DavidQ 170 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 I am having a problem with aftermarket handguards coming loose. I have tried 2 so far. 1st one was the CSS quadrail which I had to cut the screw to make sure it didn't bottom out before becoming tight. 2nd one is the Chaos titan full length quadrail which I love and will not be coming off this gun. Now I have tried new bolts for both handguards and even with blue loctite they still came loose. What can I do besides using red loctite to keep the screw from coming loose? I can't remember the thread pitch I bought but it I don't think that is the problem. When I purchased this gun it did not come with the original handguard screw and it looked like someone put some grey Rtv silicone or something inside the thread hole. I really hope the threads are not screwed up and I can find the fix for this. I have had other saiga 12's and have not run into this issue before. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
garnaz 215 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Do you have another s12 to compare with? Have you tried to just install screw and check side to side play to see if it had been oversized at one time? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidQ 170 Posted August 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 I do but I haven't yet. I guess I could do that to see. I would just hate to disassemble the whole thing again butI guess there is only one way to find out . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 AZ, the original screw is a M5-.80 metric thread, I have found them at Lowes or Fastenal. Many of us have lost the original and have replaced them with #10-32, which work fine but you will find are just a slightly bit looser than the metric. Try the metric and see if it gives you a little better purchase on the threads for the blue loctite to grab hold of. If that does not work, and you have a tap set, check to see if the threads on the gun are matching up with the correct size tap. If you find any wobble, or the threads seem to be tampered with, you may have to retap. Sometimes just running the correct sized tap down the hole is enough to reform boogered up threads and fix the issue. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidQ 170 Posted August 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 M5-.80 sounds about right on what I got. I will see about picking up a tap and maybe cleaning up the threads a little to see if that works. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 If you pick up a tap for it, make sure you get a flat bottom tap. The hole does bottom out, so a normal pointed tap will not run all the way down to the bottom. My guess from your description is that the threads have flattened out and are not biting like they should. Don't know if you can find the metric tap locally. Fastenal would be a good choice to start if you have one nearby. If not, get a 10-32. If you need me to send you one to use, let me know and I will get it in the mail to you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidQ 170 Posted August 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Luckily we have a fastenal that opened up about 2 years ago. So why should I use a standard tap if the threads are metric? I work at lowes so I'll check there first. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 If you can find an M5-.80 flat bottom tap, that would definitely be my first choice. I just don't know how common they are or your local availability. The suggestion for the 10-32 is only if you can't find the metric. The two thread sizes are so close, they are virtually interchangeable. The 10-32 will be slightly loose in an M5x.80, and the M5x.80 will be slightly tight in a 10-32. Hope that helps. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidQ 170 Posted August 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Ok I'll be searching tomorrow. In the meantime here are a couple pics of the damage to the new screw and the hole where it goes. You can see where the threads are not as crisp on top as they are on bottom. The look thicker than the rest of it. next you can kind of see the same thing with the threads on the right side of the hole. They look bunched up kinda like the screw. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 I think you can clean up those threads in the second pic with a tap and be good to go. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidQ 170 Posted August 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Ok I'll try to get whatever residue is in there and clean it with a tap. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
garnaz 215 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 (edited) Where in az are you. I have a set of taps you could try. I'm in phx. Let me check to make sure that there's one that size. Edited August 25, 2014 by garnaz Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 To restore the threads, you CAN go to 10-32 and a bottom tap, but first use a center punch and punch a circle of punch marks around the hole, at about 1/2 the diameter of the hole away from it. This will 'upset' the metal into the hole and allow enough ;meat' to tap good threads. This will also work if you can find the metric bottom tap. Also buy a screw that is too long and cut it to lenght Screws have a taper on the end, and by cutting an overly long screw to length, you get full size threads to the end. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Didn't think about using the punch around the hole. That is a great idea! Learn something new everyday. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Eric Pate 478 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Blue loktite works wonders too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidQ 170 Posted August 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 Where in az are you. I have a set of taps you could try. I'm in phx. Let me check to make sure that there's one that size. I live near az nevada cali border. A little bit of a drive to phx lol. I will try to run the tap first and see what I can clean up and try the other method of expanding metal into the hole. I have used blue loctite to no avail. I will also contact Cameron at chaos to see what length screw I should cut for the handguard. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Maxwelhse 1,285 Posted August 25, 2014 Report Share Posted August 25, 2014 FWIW: M5 x .8 Tap $5.28 http://www.amazon.com/Vermont-American-21123-5MM--80-Carbon/dp/B0002YU1YO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1408993965&sr=8-1&keywords=m5+tap Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidQ 170 Posted August 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 26, 2014 Ok so here is what happened. I purchased an M5-.80 tap from ace hardware but it wasn't flat bottom so I trimmed it down. I proceeded to run the tap some in the hole, removing after about 3 or 4 turns to make sure to clean the threads and I think it has worked. The threads look clean and it feels better tightening it down. It didn't feel like it had resistance like before either. Here is a pic of the new hole. I have reinstalled it with blue loctite again and will let it sit a week or 2 before I plan on taking it out again. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spacehog 2,218 Posted August 27, 2014 Report Share Posted August 27, 2014 Hope it works out, and let us know if it fixed the issue. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidQ 170 Posted August 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2014 I appreciate all the help guys. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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