle Doctrine is a blessing, however just because the law is on your side doesn't mean a jury will be too. I believe Florida has been the leader at promoting the Castle Doctrine, and it has been adopted in many many states because of what K_dawg said. However, there's a few conditions that one would be wise to learn. I believe the Castle Doctrine mainly applies upon entry. That means when someone is crossing the threshold of your residence you have the right to kill, but once they're in your house, it's a different story. Once they're in your house, normal laws apply and you have to be in mortal danger. Granted, if they're in your house, you'll still have MORE protection than a public place, but you lose absolute protection once they have entered.

 

It is admitted that people who forcibly enter a property have unknown and possibly violent intentions, but once on your property it is easier to know what their intentions are and caution need be used. However, the courts have often been generous in their interpretation defining "entry", and in some jurisdictions entry consists of your entire residence, in others it is much more narrowly tailored.

 

That means, if someone is stealing your TV when you catch them, you can't shoot them unless you can prove your life, or another life, was in danger. Thus, they would have to pull a gun or knife on you. You can not kill to protect property, only other lives. You also should not shoot someone in the back unless another's life is in mortal danger because that will be a losing battle in court as you'll have little hope of proving mortal danger.

 

Also, in all of these cases even if the law is on your side, liberal juries can still screw you. It's unfortunate, but you're probably safest from legal recourse if you kill any perpetrators as they can not come back at you in court. However, the psychological ramifications of killing someone are immense.

 

Another word to the wise: use minimal force to completely neutralize a threat, and then do not talk to any media about it or if you do talk, don't make yourself into a hero. There have been numerous cases where people in mortal danger defended themselves and used more than minimal force, as in continuously shooting a neutralized threat. The use of excessive force landed them in jail. Talking to media and seeming like a vigilante will also turn a jury against you with a quickness. If you express regret and a sense of responsibility, you will do better.

 

I don't mean to preach, but I feel it's important to know the law and the recourses of actions. I believe the quote most fitting is "its better to be judged by twelve than carried by six". Hopefully none of us will ever have to face a situation of making the decision to take a life, but at least if you do you'll be in an educated position to make that decision.

[Bvamp 604]

you are absolutely right, aegisdei. That is why Im making my own less than lethal ammuniton for use as the first shot. I can seriously say that I did not wish to kill the person, even if I shoot twice inside of a second and drop them.

 

...because with MY luck, and how my life tends to go, Ill wind up being in the damn situation someday and Ive learned to cover my own ass or lose it. Its always good to have a plan, even if you cant actually follow it completely.

 

I know I sure as shit wont shove someone down the stairs, because an intruder can sue you for falling on your property here. so now that its snowing here again, the drive is clear, the walk is ice free, and the rubber treads are down so the bastard can be assured of a worry free break-in followed by some nice hot pepper dust and a 1 oz slug to the face.

[G O B 3,516]

Even here in Prince George Co. Md. , one of the worst anti-gun liberal bastions of the world--We have the right to use lethal force to protect ourselves IN our homes. To be legal you must wait for the BG to be in your home, and you must "fear for your safety". We average 1 or 2 cases avery year of BG's getting killed in a home invasion. If the weapon is legal, NO prosecutions.

Many years ago, a P.G. Co. cop told me, that if I were to shoot someone that was breaking in, to drag the corpse all the way into the house, then go to the kitchen and get a knife that didn't match anything else -wipe it clean and put it in their hand. Then dial 911. "you do your part, and we will do ours!".

 

G O B

Edited December 5, 2005 by G O B

[IndyArms 10,186]

Many years ago, a P.G. Co. cop told me, that if I were to shoot someone that was breaking in, to drag the corpse all the way into the house, then go to the kitchen and get a knife that didn't match anything else -wipe it clean and put it in their hand. Then dial 911. "you do your part, and we will do ours!".

 

 

AMEN!!!!

 

 

Ya know... if EVERY criminal would believe that.... Crime would go DOWN... ( At least the break ins to private residence... etc...)

 

[k_dawg 0]

Again, I can only speak for Florida.

 

But the castle doctrine has been defended in court numerous times.

 

One of the most "famous" involves a paramedic responding to a heart attack call. He had to break in thru the window, as the front door was locked. Unfortunately, he broke into the wrong house, and was shot by the occupants. THe occupants were found to have commited no crime, inspite the EMS person not actually posing a threat.

 

This is the new/current law:

 

Section 1. Section 776.013, Florida Statutes, is created to read:

776.013 Home protection; use of deadly force; presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.--

(1) A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:

(a) The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that person's will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and

( The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred.

 

 

Note: there is no need for an actual threat of danger ( or even percieved ). Simply having forcibly entered your house is now, by statue, a state of presumption of fear of death or great bodily harm.

 

So yes, if the robber is holding the TV, you can legally shoot him.

 

Of course, what is legal, and what is smart.. may not be the same always.