Etek 32 Posted May 14, 2007 Report Share Posted May 14, 2007 (edited) Has anyone tried the AK-47 Yugoslavian notched selector stop for a Bolt Hold Open/BHO device on a Saiga-12? How about the U.S. aftermarket version? Appreciate any replies. Edited May 14, 2007 by Etek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Federal_Depot 0 Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 +1 Thats a good idea. Im in on this thread Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Yes that has been done often. Blackjack sells them and so do others. You can make your own if you have the tools. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mccumber1916 1 Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Yes that has been done often. Blackjack sells them and so do others. You can make your own if you have the tools. krebbs also has Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Etek 32 Posted May 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Thanks guys, I'm going to try my Yugo M-92 'Krinkov' selector on my Saiga 12 tonight. If it won't work because of bolt carrier handle contour I'll buy and try a Blackjack, and will modify selector notch contour as necessary. The Yugo Krinkov selector did NOT work on either a Romanian WASR or a Chinese Norinco because of bolt carrier contour. I'll post on results. Best regards to all. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dinzag 31 Posted May 16, 2007 Report Share Posted May 16, 2007 Yup - on all my Saigas... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Etek 32 Posted May 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 Dinzag, Looks nice! That's a Blackjack selector, correct? The Yugo selector will not work without a bit of fitting as there is interference to the lower rail. I'm not going to grind on my Yugo selector as it is a part of my M-92 'Krinkov'. When I do get the Blackjack selector I'll be sure to relieve that area (If necessasary) and thr full auto section of the safety tab as this area causes the selector to be non-removeable unless the disconnector is moved out of the way. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Federal_Depot 0 Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 Yes that has been done often. Blackjack sells them and so do others. You can make your own if you have the tools. Cobra, What tools do you recomend for making the BHO on a S12? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dinzag 31 Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 Dinzag, Looks nice! That's a Blackjack selector, correct? The Yugo selector will not work without a bit of fitting as there is interference to the lower rail. I'm not going to grind on my Yugo selector as it is a part of my M-92 'Krinkov'. When I do get the Blackjack selector I'll be sure to relieve that area (If necessasary) and thr full auto section of the safety tab as this area causes the selector to be non-removeable unless the disconnector is moved out of the way. That is the factory S-12 one. I slit them with a dremel. The receiver swipe (the scratch in the paint) on the Saiga is different than normal AK's and the blackjack will leave you with an additional scratch as they won't line up. That's why you don't want to use a normal AK safety lever on a Saiga. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 Yes that has been done often. Blackjack sells them and so do others. You can make your own if you have the tools. Cobra, What tools do you recomend for making the BHO on a S12? +1 on what dinzag said about the scratch. I use a dremel and a #420 cutoff wheel, then clean it up with a small sanding drum. You can change the contour to grab the charging handle in different ways. If you leave it sharp and perpendicular at the top of the cutout (where it actually holds the bolt back) it will hold it more firmly and lessen the chance of it accidently disengaging. I experimented with rounding that part slightly and polishing it smooth with the rubber type polishing wheel on the dremel until I can release the bolt by applying slight downward pressure on the selector. I like this option because you can keep it back til you are ready to shoot, then just aim, flick it off with a quick tap of your trigger finger, then it chambers a round and you can commence firing. I've got my 410 set up this way. It does have the tab on the side but you can do the same thing by adding something to the side of your factory selector that you can grab with your finger. I've seen some people use a long pop rivet for this. (Maybe someone will post a pic?) If you have really long fingers you can just use the built in tab at the front but for me that means having to release part of my grip on the PG to reach forward. The idea behind Blackjack's "S.W.I.F.T." lever (Safety With Integrated Finger Tab) is you can release it like that with your hand still firmly gripping the PG. http://www.blackjackbuffers.com/index.php?...products_id=202 Be sure and read this... http://www.blackjackbuffers.com/index.php?...age=swift_lever My 410... This is a blackjack SWIFT lever that I modified to work better with the LRBHO. By removing material all the way back I was able to push up the selector after the LRBHO locked the bolt all the way back, then if held there I could release the bolt to the SWIFT lever and be able to aim start firing as soon as I disengaged the safety with my trigger finger. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DevL 0 Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 Since a lot of people are concerned with leaving mags loaded under a closed bolt how secure would you feel if you had the LRBHO lock the bolt back and closed the safety for storage in your home to be able to grab and go quickly? Would this prevent deformation of the top round in the magazine? Is it possible that the shotgun could be jostled and release the LRBHO and force the safety down and chamber the round accidentally? I am wondering how much the bolt handle will travel forward before it contacts the front of the safety notch when the LRBHO is activated. I have seen safeties that had the safety notch and they tended to push the safety down a bit when the handle was trapped in the notch... did not seem very secure at all. Also, I have seen safties that look like the Swift and have the cutout that are supposed to be specifically for the saiga-12. Will these work with the LRBHO right out of the box or just the factory BHO? Does the LRBHO hold the bolt back even a little more or less than the factory BHO unit? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 Hmmm.. First, yes I would trust the LRBHO to keep the bolt back while loaded and ready by the bedside. It uses the very same method of holding the bolt back that the factory BHO does. You can bump the butt on the ground and disengage it just like the factory BHO because it has a spring in there wanting to pull it back down and free the bolt but the pressure of the recoil spring holds it tight in place unless rearward pressure is applied to the bolt carrier. The weight of the bolt and BC is enough to release it if bumped straight down on the ground or aginst any hard object. If the gun was leaning against the wall and fell over it may or may not release it because the BHO lever is wedged in there tight, in a notch in the bolt, under the recoil spring pressure. Even if it did release and chamber a round there would have to be another jolt or smack of the butt against something to cause the trigger to release the hammer. And yes storing it in this manner would definately fix the TRD problem. (top round deformation) As far as distance traveled and the difference between the factory and LRBHO they are close to the same distance. The bolt is held about as far back as it can be and still allow the safety to be operated. If you realease the LRBHO and let the bolt fly to be caught by the selector BHO I would not trust it to hold without applying upward pressure to the selector while the biolt is moving. Maybe if you left the notch at such an angle where it traps and holds the charging handle, but that to me, defeats the purpose of having the SWIFT style lever. IMO the main thing it's god for is to use as a bolt release rather than a bolt stop. The factory guns have that. That's why I polish mine so that they can disengage easily. I also "adjust" my selectors so they are not so hard to operate and can be done with one finger. I have a speed technique that I use incorporating the LRBHO and the selector BHO that makes mag changes much easier and faster and you can get back on target and start shooting much sooner than having to manually pull back on the charging handle (this means you don't have two hands securing the weapon). It involves bumping the ass of the gun against the ground if kneeling or against anything else around if standing...thereby releasing the bolt to the selector while still having both hands securely holding the weapon and faster target aquisition. Hell every last second or part of a second you save is good right? Blackjack used to sell a SWIFT lever that was supposed to be special for the S-12 but i couldn't find it when I looked at the site today. The one in the pics on the 12 is one of those. I trimmed it like that for my own technique but it isn't required to be able to use with the regular or LRBHO. On the Swift lever the bolt is held a little farther forward than it is by the BHOs, not too far but some. One thing I was disapointed about was the scratch is still made in a different place than the factory selector even though it was supposed be a special S-12 thing. I also had to trim a small bit off the top rear corner where it was hitting the receiver cover and not allowing it to travel up far enough to fully hold the charging handle. But it's normal to have to fit some parts like that and anyone working on their own guns needs to be prepared for stuff like that. It's still a great product. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nycGUNguy 61 Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 (edited) Cobra and dinzag have the right idea. All my AKs have the notch cut out for the bolt handle courtesy of me and my trusty 12,000 angle grinder(being a shipyard electrician for Electric Boat really helped my grinding and welding skills even though I wish I had a TIG instead of a MIG welder). My s-20 and s-12 both have BHOs so I just added the finger foot like Cobra's. Why buy if you can make it yourself just as good if not better? PS These are early pictures. The s-12 is my brother's with no BHO, that's why I notched it. Edited May 17, 2007 by nyclu3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted May 17, 2007 Report Share Posted May 17, 2007 The wife's S-.410 didn't have a BHO, so I notched her safty lever. However she dosn't use it. Her idea of weapons storage for HD is mag in gun, chamber empty, bolt home, safty off. This is the simplest way to go. Grab gun,rack bolt,do what is needed. We do keep 9 steel hulls in the 10rd mag, no spring or deformity issues that way. Same way I keep my S-12. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Federal_Depot 0 Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 Yes that has been done often. Blackjack sells them and so do others. You can make your own if you have the tools. Cobra, What tools do you recomend for making the BHO on a S12? +1 on what dinzag said about the scratch. I use a dremel and a #420 cutoff wheel, then clean it up with a small sanding drum. You can change the contour to grab the charging handle in different ways. If you leave it sharp and perpendicular at the top of the cutout (where it actually holds the bolt back) it will hold it more firmly and lessen the chance of it accidently disengaging. I experimented with rounding that part slightly and polishing it smooth with the rubber type polishing wheel on the dremel until I can release the bolt by applying slight downward pressure on the selector. I like this option because you can keep it back til you are ready to shoot, then just aim, flick it off with a quick tap of your trigger finger, then it chambers a round and you can commence firing. I've got my 410 set up this way. It does have the tab on the side but you can do the same thing by adding something to the side of your factory selector that you can grab with your finger. I've seen some people use a long pop rivet for this. (Maybe someone will post a pic?) If you have really long fingers you can just use the built in tab at the front but for me that means having to release part of my grip on the PG to reach forward. The idea behind Blackjack's "S.W.I.F.T." lever (Safety With Integrated Finger Tab) is you can release it like that with your hand still firmly gripping the PG. http://www.blackjackbuffers.com/index.php?...products_id=202 Be sure and read this... http://www.blackjackbuffers.com/index.php?...age=swift_lever My 410... This is a blackjack SWIFT lever that I modified to work better with the LRBHO. By removing material all the way back I was able to push up the selector after the LRBHO locked the bolt all the way back, then if held there I could release the bolt to the SWIFT lever and be able to aim start firing as soon as I disengaged the safety with my trigger finger. That is a most excellent picture tutorial Cobra. Looks like I have to save it with along with your S12 picture conversion thread from the tech forum Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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