triggerhappy2491 0 Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 If my saiga is right out of the box, does it mean I can't use anything more than the 10 round mag unless I modify it? Why is that? How do I know how to properly modify it? Where can I go for advice? The only gunsmith I know of in town is kind of a prick and not one to dole out the advice. I fail to see the reason to only allow a ten shot mag when it is unaltered. Details? Reasoning for this? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
protected static 19 Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 It's the law. It doesn't have to make sense. Check out the 922r section of the forum as well as the pinned topics in this section for more info. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kresk 10,063 Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 The rifle is imported as a 'sporting' model. Any more than ten rounds is legally not consistent with a 'sporting' purpose. There is copious information in the tech and 922r sections to explain what can and/or should be done to convert the rifle to a military configuration. Please invest some time to study this information as the majority of your questions are already answered there in detail. A gunsmith's level of talent is not required to convert them, but you can send the gun out of town to a competent smith to do it if your local doesn't suit you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
triggerhappy2491 0 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 The rifle is imported as a 'sporting' model. Any more than ten rounds is legally not consistent with a 'sporting' purpose. There is copious information in the tech and 922r sections to explain what can and/or should be done to convert the rifle to a military configuration. Please invest some time to study this information as the majority of your questions are already answered there in detail. A gunsmith's level of talent is not required to convert them, but you can send the gun out of town to a competent smith to do it if your local doesn't suit you. I read the 922r post, but 9/10ths of that was greek to me, as well as the parts people are talking about in their posts on the mods. Confusing to me, to say the least. Were would be a good place to look for modification parts? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GimmeLiberty 0 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 The rifle is imported as a 'sporting' model. Any more than ten rounds is legally not consistent with a 'sporting' purpose. There is copious information in the tech and 922r sections to explain what can and/or should be done to convert the rifle to a military configuration. Please invest some time to study this information as the majority of your questions are already answered there in detail. A gunsmith's level of talent is not required to convert them, but you can send the gun out of town to a competent smith to do it if your local doesn't suit you. I read the 922r post, but 9/10ths of that was greek to me, as well as the parts people are talking about in their posts on the mods. Confusing to me, to say the least. Were would be a good place to look for modification parts? Carolina Shooter Supply, Dinzag, any of the sponsors at the top of the forum carry conversion parts. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
imarangemaster 315 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 Easiest is to add a TAPCO t6 with SAW pistol grip. Takes 5 minutes and makes you rifle more AKish. That is 2 compliance parts. Use only US made Sure Fire or Promag high caps, and that adds three more. 922 compliant. \ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
heron 0 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 Don't feel bad; I've studied 922r for a while, and I can't make much sense of it either. It's a real pity that we're subjected to the whims of a bunch of numbnuts this way. There is hope, though. If you don't feel like doing the trigger mod, you can swap out things like the stock, forend, gas piston -- and of course, the mags themselves -- all very easy (though probably more expensive than just a trigger mod). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 Easiest is to add a TAPCO t6 with SAW pistol grip. Takes 5 minutes and makes you rifle more AKish. That is 2 compliance parts. Use only US made Sure Fire or Promag high caps, and that adds three more. 922 compliant. The easiest and cheapest way is to add a US gas piston. When using 'non sporting" US made mags, you'll be compliant. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cma g21 3 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 Easiest is to add a TAPCO t6 with SAW pistol grip. Takes 5 minutes and makes you rifle more AKish. That is 2 compliance parts. Use only US made Sure Fire or Promag high caps, and that adds three more. 922 compliant. You're right about the Tapco stock and US made mags being compliant, and Tapco Intrafuse does contain two 922r listed parts (buttstock and pistol grip), but since Saigas are imported without a pistol grip, only one counts towards compliance. It's not how many US made parts you add, it's how many 922r listed foreign parts you remove. The easiest and cheapest way is to add a US gas piston. When using 'non sporting" US made mags, you'll be compliant. I don't know if it's the easiest, but it is the cheapest. It also allows you to still use the mag that came with the gun (unlike adding the Intrafuse). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
triggerhappy2491 0 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 Easiest is to add a TAPCO t6 with SAW pistol grip. Takes 5 minutes and makes you rifle more AKish. That is 2 compliance parts. Use only US made Sure Fire or Promag high caps, and that adds three more. 922 compliant. You're right about the Tapco stock and US made mags being compliant, and Tapco Intrafuse does contain two 922r listed parts (buttstock and pistol grip), but since Saigas are imported without a pistol grip, only one counts towards compliance. It's not how many US made parts you add, it's how many 922r listed foreign parts you remove. The easiest and cheapest way is to add a US gas piston. When using 'non sporting" US made mags, you'll be compliant. I don't know if it's the easiest, but it is the cheapest. It also allows you to still use the mag that came with the gun (unlike adding the Intrafuse). Okay, so just to be clear- as I have read all the reponses- with the TAPCO t6 with SAW pistol grip (2 parts but only counts for 1) and a Surefire 30 round magazine (counts as 3 parts) I would have the nicer stock and hi-cap mag and still be compliant? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cma g21 3 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 Okay, so just to be clear- as I have read all the reponses- with the TAPCO t6 with SAW pistol grip (2 parts but only counts for 1) and a Surefire 30 round magazine (counts as 3 parts) I would have the nicer stock and hi-cap mag and still be compliant? Yes you'd be compliant, but only with the US made magazines. Once you add the pistol grip, 922r applies. So, using a foreign magazine of any capacity (including the one that came with the rifle) would not comply (unless you swap out some more parts). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
triggerhappy2491 0 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 Okay, so just to be clear- as I have read all the reponses- with the TAPCO t6 with SAW pistol grip (2 parts but only counts for 1) and a Surefire 30 round magazine (counts as 3 parts) I would have the nicer stock and hi-cap mag and still be compliant? Yes you'd be compliant, but only with the US made magazines. Once you add the pistol grip, 922r applies. So, using a foreign magazine of any capacity (including the one that came with the rifle) would not comply (unless you swap out some more parts). So I'd still need 3 more pieces swapped out to use a foreign mag, right? What would be the 3 cheapest swaps after the pistol grip is added on? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cma g21 3 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 So I'd still need 3 more pieces swapped out to use a foreign mag, right? What would be the 3 cheapest swaps after the pistol grip is added on? While it would be possible to swap out three more parts (hammer, disconnector, and piston for example) at that point you're better off just doing the full conversion. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
triggerhappy2491 0 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 So I'd still need 3 more pieces swapped out to use a foreign mag, right? What would be the 3 cheapest swaps after the pistol grip is added on? While it would be possible to swap out three more parts (hammer, disconnector, and piston for example) at that point you're better off just doing the full conversion. So I guess my next question is what exactly does "full conversion" mean, and what parts are those? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cma g21 3 Posted January 17, 2009 Report Share Posted January 17, 2009 [so I guess my next question is what exactly does "full conversion" mean, and what parts are those? It means, basically, returning it to original AK configuration. There's a whole section on it here: http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showforum=67 and you can look here: http://www.cross-conn.com/Saiga_Conversion/ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 "Full conversion" means to convert your Saiga completely back to Mr. Kalashnikovs specs. This will leave you with a rifle that looks like any other Kalashnikov. IMHO, this is very expensive and unnecessary for most folks. A "basic conversion" just involves moving the fire control group forward and adding an AK butt stock and pistol grip. This is a "basic conversion": Quote Link to post Share on other sites
triggerhappy2491 0 Posted January 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 "Full conversion" means to convert your Saiga completely back to Mr. Kalashnikovs specs. This will leave you with a rifle that looks like any other Kalashnikov. IMHO, this is very expensive and unnecessary for most folks. A "basic conversion" just involves moving the fire control group forward and adding an AK butt stock and pistol grip. This is a "basic conversion": Moving the fire control group forward? Difficult? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
nalioth 405 Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Moving the fire control group forward? Difficult?Not at all. If you can change the oil in your car, you can do this. It is that easy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
arizona98tj 0 Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Moving the fire control group forward? Difficult? Some info on doing a Saiga conversion, complete with parts list, etc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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